Liberal tiff in Outremont

[capricorn]

Martin Cauchon, one time Justice Minister in the Chretien cabinet, held the Outremont riding for a number of years. Cauchon was asked last June by a high ranking Liberal close to Ignatieff if he wanted to run in Outremont. He said yes. But Denis Coderre said no. Coderre already has a woman candidate selected and Ignatieff agreed with his selection. Cauchon is out. It is reported Coderre doesn't want to open the door to potential leadership rivals and he views Cauchon as a threat to his eventual ascension to the Liberal throne.

Martin Cauchon, the former justice minister who made history with same-sex marriage and his effort to decriminalize marijuana, has apparently lost in his bid to re-enter politics.

The Liberal Party is expected to run a prominent businesswoman in Montreal's Outremont riding, a onetime Liberal fortress Mr. Cauchon once held for 11 years.

Leader Michael Ignatieff announced Monday that the nod will go to a woman, amid reports the party is courting Nathalie Le Prohon. She was the president of Nokia Canada and has been a senior executive at IBM and Hydro-Quebec.

Mr. Ignatieff said he had already discussed his choice with Mr. Cauchon.

“I made a decision,” the Liberal Leader told a Toronto news conference.

“For four months, we've been seeking female candidates. … We are not only looking to name female candidates, but to name them in places where they can win. That's our decision in Outremont.”

---

Mr. Cauchon was Mr. Chrétien's last Quebec lieutenant. He and the current Liberal Quebec lieutenant – Denis Coderre – have had a long-standing rivalry.

Both men are known to have leadership ambitions, and Mr. Cauchon's effort to re-enter politics was reportedly being blocked by his old colleague. Mr. Cauchon told The Canadian Press in an interview that, given his history with the party, he was surprised to be facing resistance in his comeback bid.

Despite the decision, Mr. Ignatieff said he appreciates Mr. Cauchon.

“I have a lot of respect for Mr. Cauchon and I believe he has a great future within the party,” the Liberal Leader said. “He is a man who has been faithful to the party and someone for whom I have a lot of respect.”

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politi...article1296034/

I read the Riding President vouched for Cauchon but was also rebuffed by the party.

This not bode well for the Liberals' hopes of regaining Outremont. It looks to me Mulcair will benefit from a whole lot of dissatisfaction from potential Liberal supporters who would have preferred a more democratic process of candidate selection.

Old wounds are being reopened. Not good for a party seeking to rebuild unity. This is a huge test of Ignatieff's leadership abilities. The repercussions of this situation have yet to really hit him.

[punked]

Just about the candidate Iggy picked.

"As a current member of the board of directors of Hydro-Québec, Ms Le Prohon was probably one of those people who voted last month to grant an $800,000 subsidy to an exclusive private school in NDG. Problem is, Thierry Vandal, HQ's CEO is the chairman of the board of benefactors of said exclusive school.

La Presse ran a blaring headline highlighting the fact and within a day, the college was forced to forego the grant. The whole story put the Charest government in hot water, with pointed questions about yet another subsidy to a private school while the public network needs a lot of investments. The PQ and ADQ even called for Vandal to resign ."

[jdobbin]

Old wounds are being reopened. Not good for a party seeking to rebuild unity. This is a huge test of Ignatieff's leadership abilities. The repercussions of this situation have yet to really hit him.

Think I have seen a few fights for ridings for all the parties. I can think of a few for the NDP and Tories as well over the years.

I can't say for sure that this is good decision or not. The Liberals believe that they can win this seat again and people are willing to fight for the nomination.

[punked]

Think I have seen a few fights for ridings for all the parties. I can think of a few for the NDP and Tories as well over the years.

I can't say for sure that this is good decision or not. The Liberals believe that they can win this seat again and people are willing to fight for the nomination.

I can't think of an NDP ridding where the leader came in and said "No democracy here" maybe because or nomination process does not allow for it so your comparison is wrong.

[capricorn]

I can't say for sure that this is good decision or not.

Ignatieff is between a rock and a hard place. Does he alienate Coderre who has worked hard to rebuild the party brand in Quebec? Or does he bow to the Riding Association's wishes? Either way it leaves a lot of people pissed off, including Cauchon I bet. The Liberals sure know how to treat an ex-MP high flyer.

I wonder what Chretien thinks about this. Speaking of Chretien, maybe Ignatieff doesn't want a Chretienite around to remind voters of Adscam and Shawinigate.

The Liberals believe that they can win this seat again and people are willing to fight for the nomination.

That's Ignatieff's line.

"It's a good sign of renewal in the party when there's a lively competition for the riding of Outremont," Ignatieff said outside his Parliament Hill office on Thursday. "We are very confident that we will recapture the riding in Outremont and have very good results."

http://www.montrealgazette.com/Liberal+big...5092/story.html

Except, there is no fight. It's a TKO even before the fighters get into the ring.

