Immigrant's qualities

[Black Dog]

if he is of no use to Canada he shouldn't be welcome here. I am tired of Canada being a welfare dumping ground for the worlds garbage. These people are laughing at us for our laws. Giving everything away to people who have done nothing to support it. Canada is a joke to the world.

If he had stayed in Afghanistan, he could have killed his wife and probably got away with it. Here, he is being held to account for his crimes and his children have a chance to learn another way. You don't really care about the victims here at all.

[Mr.Canada]

If he had stayed in Afghanistan, he could have killed his wife and probably got away with it. Here, he is being held to account for his crimes and his children have a chance to learn another way. You don't really care about the victims here at all.

Sorry but people need to learn our laws before coming to Canada and respect them or be deported after serving sentence and stripped of citizenship. Will this guy even be deported?

[Black Dog]

Sorry but people need to learn our laws before coming to Canada and respect them or be deported after serving sentence and stripped of citizenship. Will this guy even be deported?

Yes, let's deport him to a country where he won't have to actually pay for his crimes. Justice!

[Mr.Canada]

Yes, let's deport him to a country where he won't have to actually pay for his crimes. Justice!

Or avoid the situation altogether by not letting come here in the first place.

[Black Dog]

Or avoid the situation altogether by not letting come here in the first place.

Avoid the situation of us having to deal with it. Doesn't help his wife or daughters though. Not that you care.

[Mr.Canada]

Avoid the situation of us having to deal with it. Doesn't help his wife or daughters though. Not that you care.

I don't understand why it's Canadas responsibility to teach these people to not kill their wives and daughters even if they happen to kill a few while in Canada. This is just senseless to me. I'm trying to understand it, I really am.

[Black Dog]

I don't understand why it's Canadas responsibility to teach these people to not kill their wives and daughters even if they happen to kill a few while in Canada. This is just senseless to me. I'm trying to understand it, I really am.

If they kill in Canada, they get punished for it. Those who hold backwards views might get a chance to see other ways and why they are wrong before they kill. Women who live in these cultures can also have the chance to escape them and learn to live other ways that they would be denied otherwise.

Every time you and your ilk point to honour killings that happen here in Canada as proof that these immigrants can't assimilate seem to ignore the fact that many times they occur because of a family members desire to assimilate. Rather than punish the perpetrators of such crimes and send the message that we have different values, you would keep them all out, leaving the people who might have a better chance here to languish under their oppressive culture at home. Clearly, you don't really care about the women and children in these scenarios.

[Mr.Canada]

If they kill in Canada, they get punished for it. Those who hold backwards views might get a chance to see other ways and why they are wrong before they kill. Women who live in these cultures can also have the chance to escape them and learn to live other ways that they would be denied otherwise.

Every time you and your ilk point to honour killings that happen here in Canada as proof that these immigrants can't assimilate seem to ignore the fact that many times they occur because of a family members desire to assimilate. Rather than punish the perpetrators of such crimes and send the message that we have different values, you would keep them all out, leaving the people who might have a better chance here to languish under their oppressive culture at home. Clearly, you don't really care about the women and children in these scenarios.

Those women would be welcome but not the men then. We must do a better job educating the immigrant before they land on our shores that their women might get crazy in Canada and want to dress in western fashion and might want to date boys. Murdering them or stabbing them or hitting them as punishment is not acceptable in Canada.

We need to start being more clear and stop making everything as politically correct as possible. Some cultures find it acceptable to hurt, maim or kill women in their family who disobey the man, this is n't ok in Canada and they must be taught that or stay in their own homeland.

[guyser]

Those women would be welcome but not the men then. We must do a better job educating the immigrant before they land on our shores that their women might get crazy in Canada and want to dress in western fashion and might want to date boys. Murdering them or stabbing them or hitting them as punishment is not acceptable in Canada.

They already know that,

We need to start being more clear and stop making everything as politically correct as possible. Some cultures find it acceptable to hurt, maim or kill women in their family who disobey the man, this is n't ok in Canada and they must be taught that or stay in their own homeland.

