Should we rework the equalization payments for the provinces?

[Smallc]

Well, yes, never is a long time.

[westguy]

smallc - I thought you said above that you would stop

[jbg]

Typing on my phone cut me some slack. Seriously this is what you bring to the conversation? Nothing thanks.

I am sorry. I wasn't thinking that you were the post author. I know you usually post well even if we agree about nothing.

[jbg]

Quebec puts out all government communications only in French (except, like the case of schools, where they have to offer English services) and their official language is French. I

Wrong.

Where they can make money the government in Quebec has no trouble putting out communications in both languages. Examples are literature in what they call "National Parks" (really provincial parks) and the tour or the Assemblie National. My wife and I took the tour in English, which is offered on the half-hour.

[Smallc]

Where they can make money the government in Quebec has no trouble putting out communications in both languages. Examples are literature in what they call "National Parks" (really provincial parks) and the tour or the Assemblie National. My wife and I took the tour in English, which is offered on the half-hour.

I took the tour too, and that's not what I'm talking about.

[Smallc]

smallc - I thought you said above that you would stop

Different poster.

[westguy]

my mistake and apologies

[jbg]

I took the tour too, and that's not what I'm talking about.

You had said that the Government of Quebec puts everything out in French only except for education. I was pointing out that the facts are to the contrary; when it's convenient for them.

[Smallc]

Essential services are in both languages, as are tourist things. Businesses should be able to operate in any language.

[shortlived]

equalization should be ended along with income tax.

Medicare should be solved by the federal government making an insurance crown corp and making health insurance a plan option.

[jbg]

equalization should be ended along with income tax.

I could just imagine Quebec voting for that one.

Medicare should be solved by the federal government making an insurance crown corp and making health insurance a plan option.

Watch everyone from 25-40 drop off and the program becomes unsustainably expensive.

[shortlived]

I could just imagine Quebec voting for that one.

Watch everyone from 25-40 drop off and the program becomes unsustainably expensive.

Well doesn't Quebec want its own everything, they'll love the Quebec Equalization Program. They can take money from Montreal and give it to Quebec City while taking money from Hull and giving it to Chicoutimi.

But yes I think they would sex me for no Canadian income taxes the rest is like selling cotton Candy to a cotton candy lover.

Edited February 6, 2013 by shortlived

[cybercoma]

I could just imagine Quebec voting for that one.

Watch everyone from 25-40 drop off and the program becomes unsustainably expensive.

Not only that, but why should medical care be tied to employment? Pretty unethical if you ask me.

[punked]

I am sorry. I wasn't thinking that you were the post author. I know you usually post well even if we agree about nothing.

NP I understand and respect you because your ideas are always well thought out and have some backing.

[cybercoma]

Always? Like that thread where he supports Israel's eugenics program against African immigrants?

[westguy]

the survey at the top of this topic suggest that the majority want the equaliztion system changed.. I suggest that it is unfair.

[guyser]

the survey at the top of this topic suggest that the majority want the equaliztion system changed.. I suggest that .....

...most have no clue.

[cybercoma]

the survey at the top of this topic suggest that the majority want the equaliztion system changed.. I suggest that it is unfair.

A poll of 166 people on a web forum is hardly a sound statistical device for making population inferences.

[jbg]

Well doesn't Quebec want its own everything, they'll love the Quebec Equalization Program. They can take money from Montreal and give it to Quebec City while taking money from Hull and giving it to Chicoutimi.

Where should all that money from the Ungava Peninsula go?

[Paradox]

I really don't think that it's necessary to rework the equalisation program.

I think where the issue comes from is a mischaracterisation of what the program actually does. You hear a number of people, commonly conservatives, arguing that the richer provinces are being forced to "pay" for the subsidies of the less advantaged provinces. This really is not how the program works; the entire thing is paid for out of general revenues raised by the federal government. These richer provinces are not invoiced for equalisation; it does not factor into provincial budgeting at all, in fact.

I think it makes perfect sense to help less advantaged provinces maintain levels of public services comparable to other provinces, so that all Canadians have roughly the same access to social services. There are some variances to this, of course, based on the actual management of programs by individual provincial governments, but the principle is, in my view, a sound one.

[jbg]

I really don't think that it's necessary to rework the equalisation program.

I think where the issue comes from is a mischaracterisation of what the program actually does. You hear a number of people, commonly conservatives, arguing that the richer provinces are being forced to "pay" for the subsidies of the less advantaged provinces. This really is not how the program works; the entire thing is paid for out of general revenues raised by the federal government. These richer provinces are not invoiced for equalisation; it does not factor into provincial budgeting at all, in fact.

The provinces may not be invoiced for equalization but their people are. In a progressive tax system the higher the income, the higher the percentage of taxes being paid. And if only "net loser" provinces are being paid, the effect is the one you deny. And I am NOT a conservative and I did NOT vote for the CPC in the last or any election.

I think it makes perfect sense to help less advantaged provinces maintain levels of public services comparable to other provinces, so that all Canadians have

roughly the same access to social services. There are some variances to this, of course, based on the actual management of programs by individual provincial governments, but the principle is, in my view, a sound one.

The problem with that approach is that elected provincial officials are being rewarded for economic policies that make their provinces net losers. Otherwise the voters would punish them for either poor services, higher provincial taxes or both.

[Paradox]

The provinces may not be invoiced for equalization but their people are. In a progressive tax system the higher the income, the higher the percentage of taxes being paid. And if only "net loser" provinces are being paid, the effect is the one you deny. And I am NOT a conservative and I did NOT vote for the CPC in the last or any election.

The problem with that approach is that elected provincial officials are being rewarded for economic policies that make their provinces net losers. Otherwise the voters would punish them for either poor services, higher provincial taxes or both.

It is not about rewarding or punishing elected representatives, it is about ensuring a standard of social and public services for the citizens of smaller provinces. The people of Prince Edward Island, for example, should not be punished with poor service levels, just because the population of the province does not accommodate the type of revenue collection that provinces such as British Columbia, or Ontario, might have.

[jbg]

It is not about rewarding or punishing elected representatives, it is about ensuring a standard of social and public services for the citizens of smaller provinces. The people of Prince Edward Island, for example, should not be punished with poor service levels, just because the population of the province does not accommodate the type of revenue collection that provinces such as British Columbia, or Ontario, might have.

Maybe if an area is always impoverished since their industries have died, wouldn't it be better if some people moved? Why would Canada be in the business of subsidizing failed regions or provinces?

[Paradox]

Maybe if an area is always impoverished since their industries have died, wouldn't it be better if some people moved? Why would Canada be in the business of subsidizing failed regions or provinces?

It is not an issue of whether the province has "failed." Canada has an obligation to uphold standards of social and public services, and there are some provinces—such as Prince Edward Island—which, by virtue of size or other factors, do not have the same capacity for revenue generation as other provinces do. The equalisation program attempts to maintain similar standards of social services, at similar levels of taxation, which is a key part of it.

[jbg]

It is not an issue of whether the province has "failed." Canada has an obligation to uphold standards of social and public services, and there are some provinces—such as Prince Edward Island—which, by virtue of size or other factors, do not have the same capacity for revenue generation as other provinces do. The equalisation program attempts to maintain similar standards of social services, at similar levels of taxation, which is a key part of it.

If fishing, PEI's former source of income, is dead, the economic basis of the province is dead.