Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) I'm pretty much disgusted with the lot. Why must our tax payers, those that elected officials, to have to beg and pray and petition for our due. These hospitals and their services are OURS! We paid for them, some of us through payroll deductions when canvassed when they were built. These are our hospitals, not NH Systems or Dr. Smiths or the Dalton camp wastrels. The &^%*$#&@! Ministry of Health works for US, you and me, not for the lousy *&(^%$#! Provincial government that pisses away millions moving power plants like chess pieces for votes and a billion $$$$ here a billion $$$$ there on e-Health-Ornge etc. We shouldn't need to petition anyone. Our elected agents should be getting us what we tell them to get. No less! We should be demanding our right to our hospitals and OUR services or getting resignations from those not serving their public tax payers. With all good intentions a few like Campion and Health Care Committee are working for our RIGHTS. All well and good, but if those politicians that represent us can't maintain our opportunity to go to and be treated at OUR LOCAL hospitals, then there should be mass resignations called for! Imagine a citizen like Doris Miller in Ridgeway having to beg for health services due us and available now for a generation. Now we are expected to roll over because some political appointment has an opinion! An opinion that should ONLY be OUR choice. Do we let those appointed by the likes of the incompetent Dalton (now there's a winner!) determine OUR needs! NO! And we whine and we beg and petition and pray and that will get us nothing with those we elected unless there's a consequence held over their collective heads. And, my oh my "Forster calls for public input" boundary's for electoral ridings on the fear of losing some leftist voters in Thorold. Forster fears we are not aware. Is she aware of the cries for help by those like Doris Miller in Ridgeway ? I'm sure voters that lose health services and hospitals know full well who to blame and who has served them and who to vote for. Is she aware that the boundary's of her current NDP riding have lost most of the their industrial base ALL while her party has been our representative government in power ? Stand and be counted elected officials, you have a job to do, OUR wishes. St Catharine's (not NDP), has got the plum and we demand that we get to keep what we have, that which has settled out,the dregs if you will after St Catharines, but our bought and paid for dregs. Edited October 7, 2012 by Peeves Quote
Michael Hardner Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 Can you post a link or something so we can understand what you are talking about? Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 Sure. This has been in hot dispute for a few years regionally.. Nigara Falls-Welland -Fort Erie - Port Colborne, Thorold, and St Catharines. Not of much interest otherwise elsewhere. But, I needed to rant. http://www.niagarathisweek.com/news/article/1515058--health-care-fight-hits-the-street Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 http://www.stcatharinesstandard.ca/2012/09/14/build-new-hospital-in-falls-nhs-supervisor Quote
Topaz Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 Peeve, correct me if I'm wrong but, you are against the Liberals, understandly,you don't say bad things about the NDP, so that leave the Tories,don't you rmember what the Tories did to health care in Ontario?? Now, with Harper saying he going to be cutting health transfer down to 3-6% from 20%, ALL hospitals are going to be in trouble and no doubt some will be force to close, probably in small communities. I don't know what the answer is, except listen to each party and hope they are telling us the truth on where they stand on healthcare. We definitely NEED to bring those cost down. Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 Peeve, correct me if I'm wrong but, you are against the Liberals, understandly,you don't say bad things about the NDP, so that leave the Tories,don't you rmember what the Tories did to health care in Ontario?? Now, with Harper saying he going to be cutting health transfer down to 3-6% from 20%, ALL hospitals are going to be in trouble and no doubt some will be force to close, probably in small communities. I don't know what the answer is, except listen to each party and hope they are telling us the truth on where they stand on healthcare. We definitely NEED to bring those cost down. NDP in my post..."Forster calls for public input" boundary's for electoral ridings on the fear of losing some leftist voters in Thorold. Forster fears we are not aware. Is she aware of the cries for help by those like Doris Miller in Ridgeway ? I'm sure voters that lose health services and hospitals know full well who to blame and who has served them and who to vote for. Is she aware that the boundary's of her current NDP riding have lost most of the their industrial base ALL while her party has been our representative government in power ?" Of course our health care costs must be reduced and a two tier system is the answer. Our system is far and away worse than some in Europe. We need a revamping a reformation of our health care system. Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 Neithe Canada nor the USA ranks in the top 25. http://thepatientfactor.com/canadian-health-care-information/world-health-organizations-ranking-of-the-worlds-health-systems/ Quote