They are taught that. If they dont learn, well they are arrested.

PC was never on the docket.

Now what?

[Black Dog]

Those women would be welcome but not the men then. We must do a better job educating the immigrant before they land on our shores that their women might get crazy in Canada and want to dress in western fashion and might want to date boys. Murdering them or stabbing them or hitting them as punishment is not acceptable in Canada.

We need to start being more clear and stop making everything as politically correct as possible. Some cultures find it acceptable to hurt, maim or kill women in their family who disobey the man, this is n't ok in Canada and they must be taught that or stay in their own homeland.

I'm all for spending a little bit more to ensure we get the most out of our immigrants, including skills training, recognizing qualifications, language skills and even citizenship expectations. "Let them kill their wives and daughters over there, not here" is not an approach that appeals to me and it's one of the consequences of being stricter when it comes to values-based immigration policies.

Edited October 17, 2012 by Black Dog

[Guest Peeves]

The irony here is that, if it were up to you, this guy's kids would be stuck in Afghanistan, living a far worse life than they are able to here. So i have to wonder who it is you're trying to protect. It's certainly not the wives and children in situations like these.

That's far from irony, in fact it smacks of deliberate misdirection.Perhaps you have been confused by the other issues that OTHERS have brought up.

I don't think I suggested anywhere that any should lose their rights as immigrants, nor to be deported, nor to be stuck in Afghanistan.

I posed a question and offered my opinion., to wit

I wonder if anyone else has trouble with this family being accepted as immigrants in Canada?

_{A now murderer, Illiterate immigrant who is broke, can't speak English, with several (6) children, with a wife who had t.b and is an epileptic. (now murdered).}

_{"they arrived in Canada from India, where they had lived after leaving Afghanistan. The couple failed to learn English, despite taking English as a second language classes for a full year, the daughter said.}

_{Her mother suffered from epilepsy, and had tuberculosis. Both she and her husband were on disability benefits and money was running short."}

It certainly is NOT the type I'd choose. After all, there are ramifications that cost the taxpayer...and now certainly the costs will multiply.

[Mr.Canada]

They already know that,

They are taught that. If they dont learn, well they are arrested.

PC was never on the docket.

Now what?

how can you be certain that they already know that? Did you tell each and every one of them personally that you may not kill, maim or hit your wives and girlfriends? Who told them that and were they directly told or in some sort of round about politically correct way?

I want to see the pamphlet or whatever is given to immigrants telling them not to kill, hit or maim their women. If someone is telling them this then who is responsible for telling them?

These people here "multiculturalism" and think hey great my culture as it is is welcome in Canada I don't need to change a thing. This is wrong and dangerous and women are being killed because of it. The women want to assimilate and their men will not allow it and would rather kill them for trying to be Canadian.

If they cannot follow Canadian Laws they aren't welcome here. Why do you lefties argue with that? You want criminals living in Canada?

[jacee]

Some cultures find it acceptable to hurt, maim or kill women in their family who disobey the man, this is n't ok in Canada and they must be taught that or stay in their own homeland.

I think you'd better teach yourself first.

[Black Dog]

If they cannot follow Canadian Laws they aren't welcome here. Why do you lefties argue with that? You want criminals living in Canada?

If they cannot follow Canadian laws, they are punished for it. What's the problem?

[Mr.Canada]

If they cannot follow Canadian laws, they are punished for it. What's the problem?

the problem is that it can be avoided by not bringing people to Canada who harbor such attitudes. We are going to have more and more Omar Khadr's if we do. people who come here but dislike everything about Canada raising their children to hate the west then sending them off to the middle east to be trained t o kill westerners.

We need people with money not poor people who hate women.

[Black Dog]

the problem is that it can be avoided by not bringing people to Canada who harbor such attitudes.

So you'd rather they just kill their wives and daughters over there so you can't see it and where they can get away with it?