[jdobbin]

Ignatieff is between a rock and a hard place. Does he alienate Coderre who has worked hard to rebuild the party brand in Quebec? Or does he bow to the Riding Association's wishes? Either way it leaves a lot of people pissed off, including Cauchon I bet. The Liberals sure know how to treat an ex-MP high flyer.

Cauchon was not the only one in the riding interested. I count four, maybe five that were interested.

However, Ignatieff made a promise as well on female candidates and made it clear he would appoint some women in winnable ridings to fulfill that promise.

I wonder what Chretien thinks about this. Speaking of Chretien, maybe Ignatieff doesn't want a Chretienite around to remind voters of Adscam and Shawinigate.

I think Cauchon waited too long to give an answer on running is my impression. The Liberals courted a candiadte while they waited.

That's Ignatieff's line.

It also happens to be true. Even with a weakened Leader Outremont was more competitive. This election it will be even moreso.

Except, there is no fight. It's a TKO even before the fighters get into the ring.

I have no problem appointing candidates. Never have.

It is best to have party support but sometimes you just don't want what the riding is pushing as their chosen person.

[Shakeyhands]

I can't think of an NDP ridding where the leader came in and said "No democracy here" maybe because or nomination process does not allow for it so your comparison is wrong.

Thats too bad that there is no chance of the NDP ever forming the government then.... darn.

[Shakeyhands]

I may be wrong, but didn't almost the exact thing happen with the CPC last go round?

[punked]

Thats too bad that there is no chance of the NDP ever forming the government then.... darn.

You know I got quite thick skin being an NDP member and all. This comeback is over used and poor to say the best. Never say never.

[jdobbin]

Thats too bad that there is no chance of the NDP ever forming the government then.... darn.

That true.

Oh, and here is one NDP leader that said No democracy here!

http://www.newstalk650.com/story/20090611/17828

The preliminary investigation has wrapped up and now the RCMP is confirming it has launched a criminal investigation in to the NDP membership scandal.

[punked]

That true.

Oh, and here is one NDP leader that said No democracy here!

http://www.newstalk650.com/story/20090611/17828

That actually has nothing to do with nothing. Although thanks for proving even more so this is a Liberal exclusive thing. Why do you guys hate democracy?

Kingdon wouldn't say what the investigation is actually into

Dobbin doesn't even know what this is about he is just trying to spin away from King Iggy appointing whoever he wants across the country.

Edited September 22, 2009 by punked

[capricorn]

Cauchon was not the only one in the riding interested. I count four, maybe five that were interested.

That just adds to the number of pissed off people, including their supporters.

However, Ignatieff made a promise as well on female candidates and made it clear he would appoint some women in winnable ridings to fulfill that promise.

Yes, but at what cost to the party and its image?

The controversy is a harbinger for other difficulties in the Quebec wing of the party. Coderre has pressured some long-serving MPs with safe seats to resign, according to a number of Liberal sources. They told CBC News the party wants those seats for star female candidates as part of its renewal process.

The sources said former party leader Stéphane Dion, along with Bernard Patry, Raymonde Folco, and Lise Zarac, have all been asked to step aside.

---

Several Liberals, who would not speak publicly, told CBC News that Coderre's style and approach to the Quebec election strategy is too divisive.

They said the leader should strip Coderre of his responsibilities in Quebec before it threatens party unity.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/montreal/story/20...nomination.html

I think Cauchon waited too long to give an answer on running is my impression. The Liberals courted a candiadte while they waited.

That may well be. For many, the two weeks it took Cauchon to voice his intention will be forgotten in the ensuing infighting.

I have no problem appointing candidates. Never have.

That's irrelevant in the context of what's about to blow up in Quebec Liberal land.

[jdobbin]

That just adds to the number of pissed off people, including their supporters.

Yes, but at what cost to the party and its image?

Hopefully, a victorious one in Outremont.

Guess that will be the real test.

That may well be. For many, the two weeks it took Cauchon to voice his intention will be forgotten in the ensuing infighting.

That's irrelevant in the context of what's about to blow up in Quebec Liberal land.

You'll have to make up your mind. Either the Liberal party in Quebec needs to be reformed or it doesn't.

[capricorn]

That may well be. For many, the two weeks it took Cauchon to voice his intention will be forgotten in the ensuing infighting.

I correct myself. Cauchon was approached in June and provided his intent to run early this month, that is late August or early September.

M. Cauchon soutient qu'une personne de l'entourage immédiat du chef libéral l'avait approché en juin pour qu'il se présente dans Outremont lors d'éventuelles élections. L'ancien ministre de la Justice, qui par le passé avait remporté à trois reprises cette circonscription, avait demandé un temps de réflexion. Puis, il y a trois semaines, il dit avoir fait part de sa décision de se présenter.

http://www.radio-canada.ca/nouvelles/Polit...n-coderre.shtml

In fairness, Cauchon had asked for time to consider what is indeed an important decision to make. You'd think someone in the party would have contacted him earlier to follow up on his decision. That would have been Coderre's job but he was too busy trying to convince other sitting Liberal MPs to resign.

[jdobbin]

I correct myself. Cauchon was approached in June and provided his intent to run early this month, that is late August or early September.

