Jack Laytons' integrity

[Hydraboss]

I think anyone who doesn't believe this happens, that there's no line jumping and everyone is treated the same in Canada, is hopelessly naive.

You've nailed it. It happens all the damn time. If you're "one of the patient masses" that believes we should all wait politely in line, you'll either get better or you'll die. There isn't a nurse in the world who's kids wait in emergency waiting rooms for very long. My kids have never waited longer that about 10 minutes. Medical staff take care of medical staff they work with. Doctors take care of nurses faster than anyone other than their own families.

People still want to believe that in Canada, everyone is equal and we have this one-tier medical system. What bullshit. They are naive.

[Mr.Canada]

HydraBoss, all politics aside, every Canadian in dire need should get all the care they need immediately regardless of situation, income or anything else. If their is too much paper wrangling to be effective then that is a serious flaw that should be reviewed.

[Hydraboss]

HydraBoss, all politics aside, every Canadian in dire need should get all the care they need immediately regardless of situation, income or anything else. If their is too much paper wrangling to be effective then that is a serious flaw that should be reviewed.

It should be that way, but it's not. It's really fast care for those that can afford it or know the right people, and it's roll-the-dice for everyone else. It won't be "fixed" because the people that can fix it already fit into the first group. Like Layton.

[Sandy MacNab]

It should be that way, but it's not. It's really fast care for those that can afford it or know the right people, and it's roll-the-dice for everyone else. It won't be "fixed" because the people that can fix it already fit into the first group. Like Layton.

The hypocracy of the Laytons of the country is killing people every day. Our health care system is a frigging mess and needs drastic reforms. We need to look to the more successful system of Europe - those with intelligent and working combinations of public/private care and improve upon them. If they can do it so can we. Or maybe we just aren't smart enough. If I can get a colonoscopy in two days in a small city in California, why do I have to wait three years in Calgary?

[Smallc]

why do I have to wait three years in Calgary?

You don't, unless you're planning to take the training and do it yourself. Our system needs improvement in some areas, but it doesn't need to be overhauled to the level that some suggest.

[Sandy MacNab]

You don't, unless you're planning to take the training and do it yourself. Our system needs improvement in some areas, but it doesn't need to be overhauled to the level that some suggest.

What the hell are you talking about? I asked my doctor last week and that's what he told me. A client whose wife almost died from colon cancer was told he had to wait also. So, he went to a clinic outside the country and paid for it. Sure, he might have gone to a private clinic in Canada, BUT he is wealthy and decided to go to a more state-of-the-art facility. Other Canadians who can't afford it, DIE!

[Smallc]

Well then there's something very wrong in Calgary. In Winnipeg, even routine colonoscopies are under six months. At my crap hospital, they're running about a year. Keep in mind, that's for a routine colonoscopy. Alberta seems to have health problems that some other places don't have.

On the other hand, you have 30 posts. You're probably a Conservative partisan making things up. I doubt you'll be here much longer.

Edited May 1, 2011 by Smallc

[Sandy MacNab]

Well then there's something very wrong in Calgary. In Winnipeg, even routine colonoscopies are under six months. At my crap hospital, they're running about a year. Keep in mind, that's for a routine colonoscopy. Alberta seems to have health problems that some other places don't have.

On the other hand, you have 30 posts. You're probably a Conservative partisan making things up. I doubt you'll be here much longer.

SO you're calling me a liar? You wouldn't get away with it face-to-face.

The only folks I know who make things up are Liberals. AND, if you were half as bright and knowledgeable as you think you are, you'd investigate. Alberta's health care system is a disaster.

[Smallc]

SO you're calling me a liar? You wouldn't get away with it face-to-face.

Alberta's health care system is a disaster.

Then fix it. It's not a federal problem.

[scorpio]

If I can get a colonoscopy in two days in a small city in California, why do I have to wait three years in Calgary?

Move to Lethbridge. I got mine in 3 months.

[RNG]

Move to Lethbridge. I got mine in 3 months.

Move to Calgary, I got mine in three days. And it cost me nothing, other than my dignity.

[jacee]

Alberta's health care system is a disaster.

why is that? Poor funding? The Alberta Conservative brand of health care isn't very efficient? And didn't I hear that they're shipping in frozen processed food to the nursing homes now instead of cooking local meat and produce onsite?

Edited May 1, 2011 by jacee

[jbg]

It's really scary that this man who will soon become PM has so much to hide from Canadians.

Given that until about 14 days ago his role was marginal and that of a spoiler he's never had to explain anything. Thus the sudden mania about him. Trudeaumania didn't turn out well either.

