Preston Manning says that the Harper Government is bad

[huh]

Read this first line.

Preston Manning cautioned his fellow Tories on Saturday that the conservative movement in Canada must practice as well as preach ethical policies, be open to new ideas, and better train political candidates.

Read more: http://www.canada.com/news/Preston+Manning+says+time+more+ethical+policies+politics/6283398/story.html#ixzz1omCRo0yo

Paraphrasing

1. It isn't about the party, it is about the movement now.

2. They arn't practising or putting forth ethical policies.

3. Their ideas suck.

4. They suck.

You're a liar.

[huh]

Yes for goodness sake do not critize the Harper government in any way or the rath of god will descend on you.

Really? I assume that is about as proven as the conservatives being behind these calls, not that you care about proof.

[olpfan1]

Really? I assume that is about as proven as the conservatives being behind these calls, not that you care about proof.

the proof will be later today when Pierre Poutine turns himself in

and when hes a conservative you're going to get pwnd

[j44]

the proof will be later today when Pierre Poutine turns himself in

and when hes a conservative you're going to get pwnd

Even if he is a Conservative I'm still waiting to see who (if anyone) directed him to do what he did.

[olpfan1]

Even if he is a Conservative I'm still waiting to see who (if anyone) directed him to do what he did.

Oh probably, this isn't the main person behind this, it's just going to be a lowly operative

I think the CPC are trying to squash the story before they go on their March break

last thing they need is this getting in the way of their super duper budget

Edited March 12, 2012 by olpfan1

[j44]

Oh probably, this isn't the main person behind this, it's just going to be a lowly operative

I also mean I'll wait before I write the entire party/government off as being behind it.

[dre]

Even if he is a Conservative I'm still waiting to see who (if anyone) directed him to do what he did.

I highly doubt youll ever find that out. My guess is that whether or not there was high level involvement by the party you arent going to get some neatly packaged "smoking gun".

And I dont think it really matters. What matters is that bi-elections are held in ridings where there was a significant ammount of this type of activity. And maybe we should end robocalls completely.

I doubt this is gonna turn into watergate, and politicians (in ANY parties involved) will get off scott free like they always do. But if we rerun elections where this happens then there wont be much point in them doing it anymore. If the results stand, then we encourage the behavior and it will grow fast.

Its sad that almost the entire focus here is on political parties instead of the deterioration of our political system.

[dre]

I also mean I'll wait before I write the entire party/government off as being behind it.

I wrote off all the parties a long time ago, its the political system itself thats at stake now, although Iv pretty much written that off as well. I still have ONE horse in this race though I dont like these robo calls at all, and it should be illegal for ANYONE to make them as far as Im concerned. They threaten the telephone as a medium the same way spammers threatened email as a medium, the difference being its a lot harder to innovate a solution with telephone because the callers are anonymous at the end point. Otherwise you could just cross check incoming calls against a database of know political/charity/corporate SPAMMERS and make your phone just not ring when those assholes phone you.

Pass a simple law... All incoming calls must be accompanied by the senders name whether its a business, or a person, and an account GUID. Within a year youll be able to buy a device at Canadian tire for $29.95, that lets you control whether or not you get calls from political parties, charities, polling organizations, and businesses trying to hawk stuff.

[j44]

I highly doubt youll ever find that out. My guess is that whether or not there was high level involvement by the party you arent going to get some neatly packaged "smoking gun".

And I dont think it really matters. What matters is that bi-elections are held in ridings where there was a significant ammount of this type of activity. And maybe we should end robocalls completely.

I doubt this is gonna turn into watergate, and politicians (in ANY parties involved) will get off scott free like they always do. But if we rerun elections where this happens then there wont be much point in them doing it anymore. If the results stand, then we encourage the behavior and it will grow fast.

Its sad that almost the entire focus here is on political parties instead of the deterioration of our political system.

I have no basis for this but I think we might get someone running a campaign at the riding level to get the book thrown at them but I'd be surprised if there is any connection much higher up. I could be wrong though.

