israel responds to terrorism by killing civilians

[Chippewa]

Spoken like a true skunk. Lots of smell when you get defensive yes? Arabs, Jews, Druze, Berbers, Assyrians, Kurds, and many others we all came and we come and go like the desert sand.

Nothing is permanent in the face of the wind and the shifting sands. Nothing.

Stay out of this desert Chippewa until you learn to shut your mouth. You'll drown swallowing all the sand.

There are many people Chippewa with many histories and ties to the land. None own it, all have legacy to it. Your attempt to ignore all but one people and revise history speaks for but one thing-your own political bias and ignorance of not just the origins of Jews, but Muslims, Christians, Druze, Berbers, Kurds, Assyrians, Bahaiis, Zoroastreans, and so many others.

You are nothing but a mocking bird Chippewa and your imitation of the people that spew hatred at you turned back onto Jews is absurd. Its a pale imitation of that which you seek to mimmick.

By the way before you call my ancestors immigrant peasants who got off a banana boat...lol... I think it hilarious you find that an insult.

You think yours came from under a cabbage leaf? Ahahah.

Look carefully fool, we are all descended from bastards-sorry to break that to you.

What you think if you try act like a mocking bird and sing some racist's song it makes you tough?

Lol. Banana boat. Hah.

Had far worse then you call me Jewboy or my grandparents or me f..cking or dirty Jews. Far worse.

You are darn right my grandparents were immigrants. They were fortunate to be able to come to Canada. The stories it took for them to survive so I could be born here are my legacy. Go on fool. Try remove the spirit and see what happens. Go on fool. Mock the spirit and see what happens.

Lol.

Chippewa that was one lousy imitation of a white man. You want to try again?

Ahahah. Banana boat... try freighter. Hahah. Banana boat. No. It was no canoe that's for sure. Had lots of rats Chippewa. Some got off and mixed with the native ones.

Might explain your desire to wallow in the refuse now.

What's the matter Chippewa. You scared of a Golem?

Boo!

So rights don't matter anymore.. It's just about which banana boat is bigger.

Im not concerned whether or not your just a part time canadian that's only been here for a generation or 2. I really don't care.

If your accusing me of saying that Jews have no right like the rest of us to be a people, or recognized as a nation, then I think you have it all wrong. Sure every ethnic group has a right to it religious sector, group, land, and whatever devised destiny they have in plan from religion or whatever.

My point is... If the jewish sector wanted to find out about Christianity or whatever that church thing is, then why didn't they ask the First Nations people in Canada, im sure they have been cured of it from the 51% death rate they gave all of us. The biggest genocide by religion in the world. the numbers don't lie.

They had West Germany, and East Germany... My question was why couldn't they have a Jewish Germany since obvously most of them came from there in the 1947 march on Palistine.

[Bonam]

They had West Germany, and East Germany... My question was why couldn't they have a Jewish Germany since obvously most of them came from there in the 1947 march on Palistine.

Besides the obvious flaws with this idea, the simple fact is, most Jews that went to the middle east after WWII did not in fact come from Germany. In fact, very few did.

[Rue]

If your accusing me of saying that Jews have no right like the rest of us to be a people, or recognized as a nation, then I think you have it all wrong. Sure every ethnic group has a right to it religious sector, group, land, and whatever devised destiny they have in plan from religion or whatever.

My point is... If the jewish sector wanted to find out about Christianity or whatever that church thing is, then why didn't they ask the First Nations people in Canada, im sure they have been cured of it from the 51% death rate they gave all of us. The biggest genocide by religion in the world. the numbers don't lie.

They had West Germany, and East Germany... My question was why couldn't they have a Jewish Germany since obvously most of them came from there in the 1947 march on Palistine.

Chippewa since you acknowledged I exist I will stand down from my previous comments. That is why I was challenging you.

There is a reason Jews left the Middle East and were not citizens of equal status in the Christian and Muslim world. There is also a reason why this led to our repeated persecution and genocide.

This is not the thread for that. What you now make reference to are the origins of Jews, what happened to us in the Muslim and Christian worlds, and why we started a liberation movement called Zionism. This thread is not for that.

The easiest way to find out why we Jews could not turn Germany into a Jewish state or would have wanted to is to simply find out-go on your own if you want and read about our history as I did of yours. Its there. Its not that complex to figure out. Like you we were treated

as second class and targetted.

We have many stories and legends in common and others that are different.

The point I am making to you is that our struggle for self-determination is no different then yours and our people were targetted no different then yours only in your case governments entered into promises and treaties with your peoples' representatives then broke them-with my people they never even acknowledged us as a people to speak to.