Topaz Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 I think the province should give the natural health sector more of a role in health care, like the other doctors. They do go to school for 4 years and there is a need for them . Some people can`t take drugs because of the sides effect but can with the natural substances and being natural, they help the body to improve itself, unlike the man-made drugs with the side effect to the body. Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 I go to the emergency room with a problem and the waiting time to see a doctor is 4 hrs. minimum. Lie on a hard gurney with a bad back for 4 + hours. The ambulance and attendants can't leave either because you're not accepted by the hospital for an hour or more after arrival. Several ambulances are tied up all the time. If you call for an ambulance both fire and ambulance show up. If you're a pro athlete you get preferential treatment. Anyone with funds can get immediate care in the USA. We need to wake up! Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 I think the province should give the natural health sector more of a role in health care, like the other doctors. They do go to school for 4 years and there is a need for them . Some people can`t take drugs because of the sides effect but can with the natural substances and being natural, they help the body to improve itself, unlike the man-made drugs with the side effect to the body. Not the way I'd go. Homeopathy is very dangerous and very lucrative for snake oil salesmen. Quote
CPCFTW Posted October 7, 2012 Report Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) Now, with Harper saying he going to be cutting health transfer down to 3-6% from 20%, ALL hospitals are going to be in trouble and no doubt some will be force to close, probably in small communities. Ummmm.... what? You seriously think health transfers increased by 20%/yr before Harper? Your Harper hate-on has gone a little too far methinks. Edited October 7, 2012 by CPCFTW Quote
dre Posted October 8, 2012 Report Posted October 8, 2012 I go to the emergency room with a problem and the waiting time to see a doctor is 4 hrs. minimum. Lie on a hard gurney with a bad back for 4 + hours. The ambulance and attendants can't leave either because you're not accepted by the hospital for an hour or more after arrival. Several ambulances are tied up all the time. If you call for an ambulance both fire and ambulance show up. If you're a pro athlete you get preferential treatment. Anyone with funds can get immediate care in the USA. We need to wake up! Iv visited the ER 3 times in the last 10 years and never waited more than 15 minutes. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Guest Peeves Posted October 8, 2012 Report Posted October 8, 2012 Good for you. From my own and family experience in Niagara it's 4-5 hours and takes an hour + sometimes to get admitted so the ambulance that brought you can get back on call duty. Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 25, 2012 Report Posted October 25, 2012 Peeve, correct me if I'm wrong but, you are against the Liberals, understandly,you don't say bad things about the NDP, so that leave the Tories,don't you rmember what the Tories did to health care in Ontario?? Now, with Harper saying he going to be cutting health transfer down to 3-6% from 20%, ALL hospitals are going to be in trouble and no doubt some will be force to close, probably in small communities. I don't know what the answer is, except listen to each party and hope they are telling us the truth on where they stand on healthcare. We definitely NEED to bring those cost down. i want our government to accept the need of tiered systems like those in Europe. I'm fed up with our lousy health care and the costs for inefficiency. Quote
guyser Posted October 25, 2012 Report Posted October 25, 2012 i want our government to accept the need of tiered systems like those in Europe. I'm fed up with our lousy health care and the costs for inefficiency. I dont. No need to IME. As for the innefficiency ,yes that is something one needs to imporve upon. But how is the problem. Quote
Fletch 27 Posted October 25, 2012 Report Posted October 25, 2012 Inneficiencies can be removed 100 percent by making the option of private health-care possible... Again, to silence the left,,it should be an OPTION... made by an educated decision and weighing of resources... Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 26, 2012 Report Posted October 26, 2012 Inneficiencies can be removed 100 percent by making the option of private health-care possible... Again, to silence the left,,it should be an OPTION... made by an educated decision and weighing of resources... Agreed. The screams against it no longer hold water given the success in other climes with facts readily available. Quote
