Is militarism the "Elephant in the room" for the US?

[WWWTT]

I came across the link and felt that this subject would make a good thread on MLW!

I strongly believe that the US at one time was a strong defender of social justice and freedom.

But since WWII,the US (in my opinion) has witnessed its social structure,position and status slowly erode,fade and crumble.

I honestly believe the US will rise again as a Phoenix from the ashes,but not anytime soon and not until they hit "Rock Bottom"

Has the US hit "Rock Bottom" yet?Will they ever?

Here's the link

https://www.commondreams.org/view/2013/04/09-1#.UWrF68xp120.facebook

WWWTT

[GostHacked]

They will hit rock bottom as we see with other countries around the world. The USA cannot keep spending the money they do on the military without a Soviet-like crunch time happening soon. The USA is spending more than the next 20 countries combined. The daily operations of the military runs in the billions.

Wonder why the USA is 16 trillion in debt? Over a decade of wars fighting the war on terror which many see as an absolute failure which would seem to spawn more terrorists than moderates.

I want to know if the bank bail outs are also tied into this equation.

It's also the militarization of local police forces. But the media has a huge role in this in that there seems to be a concerted effort among the news agencies to keep important items suppressed. This is why trials like Jodi Arias are plastered all over the TV when in the every day of things, it is a non story. it's been over sensationalized, while the recent actions in Syria have been pushed out of the spotlight.

One major reason why people are looking to independent media more and more. They are not paid/controlled by their sponsors giving them free reign to talk about the things that are important and have huge impacts on our lives.

I would say it's more than militarism, because when corporations are working this close to government is essentially fascism. IN the case of the USA it is corporate-fascism.

Just my observations.

[Canuckistani]

The US has nowhree near hit rock bottom, it has a lot further to fall. Can't be bothered to follow your link and you don't explain how militarism relates to the topic. After WWII, the US stood alone at the top of the pile. It's factories were intact, it dominated the world, and the living was easy. This can't last forever. The world has caught up with the US, while the US way over reached. Trying to run the Vietnam war and a war on poverty at the same time started the downslide. The oilshocks cracked the foundations. Corporate and individula greed finished the job.

[GostHacked]

16 trillion in debt and no way to pay it off is not rock bottom? How far down is the bottom?

[Bonam]

16 trillion in debt and no way to pay it off is not rock bottom? How far down is the bottom?

Much, much farther. Rock bottom is third world country / failed state status, secession of multiple states into various groups to form their own independent nations, and bloody tribal warfare between said new nations. A negative number on a computer screen, by comparison, is pretty much nothing.

As for the link, it says that US military/foreign policy practices are rarely questioned/debated/condemned in the media, which is so false a claim as to be utterly absurd. Further, take a look at the chart below. I don't think for a country that wants to be the world's leading military power that a 19% investment in defense is unreasonable. Also, the quote used in the OP's article that the US spends more on defense than on social programs is obviously not applicable to the present budget.

[Michael Hardner]

I came across the link and felt that this subject would make a good thread on MLW!

I strongly believe that the US at one time was a strong defender of social justice and freedom.

But since WWII,the US (in my opinion) has witnessed its social structure,position and status slowly erode,fade and crumble.

I honestly believe the US will rise again as a Phoenix from the ashes,but not anytime soon and not until they hit "Rock Bottom"

Has the US hit "Rock Bottom" yet?Will they ever?

Here's the link

https://www.commondreams.org/view/2013/04/09-1#.UWrF68xp120.facebook

WWWTT

People have been predicting the demise of the US for a long time, but this article is about the 'elephant in the room' especially as journalists have "lost their voices" over Obama, and the drone wars.

This is about lobbying, make no mistakes. The multi billion dollar arms industry buys out government and helps fan the flames of security fears to keep the beast fed.

It is at the point where the US is so over-equipped that they are now blamed for not acting to step in to situations that have nothing to do with them.

[WWWTT]

Thanks Micheal for asking me to clarify my position since I had only implied.

I feel that the US must make drastic cuts to military spending,then redirect the money into domestic social spending.

Social spending and focusing on infrastructure is in my opinion nurturing the economic base/fundamentals of the country and neglect to do so will hurt the overall output and health.

And yes the link that I have provided is not an exact match to my thread,but I feel it is related enough to post and start engaging a debate.

WWWTT

[WWWTT]

Thanks for posting this.

I have heard and seen similar pie charts in the past (sorry I can not post them now) showing similar numbers.

But I had also heard that the charts are misleading because a significant amount spent on education and health care is actually done through or with the military.

Other mandatory and the Discretionary sections I find questionable as well.

WWWTT

[Michael Hardner]

Here's something to support the point:

http://www.wlox.com/story/21759852/retired

ACKSON, MS (Mississippi News Now) -

As lawmakers make final adjustments to education packages at the capitol, three of Mississippi's military leaders are asking they pay close attention to what's currently lacking.

"Early childhood education has shown it can provide a foundation in which to build upon," said Retired Brigadier General Robert Crear of the U.S. Army.

The US Military itself realizes that it eats funding to the degree that more is needed for social programs.

[TimG]

But I had also heard that the charts are misleading because a significant amount spent on education and health care is actually done through or with the military.

Also - Health and education are powers reserved for states in the US so any spending break down that does not incorporate state spending is a useless basis for any conclusions. Edited April 14, 2013 by TimG

[Canuckistani]

16 trillion in debt and no way to pay it off is not rock bottom? How far down is the bottom?

Greece is getting closer to the bottom. Congo is the bottom.

[ReeferMadness]

Thanks Micheal for asking me to clarify my position since I had only implied.

I feel that the US must make drastic cuts to military spending,then redirect the money into domestic social spending.

Social spending and focusing on infrastructure is in my opinion nurturing the economic base/fundamentals of the country and neglect to do so will hurt the overall output and health.

And yes the link that I have provided is not an exact match to my thread,but I feel it is related enough to post and start engaging a debate.

WWWTT

The US is in a position where it both must and cannot make drastic cuts to military spending. If it doesn't, its fiscal position will continue to swirl down the metaphorical toilet bowl. If it does, the hacking will result in a recession that will send its fiscal position down the metaphorical toilet bowl. Also, bear in mind that military spending is a mechanism to allow the government to subsidize industry R&D (public investment for private profit) to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars. What happens to that yankee ingenuity when Uncle Sam stops footing the bill?

Until the economic structures start to be built on reality, the US has a bleak future. And the rest of the world too.

[GostHacked]

The US is in a position where it both must and cannot make drastic cuts to military spending. If it doesn't, its fiscal position will continue to swirl down the metaphorical toilet bowl. If it does, the hacking will result in a recession that will send its fiscal position down the metaphorical toilet bowl. Also, bear in mind that military spending is a mechanism to allow the government to subsidize industry R&D (public investment for private profit) to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars. What happens to that yankee ingenuity when Uncle Sam stops footing the bill?

Until the economic structures start to be built on reality, the US has a bleak future. And the rest of the world too.

So it would be hard to talk about militarism without knowing the cost and the relationship many of these companies have with the government. I can see the damned if you do, damned if you don't.

The USA used to be a great place of ingenuity, but it seems now they concentrated that ingenuity on making weapons to kill.

The drone program is one I have been hearing about since the 80s. The USA has always been hot to get the pilot out of the seat and have ROVs goin around. Now that they have done it, what did it actually take for these drones to come about? Where did it start? Who was involved? How much is the total cost now? How is it all getting paid for?

No wonder it's called the Military Industrial 'Complex' ... not so simple!