Frankly I find it sad in the sense that I'm not surprised this goes on and I'm not excusing any of this but I'd bet this level of fraud exists in most of the parties at some level. That probably says more about how I see the system than anything else though.

Whoever takes the blame for this I can't see any final word or conviction or anything like that coming down any time soon. Didn't the Conservative just drop their appeals to an apparent fraud case from like 5 years ago?

[Bryan]

the proof will be later today when Pierre Poutine turns himself in

and when hes a conservative you're going to get pwnd

I don't think anyone is going to be surprised, whatever happens, when it comes to Guelph. It's quite clear that there was a tit-for-tat escalation of behavior that was at the very least questionable. That some people in more than one party did something is what we should expect to find.

"A" conservative isn't going mean anything with respect to the government or the legitimacy of the election... especially since the CPC didn't even win in Guelph, and the guy who did win has already admitted to breaking several elections regulations. The campaign in that riding was dirty from the get-go.

[Guest Derek L]

I have no basis for this but I think we might get someone running a campaign at the riding level to get the book thrown at them but I'd be surprised if there is any connection much higher up. I could be wrong though.

Frankly I find it sad in the sense that I'm not surprised this goes on and I'm not excusing any of this but I'd bet this level of fraud exists in most of the parties at some level. That probably says more about how I see the system than anything else though.

Whoever takes the blame for this I can't see any final word or conviction or anything like that coming down any time soon. Didn't the Conservative just drop their appeals to an apparent fraud case from like 5 years ago?

The rumour I’ve heard is that the person turning themselves in is University student……..Which if true, and some activist group is behind this, it would explain why the entire mater reeks of amateur hour…….I still find it hard to believe any political party’s central campaign would risk sooooo much political capital on a tactic that has little gain.

I guess we’ll find out soon….

[scribblet]

the proof will be later today when Pierre Poutine turns himself in

and when hes a conservative you're going to get pwnd

Really, and if it's a lone conservative it's still all Harper's fault of course, never mind that meanwhile, back at the ranch, the Liberals have had to apologize to Canadians twice, once for admitted illegal activities during the election. Maybe they should be saying " We are very very sorry, but It's all Harpers fault".

[PIK]

If he is a con, he will fell the wrath of the party and the party will be fine. I see a bigger majority in the future, BUT if it is someone to do with the left, now that is going to be a problem. A huge problem, probably the end for one of the parties.

[olpfan1]

The rumour I’ve heard is that the person turning themselves in is University student……..Which if true, and some activist group is behind this, it would explain why the entire mater reeks of amateur hour…….I still find it hard to believe any political party’s central campaign would risk sooooo much political capital on a tactic that has little gain.

I guess we’ll find out soon….

In & Out scheme

enough said

[madmax]

If he is a con, he will fell the wrath of the party and the party will be fine. I see a bigger majority in the future, BUT if it is someone to do with the left, now that is going to be a problem. A huge problem, probably the end for one of the parties.

While I actually am disgusted by the first post in this thread.. which is a total twist on what Mr. Manning said...

I do believe that the intent of the Conservative Government has been to find a fall guy for this since the story first broke. Particularly pointing the finger at the Conservative Operative Sonsa , the National Conservative Campaign Representative and Conservative Staffer who quickly resigned when the fingers were pointed at him.

He said he wasn't guilty earlier... my guess.. he may have a change or heart.

He stated that someone else was responsible and hoped the guilty party would come forward.

So...

Will it Be Sona

Or is it someone completely different...

And will this be enough to explain all the misleading calls across many ridings.

And of course..

Damage Control has already been done.. Expect this one to get buried....I believe someone involved is going to be odd man out and the others will circle the wagons and insulate themselves....

[madmax]

Really, and if it's a lone conservative it's still all Harper's fault of course,

It sounds like this could have been done by the Conservative appointed Communication Director

[Tilter]

The Liberal Party of Canada - The Green Party of Ontario - Mitt Romney for America

Should be banned---- advertising for the lefties in Canada & the uncertain in the States