[Molly]

Given that until about 14 days ago his role was marginal and that of a spoiler he's never had to explain anything. Thus the sudden mania about him. Trudeaumania didn't turn out well either.

This last-second begging and scare-mongering makes me think of that Greatest Canadian thing of a few years ago... Tommy Douglas camde in first, of course, follwed by Terry Fox- and Pierre Trudeau was number three.

Now, I didn`t agree with the outcome of that, but if Trudeau came up number 3, there were obviously quite a few Canadians who figured he didn`t co too badly. (With douglas as the greatest, they didn`t seem to mind those awful socialists, either.)

[CANADIEN]

Jack Layton has been an elected politician for 29 years. Leader of a federal party for 8 years. As a high-profile city councillor, Metro councillor and mayoral candidate in Canada's largest city he has not been an unknown quantity (at least locally). His positions has been analysed, applauded, opposed. If there had been skeletons in his closet (and I am not talking about getting massages), they would have been found a long time ago.

[bloodyminded]

Got a news flash for you...I'm definitely not "poor" and when my wife nearly died last year, I would have walked over the bodies of "the poor" to get her in as soon as I could. And I did. She's a nurse and I pulled every string in book and called in favors that have taken me years to earn. She jumped so far over the queue that the poor bastards waiting in line couldn't even see her. We jumped every line for surgery. Every line for imaging and tests. Every line for surgical rounds and specialists. I don't fucking care about "the poor" or anyone else when it's my family at risk.

If you disagree, you've never had anyone you love in that condition.

Yes, when it comes to loved ones, this is understandable.

But that's not the issue here.

At issue is the idea of such behaviour being encouraged, through "rich-privelege" policies...in which case you wouldn't have had to "call in favours"....you'd simply get priveleged because you could afford it.

Edited May 1, 2011 by bloodyminded

[Posc Student]

Why, like Harper, does Layton pick and choose which days he will and will not answer questions?

[Guest American Woman]

You've nailed it. It happens all the damn time. If you're "one of the patient masses" that believes we should all wait politely in line, you'll either get better or you'll die. There isn't a nurse in the world who's kids wait in emergency waiting rooms for very long. My kids have never waited longer that about 10 minutes. Medical staff take care of medical staff they work with. Doctors take care of nurses faster than anyone other than their own families.

This is so obvious that I can't believe there are people who deny it. I don't know if they actually believe it themselves or if they feel a dire need to present Canada as a country who treats everyone the same regardless of income or status or other circumstances such a you describe or what, but I always marvel at the naivety or dishonesty of such a stance. Of course everyone doesn't have to wait in line. I don't believe for a minute that a homeless person coming in off the streets would be treated before a councillor or that Joe Canada would be treated before Joe Surgeon or even Rich Joe or Powerful Joe. Of course there's a pecking order involved.

People still want to believe that in Canada, everyone is equal and we have this one-tier medical system. What bullshit. They are naive.

It's refreshing to hear someone come right out and say it. There seems to be such a need to present the health care system as superior to health care in the U.S., to push Canada's 'love for all' as opposed to the racial problems the U.S. has experienced, that some refuse to see or admit to the reality. The reality is just as I've always said -- better for some in Canada and better for some in the U.S.

The hypocracy of the Laytons of the country is killing people every day. Our health care system is a frigging mess and needs drastic reforms. We need to look to the more successful system of Europe - those with intelligent and working combinations of public/private care and improve upon them. If they can do it so can we. Or maybe we just aren't smart enough. If I can get a colonoscopy in two days in a small city in California, why do I have to wait three years in Calgary?

I agree. Canada is rated low among the nations who have national health care or the options of national health care. If they can do it, both of our countries should be able to do it. I think the U.S. needs a public/national option, but not at the expense (and I'm not talking $ here) of the private options.

As for your example for a colonoscopy, I agree with you 100%. Anyone who is having a "routine colonoscopy" is at risk if they have to wait a year, or even six months. Polyps can become cancerous during that time. There's a reason people are having the colonoscopy, and a six month wait for such a routine procedure is ludicrous, a year is unacceptable.

So again, some people in Canada are not getting the health care they need just as some in the U.S. are not getting it, albeit for different reasons. I'm with you. I look to the European systems for the answer.

[Smallc]

A routine colonoscopy is something that you have every 5 years. You have to schedule it a few months before. Yes, I read that, btw. If they suspect anything, you don't wait in Winnipeg, and you generally don't wait six months at my crap hospital.

BTW, with the six month figure, I was allowing a great deal of time on top. I don't know the exact figure, I know that two people I know got theirs within 3 months - again, routine.

Edited May 1, 2011 by Smallc

[Guest American Woman]

Yes, I read that, btw.

Of course you did. Same as always.