guyser Posted October 26, 2012 Report Posted October 26, 2012 Inneficiencies can be removed 100 percent by making the option of private health-care possible... Please show us how. Quote
Fletch 27 Posted October 26, 2012 Report Posted October 26, 2012 Oh, Guyser guyser, I dont need to, The WHO (World health Organization) will! "Like the UK, France a two-tier healthcare system, with a state-run equivalent of the NHS - Couverture Maladie Universelle (CMU) - and the private sector. In 2000, the World Health Organisation said it ran the best national healthcare system" Its rather simple but goes agains every principle of the left. It allows those who do not have the means to obtain the BEST possible medical treatement via a public pool (As we do now in Canada). For those who would rather choose thier own medical facility for any reason (affiliation, faith, ease-of-use, etc) they can pay for it. Now follow along here... When they (30-40 percent) choose thier OWN funded system (outta the wallet) they DEAPRT that tax-payer funded system opening up beds and creating efficiencies in all manners from paper to warm-body resources. If hat didnt assist you, simply go to the WHO web-site. a 2 Tiered system WORKS and works BETTER than all others. Dat, be da facts.. Quote
guyser Posted October 26, 2012 Report Posted October 26, 2012 (edited) Oh, Guyser guyser, I dont need to, You mean you wont? Ok, now that I understand. Dat, be da facts.. Im looking but cannot find a single fact anywhere. No surprise. The issue, as you present it, is if we have two tier then every single problem with health care efficiency is no longer, EVERY SINGLE INEFFICIENCY.....but anyone knows that isnt true nor can be,. France, yes , great system. Would love to have plenty of what they have going for them medically wise.....However.... Lets look at France ... 212,000 sq miles Canada 3,855,000. Meh....almost close enough to be twins. Population density....France 118 per sq k vs Canada 3. Of course there are large tracts of land no one lives in so that skews the results, but pretty fair to say most people who love quoting France as our target are not thinking things through, hell , some of them think inefficiencies can be eradicated simply by getting another tier ! Edited October 26, 2012 by guyser Quote
Fletch 27 Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 Ahem... Your aware that healthcare is an ontario issue? Not canada wide funding? Now how big is France compared to ontario? That's right my friend. Apples to apples. Yes, again, let me direct you to the who..... And not the "band". Quote
Guest Peeves Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 (edited) You mean you wont? Ok, now that I understand. Im looking but cannot find a single fact anywhere. No surprise. The issue, as you present it, is if we have two tier then every single problem with health care efficiency is no longer, EVERY SINGLE INEFFICIENCY.....but anyone knows that isnt true nor can be,. France, yes , great system. Would love to have plenty of what they have going for them medically wise.....However.... Lets look at France ... 212,000 sq miles Canada 3,855,000. Meh....almost close enough to be twins. Population density....France 118 per sq k vs Canada 3. Of course there are large tracts of land no one lives in so that skews the results, but pretty fair to say most people who love quoting France as our target are not thinking things through, hell , some of them think inefficiencies can be eradicated simply by getting another tier ! In my reading Ontario fails pretty badly compared to France. Bring in Canada as a whole for argument and I suppose Europe would have to be examined comparatively. I think I read that several countries..Germany etc. have better systems of health care? My experience is only with Ontario and South Carolina. In South Carolina My wife had a doctor within minutes of arrival at hospital in the evening. She had a specialist exam within 3 hours of admission. In Ontario, she laid on a gurney (ambulance) for over an hour before admission to E.R. then waited 4 hours for the one E room doctor to see her. Wonder why I think we have lousy H.C.? I have on two occasions myself waited in the E.R. for 4 + hours before being seen by the one doctor on hand. That was in St. Catharines if you are interested. Edited October 27, 2012 by Peeves Quote
Michael Hardner Posted October 27, 2012 Report Posted October 27, 2012 We've been over this before, including the anecdote wars regarding ER services. See CIHI - they have the stats. Quote Click to learn why Climate Change is caused by HUMANS Michael Hardner
guyser Posted October 29, 2012 Report Posted October 29, 2012 Ahem... Your aware that healthcare is an ontario issue? Yes, and Im aware healthcare is an issue in BC Alta Sask Man Qu NB PEI NS and Nfld not to mention Yu NWT and Nunavut. Not canada wide funding? Now how big is France compared to ontario? That's right my friend. Apples to apples. Yes, again, let me direct you to the who..... And not the "band". Ont ario is 5 times the size of France, density of Ontario is 13.4 vs 118. Apples to apples is comparing countries, not one country to anothers region. Quote
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