We share a legacy most closely related to the treatment afforded Roma (gypsy) peoples. We have certain things in common with what happened to Armenians.

Many people have been targetted for mass murder and in the case of Jews in Europe deliberate, repetitive attacks culminating in an organized genocide with citizens of many nations assisting in the deed.

My people did not come to Canada to spit on your ancestors' graves. My people did not set out to hurt Palestinians then called Arabs until a portion of them became displaced and then

later self identified as Palestinian.

No one set out to deliberately kill or seize or steal in my peoples' world. We struggled for self-determination to liberate ourselves from slavery and persecution. No more, no less.

Now we find ourselves in a war of attrition with Palestinians but no we do not sit around wanting them to be homeless or die. Israelis do not fight and do what they do because they have nothing better to do.

The irony of Israelis and Jews is, we have a warrior history-the origins of our religion are ripe with stories of tribal and territorial wars between us and other tribes.

Our way of life is supposed to shape shift from violence and war to peace and enlightenment.

We are trying. No we are not perfect. We have made mistakes. We continue to make them but no we didn't set out to kill Arabs and steal land. No. That is not what self-determination was about or is about.

We would prefer to sit and talk then fire back. All you have to do is sit and talk with us to find that out.

Many of us are ignorant of your history as you are of ours. It does not make us enemies-just ignorant.

Stand down. I know better then to walk on your ground without your permission. Give me some credit to feel the flow of life outside Israel. I do not live in Israel. I live in Canada.

I prefer forests and lakes to sand. I prefer coyotes to hyenas. I prefer the puma to the lion.

We have a dog in Israel called the Canaan dog. To understand an Israeli is to understand this dog.

Instead of me saying anything else try find one, one day and you will understand.

You will also understand why it has a familiar sound when it barks.

Its soul comes from the same place as yours.

I am standing down. I have no intention of walking in your woods. I do not trespass.

[Bob]

I am standing down. I have no intention of walking in your woods. I do not trespass.

There's really no point in wasting time with Chippewa, as it's clear he or she knows little to nothing about this complicated history. Of course, if you've got the patience and willpower, go for it... but I knew from the very first post from Chippewa that we're dealing with another person who has never read anything longer than a headline regarding this history and these issues. Moreover, we're certainly not dealing with someone who has a sincere interest in learning about this history or these issues. Instead, we've got someone who wants to shape this conflict into a pre-existing political paradigm, perhaps viewing this as some sort of left versus right issue.

[jbg]

I am standing down. I have no intention of walking in your woods. I do not trespass.

Is this comment much less offensive than some of mine? I know I'm a bit over the top every once in a while but so, honestly, are you.

[bud]

larry, moe and curly have spoken but they are still unable to justify israel's killing of civilians in response to terrorist attacks.

[Jonsa]

larry, moe and curly have spoken but they are still unable to justify israel's killing of civilians in response to terrorist attacks.

Nobody can justify killing innocents.

Israel's responses often kill civilians not because the deliberately target them, but because they are in the way. That or their intelligence was faulty.

And, if there weren't terrorist attacks, there wouldnt be israeli response, would there?

[Bob]

Killing civilians can certainly be justified in many contexts of conflict. Targeting civilians for the purpose of harming or killing them, on the other hand, is entirely something else.

[Rue]

Is this comment much less offensive than some of mine? I know I'm a bit over the top every once in a while but so, honestly, are you.

Well now let's see you quoted these words:

"I am standing down. I have no intention of walking in your woods. I do not trespass."

"I am standing down". Sounds very offensive.

" I have no intenion of walking in your woods." Again how rude.

"I do not trespass." Oh yes that sounds out of control.

You know you are right JBG those are probably the most offensive, over the top, adversarial, in your face, insulting words probably ever written on this forum.

Edited May 6, 2011 by Rue

[GostHacked]

Killing civilians can certainly be justified in many contexts of conflict. Targeting civilians for the purpose of harming or killing them, on the other hand, is entirely something else.

Whut?????

[Bob]

Whut?????

Exactly what I said. Allow me to clarify, actions which lead to the deaths of civilians can certainly be justified in the context of war. There is a difference between an action that leads to the deaths of civilians and an actions which is carried out for the purpose of killing civilians.

Allow me to give you a hypothetical example - consider a civilian building is being used as a base of operations for combatants. This civilian building is placing the safety of the other side at risk due to its current use as a garrison for the enemy. Unfortunately, civilians are either being forced to remain within the building or are voluntarily acting as human shields. Partial or complete destruction of the building may be justifiable.

[Saipan]

If another war is waged against Israel and Israel gets taken out, will you still hold this view? It's hypothetical yes, but an interesting question for those who support Israel without question.

You missed the part on who is starting those wars.