Edited October 17, 2012 by Black Dog

[Guest Peeves]

If they kill in Canada, they get punished for it. Those who hold backwards views might get a chance to see other ways and why they are wrong before they kill. Women who live in these cultures can also have the chance to escape them and learn to live other ways that they would be denied otherwise.

We don't need nor should we accept those with 'backward' views (your term),if those backwatrd views include things that conflict with our codes and laws. That should be obvious.

Every time you and your ilk point to honour killings that happen here in Canada as proof that these immigrants can't assimilate seem to ignore the fact that many times they occur because of a family members desire to assimilate. Rather than punish the perpetrators of such crimes and send the message that we have different values, you would keep them all out, leaving the people who might have a better chance here to languish under their oppressive culture at home. Clearly, you don't really care about the women and children in these scenarios.

Clearly we as a country/tax payers/democracy/Western values/moral codes and immigration laws that restrict certain oppressive cultures, have an obligation and every right to disallow unacceptable applicants. Your position is what? We should accept them because they need educating on their cultural offenses.? We have no obligation to accept any but those that fit our qualifications.

On refugees, they must show they are legitimate and worthy and meet any test on refugees that are applicable. Now it sure would be nice, shucks even generous and possibly asinine. to expect Canada...Canadians, to alleviate all the suffering of those under oppressive regimes or cultures. I suggest that you and your ilk take the first hundred thousand under your wing and ...support.

[Mr.Canada]

So you'd rather they just kill their wives and daughters over there so you can't see it and where they can get away with it?

if they stayed over there I doubt they would even be killed because the y wouldn't be trying to break free, they wouldn't know what they were missing.

[Guest Peeves]

So you'd rather they just kill their wives and daughters over there so you can't see it and where they can get away with it?

In a word, YES! Since it's their problem and beyond our means to correct it anymore than the dowry murders or FGM or sharia law forbiding womens rights

[Black Dog]

We don't need nor should we accept those with 'backward' views (your term),if those backwatrd views include things that conflict with our codes and laws. That should be obvious.

And we don't. Again: where's the problem?

Clearly we as a country/tax payers/democracy/Western values/moral codes and immigration laws that restrict certain oppressive cultures, have an obligation and every right to disallow unacceptable applicants. Your position is what? We should accept them because they need educating on their cultural offenses.? We have no obligation to accept any but those that fit our qualifications.

My position is that disallowing these people has unintended consequences for the people you claim to be defending. But out of sight, out of mind, eh?

[Black Dog]

if they stayed over there I doubt they would even be killed because the y wouldn't be trying to break free, they wouldn't know what they were missing.

oh well, that's much better.

In a word, YES! Since it's their problem and beyond our means to correct it anymore than the dowry murders or FGM or sharia law forbiding womens rights

I'll give you points for honestly stating you don't give a shit about women over there.

[Mr.Canada]

oh well, that's much better.

Better than being dead. Or do you see these dead women as some sort of martyrs? I still say education is the key.

[Guest Peeves]

if they stayed over there I doubt they would even be killed because the y wouldn't be trying to break free, they wouldn't know what they were missing.

Not wholey true. The young women with the assassination attempt or the young women that had acid thrown in their face at school know what they are missing. but there aren't enough dollars or good works available to change that in their world. It's their country/custom/culture/religion and only THEY can change it.

As soon as 'we' try, 'we' get accused of empire building, infringing on other countries governments. Setting up favorable dictators etc.

The Western countries have too often thought or have been expected to feel guilty for the world's suffering people. It's totally irrational for any to expect 'we' must change the billions that follow their own paths

[Black Dog]

Better than being dead. Or do you see these dead women as some sort of martyrs? I still say education is the key.

As I said: over there, they can get murdered and no one will do anything about it. In some cases, it's the state doing the killing.

[jacee]

the problem is that it can be avoided by not bringing people to Canada who harbor such attitudes.

Question for you, and maybe peeves can answer it too:

How would you identify the men who might murder wives/daughters, in the immigration process before they come to Canada?

Is what you're proposing even possible?

How would you deny immigration to potential wife killers, without denying immigration to any innocent people?

Edited October 17, 2012 by jacee