That is a long time considering that candidates were being selected quickly all summer. The clock was ticking.

In fairness, Cauchon had asked for time to consider what is indeed an important decision to make. You'd think someone in the party would have contacted him earlier to follow up on his decision. That would have been Coderre's job but he was too busy trying to convince other sitting Liberal MPs to resign.

I'm not convinced that it is just Coderre trying to clean house in the province.

[punked]

That is a long time considering that candidates were being selected quickly all summer. The clock was ticking.

Only 90 Liberal Candidates have been nominated so far no excuse not to have a meeting.

[capricorn]

You'll have to make up your mind. Either the Liberal party in Quebec needs to be reformed or it doesn't.

My mind is made up that the Liberals are going about renewal the wrong way. First, you tell potential candidates they're the wrong gender, then tell sitting MPs and the immediate past leader that their best before date has expired, there will be outrage. Even more so when the known objective of the one charged with candidate selection is paving his own way toward the leadership.

[capricorn]

The clock was ticking.

Oh, this time bomb in the making is still ticking.

I'm not convinced that it is just Coderre trying to clean house in the province.

If there was any cleaning house going on in Quebec, how come Coderre is still there?

[jdobbin]

My mind is made up that the Liberals are going about renewal the wrong way. First, you tell potential candidates they're the wrong gender, then tell sitting MPs and the immediate past leader that their best before date has expired, there will be outrage. Even more so when the known objective of the one charged with candidate selection is paving his own way toward the leadership.

The policy from the beginning was to appoint women to fulfill the promise made about raising the percentage of female candidates. This wasn't an unknown for the party.

Since all the Liberal MPs have been acclaimed and don't have to face nominations, I don't know that there is anything that can be done to force them out. I haven't heard of any MP saying they are being forced out.

Edited September 22, 2009 by jdobbin

[capricorn]

I haven't heard of any MP saying they are being forced out.

Give it time. Tic, toc, tic, toc.....

[jdobbin]

Oh, this time bomb in the making is still ticking.

If there was any cleaning house going on in Quebec, how come Coderre is still there?

You need someone with brass knuckles, especially in Quebec.

In any event, I guess we'll find out if the party is imploding if the Liberals don't win back Outremont.

Edited September 22, 2009 by jdobbin

[jdobbin]

Give it time. Tic, toc, tic, toc.....

Boy, if you spent as much time on Tory nomination stuff as you do Liberal. ha

Edited September 22, 2009 by jdobbin

[capricorn]

Liberals are more fun to watch.

[myata]

Party politics suck.

Two party politics suck to the power of two.

In the near future, if not already now, it may come out as the single biggest obstacle to real democracy in our political system.

[August1991]

I thoughtthat this was a dumb tiff between Cauchon and Coderre and Ignatieff didn't have the authority, skill, talent to control the two. To my ear, there has always been an element of student council politics to the internal debates of the Liberal Party.

Paul Wells described it well:

... right after the 2000 election I interviewed both men for the National Post on their thinly-veiled ambition to replace Jean Chrétien’s replacement and become the next-next Liberal leader. I forget which one bent my ear complaining that the other was in better focus in the photo we ran. They’ve long had a hate-hate relationship, those guys.

Paul Wells

But then I read this:

Denis Coderre veut faire le ménage du PLC au Québec. Après avoir écarté l'ex-ministre Martin Cauchon dans Outremont, voilà que l'équipe de Michael Ignatieff souhaite le départ de plusieurs députés, dont celui de l'ex-chef libéral, Stéphane Dion.

Selon Le Devoir, Michael Ignatieff affirme vouloir faire de la place aux candidates féminines. Pourtant, parmi les députés qui pourraient être mis de côté, il y a deux femmes: Raymonde Folco, dans Laval-Les Îles, et Lise Zarac, dans LaSalle-Émard, l'ancien comté de Paul Martin.

Stéphane Dion dans Saint-Laurent-Cartierville et Bernard Patry dans Pierrefonds-Dollar, sont aussi des députés visés par le changement désiré par Michael Ignatieff et son lieutenant politique au Québec, Denis Coderre.

Link

Maybe Dion just plans to retire.

Between Denis Coderre and Martin Cauchon, if I were Ignatieff, I know which of the two that I would ask to step aside to let a woman candidate have a seat.

These guys have big egoes - Coderre in particular - and I suspect that Ignatieff has lost control of the situation. Nature abhors a vacuum, as they say. Coderre is regularly identified as Ignatieff's Quebec lieutenant. Ignatieff should reign him in.

Il n'y a pas que Martin Cauchon dans Outremont qui apprend à la dure que le Parti libéral du Canada essaye de se renouveler au Québec. Quatre députés montréalais déjà en selle, dont l'ancien chef Stéphane Dion, subissent des pressions du lieutenant de Michael Ignatieff pour céder leur siège à des candidats-vedettes.

Le Devoir

This is one to watch. This tiff has all the potential to turn into a barroom brawl!

Edited September 22, 2009 by August1991