g_bambino Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) [magically triplicated post deleted] Edited August 29, 2009 by g_bambino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g_bambino Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) [magically triplicated post deleted] Edited August 29, 2009 by g_bambino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 The problem isn't the actuality of secession but the threat of it. Under that hammer, Quebec gets away with some very real suppression of rights of English-speakers. Just as the Confederate States couldn't be allowed to violate the rights of Americans, same with Francophone Quebeckers. Huh, I learned a new word... Anyway, I really don't see what rights are being trampled on in Quebec. They were in the past, (and even that was done within the Constitution), but they really aren't now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 I wouldn't say that such a statement is all that true. Though Americans very much think of themselves as one people, they seem to be very divided along partisan lines. Americans are also very much divided along urban and rural lines. And is this not the situation in Canada, as well? Except we're also divided among linguistic lines, and, to a certain degree, provincial lines. Ie, people in New York do not resent people in Texas or California. But many in the West resent Central Canada, many in Central Canada seem to have a patronizing contempt for the West. Many in the East resent Central Canada, as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) And is this not the situation in Canada, as well? Where did I say that it wasn't? I was disagreeing with the statement that the US is more united than any country. They are divided in their own way. Edited August 29, 2009 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Where did I say that it wasn't? I was disagreeing with the statement that the US is more united than any country. They are divided in their own way. True, but they are less "divided" than Canada.....by design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 I don't agree. Americans are split much more by ideology. They may be less regional (to an extent) and less linguistically divided, but the quote from John Stewart stands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Oh, and just to respond to something from earlier, polls show that Quebec Francophones are split down the middle on the issue of sovereignty. Most Anglophones and Allophones are against it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Oh, and just to respond to something from earlier, polls show that Quebec Francophones are split down the middle on the issue of sovereignty. Most Anglophones and Allophones are against it. Interesting terms are all these "...phones"....a custom terminology for a custom set of issues to go with regionalism and the gravity of Jupiter from the "south"....all trying to pull Canada apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 I like how your argument breaks down into jabs when you have nothing to actually say. Americans are divided in their own way as are Canadians. It's a simple fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 I don't agree. Americans are split much more by ideology. They may be less regional (to an extent) and less linguistically divided, but the quote from John Stewart stands. John Stewart is only as smart as his writers.....ideas about republics or confederations probably escape him in front of a Sony high-def studio camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Remiel Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) The problem isn't the actuality of secession but the threat of it. Under that hammer, Quebec gets away with some very real suppression of rights of English-speakers. Just as the Confederate States couldn't be allowed to violate the rights of Americans, same with Francophone Quebeckers. There is no comparison between the rights that were being violated by the Confederate States and the "rights" that are being violated by the province of Quebec. Pretending that there is, frankly, is incredibly insulting to anyone who has ever been a slave. Edited August 29, 2009 by Remiel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 John Stewart is only as smart as his writers Actually, he writes a great deal of his own material, but again, nice non argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Actually, he writes a great deal of his own material, but again, nice non argument. The larger point remains, and invoking John Stewart and his American show format only reinforces the idea that such comparisons are silly and part of the problem. I have long maintained that Canada will never be able to define itself in American terms or un-references. The gravity of Jupiter is hard to ignore, but it can be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) This has nothing to do with how Canada defines itself (which should e left to Canadians). This has to do with a strange comparison and some manufactured belief that America is the most united country on Earth. Edited August 29, 2009 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 This has nothing to do with how Canada defines itself (which should e left to Canadians). This has to do with a strange comparison and some manufactured belief that America is the most united country on Earth. I agree....but you wouldn't discern such a thing based on many posts here at MLW. Of course, the word "united" does appear in the name, for whatever that's worth. The US has no equivalent to Canada's "Clarity Act" or "Notwithstanding Clause", both of which are a strange kind of "Get Out Of Jail Free" card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 And Canad doesn't have a civil war....maybe you needed a get out of jail free card? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 And Canad doesn't have a civil war....maybe you needed a get out of jail free card? But then the US would be like Canada, which has no Abe Lincoln or legacy of "Union". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 We also don't have legacy of civil war....Didn't need an Abe Lincoln it seems. No legacy of union maybe, yet still one country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 We also don't have legacy of civil war....Didn't need an Abe Lincoln it seems. No legacy of union maybe, yet still one country. Right...so there is no expectation of same. It's like partners living together instead of getting married. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 We got married a long time ago. We simply have lovers quarrels from time to time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 We got married a long time ago. We simply have lovers quarrels from time to time. Indeed...some marriages are better than others....many end in divorce after the "lovers" phase has expired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g_bambino Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) We got married a long time ago. We simply have lovers quarrels from time to time. True. And, actually, the all-out battle that came of the American "living arrangement" was a major influence on the opinions of the Fathers of Confederation. Part of what led them to choose constitutional monarchy was their perception of it as a middle ground between the absolutism of Czarist Russa and what they thought to be an unworkable republican model in the US, the very nature of which led to the Civil War. Smart men. [sp.] Edited August 29, 2009 by g_bambino Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbg Posted August 29, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 Anyway, I really don't see what rights are being trampled on in Quebec. They were in the past, (and even that was done within the Constitution), but they really aren't now.The law relating to signs? To education?Somehow those don't trample on rights? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted August 29, 2009 Report Share Posted August 29, 2009 (edited) No, they don't....not under the Constitution certainly now that they allow other languages on signs. I think much of this stems from a belief that you have that was until recently displayed in your signature. Edited August 29, 2009 by Smallc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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