DogOnPorch Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Start thinking. I think that it is you who should start thinking. The National Socialists were a POLITICAL ORGANIZATION. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialism Edited July 30, 2009 by DogOnPorch Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
CANADIEN Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 I think that it is you who should start thinking. The National Socialists were a POLITICAL ORGANIZATION.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialism People who planned and committed one of the most vile crimes in history, and made their intention to do so crystal clear from the start were not criminals. What next? People who conspire to kill women and claim they do so to defend their honour are not a bunch of criminals because their "main goal" is to defend their honour? Quote
DogOnPorch Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 People who planned and committed one of the most vile crimes in history, and made their intention to do so crystal clear from the start were not criminals. What next? People who conspire to kill women and claim they do so to defend their honour are not a bunch of criminals because their "main goal" is to defend their honour? You've lost and now you're not making sense. The KKK, like the Nazis, were formed for political purposes. That criminal behaviour came with them is literally besides the point re: the reason for their creation. The American Mafia however IS a criminal organization since its creation with Lucky Luciano leading the various families was for the sole purpose of making money via explotation of the justice system...ie crimes. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
CANADIEN Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) You've lostaccording to someone who believes the use of violence was not central to the creation and the nature of the KKK. The criminal behaviour was not besides the point, it was at the heart of what they did. Edited July 30, 2009 by CANADIEN Quote
DogOnPorch Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 according to someone who believes the use of violence was not central to the creation and the nature of the KKK. The criminal behaviour was not besides the point, it was at the heart to what they did. Again...you confuse cause and effect. But, I'm getting used to it. As Mark Steyn said: We live in an age where facts have become opinions and opinions have become facts. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
CANADIEN Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 (edited) Again...you confuse cause and effect. Not one bit in this case.The KKK was not founded by people who decided to achieve white supremacy and then decided to use violence to achieve it. It was founded by people who decide to achieve white supremacy AND use violence. The KKK cannot be explained without this combination of the two, nor can its criminal nature be dismissed as being besides the point. As Mark Steyn said: We live in an age where facts have become opinions and opinions have become facts. He should know, considering how he masquerades his opinions as facts. Edited July 30, 2009 by CANADIEN Quote
DogOnPorch Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Not one bit in this case.The KKK was not founded by people who decided to achieve white supremacy and then decided to use violence to achieve it. It was founded by people who decide to achieve white supremacy AND use violence. The KKK cannot be explained without this combination of the two, nor can its criminal nature be dismissed as being besides the point. Fine: In your opinion, the kids selling lemonade are a criminal orginization. He should know, considering how he masquerades his opinions as facts. Like? Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
CANADIEN Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Fine: In your opinion, the kids selling lemonade are a criminal orginization. The selling of lemonade by kids does not constitue a crime as defined in the criminal code. Quote
benny Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 "Take your son, your only son – yes, Isaac, whom you love so much – and go to the land of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains, which I will point out to you." (Genesis 22:1-18) Quote
DogOnPorch Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 The selling of lemonade by kids does not constitue a crime as defined in the criminal code. Yup...we're at the start of the loop and you're still not getting it. I couldn't help but notice you were unable to point out where Mark Steyn lies. Can you point out one of his more famous examples? Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Thank you for quoting me out of context. As my posting made clear, I was responding to someone's claim that the KKK is not a criminal organization. I wasn't quoting you out of context. I was pointing out your basic hypocrisy. What exactly is wrong with the KKK? They hate Jews and think Blacks are inferiors? Okay. The Muslims hate Jews and think women are inferiors. Why is this different? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 If we look at Europe, we also other things that are very different from what we have in Canada. For starter, the policy of most European countires from the start has been to treat Muslim (and in general, non-European immigrants) like guest-workers as best, with virtually no possibility of joining the body politic by becoming citizens. Not quite true. In fact, Europe, ruled by the Left for decades, has been in the forefront of advancing multicuturalism and the respect for newcomers. New immigrants were encouraged to retain whatever cultural baggage they desired, and given promises their cultures would be respected. They weren't even obligated to learn the local language, and often didn't. They were allowed to become citizens, but didn't join the body politic, as you say, because they wanted no part of it. Right-wing extremism, often violent, is another phenomenum far more present over there than here. It didn't used to be. It has been growing in tandem with the growing population of immigrants. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 We shall of course ignore the fact that you have a problem with about anyone who happens to be different from you. White neighbourhood anyone? I don't necessarily have a problem with people who are different than me. I have a problem with nutbar religious wackos - and fools. You should know that by now. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Nice to know that next time white racists beat up a Black man, we can count on you, as a white man, to denounce that crime. Our society denounces the crime, the perpetrator is arrested and imprisoned. So how come in Muslim societies that doesn't happen to a man who slaughters his daughter? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Of course, base on what I write here. I would identify myself with an idiot and a racist why... because of his skin colour? Because of a similar mentality, attitude and intellectual level? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 It used to be "most immigrants were Europeans". Now that it has been pointed that some European immigrants were from cultures with societal norms more akin tp the Middle East, it's Britons.. I should dig for statistics about crimes amongst past generations of Irish immigrants. Would it be unfair to point out that even if your ludicrous comparisons were sound that the post in which you made them came well after the post to which you are responding - or would that hurt your brain? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Using the past when trying to figure out what the future will be is actaully a lot more logically sound that ignoring the past because it does not fit one's prejudiced vision of the future. Perhaps I simply know more about the past than you do - and am smarter. Besides, I see no reason to take the chance. There are plenty of immigrants available from elsewhere. No need to bring in people from a group where we KNOW substantial numbers will be extremely hostile towards our culture and society. Or perhaps we should do as the Dutch are now doing. Having ignored the problem for so long, and now find themselves with a huge mass of hostile Muslims in their cities they are, in their own little Leftist way, doing their best to end Muslim immigration - the gentle way. Of course, they can't simply say no to Muslims. Instead any prospective Muslim immigrant has to take an entrance exam on their social attitudes (cost $425). This includes watching a DVD of life in the Netherlands which features topless women, women in bikinis and miniskirts, and men kissing. They're also told that the Netherlands is a cold, flood-prone country where everything is very expensive. A quote from a Rotterdam counciler seems apt “We used to think: Give people time and they will integrate. It’s a nice theory, but it didn’t work,” he said. Dutch to Muslims - Do you really want to settle here? We are in 2009. Do you think that British immigrants in the 1850's would have not done the same if they have had satellite TVs and planes? Or is it a problem only if Muslims do it? I have no doubt they would have, but they clearly didn't, and so they integrated much more quickly and easily. How do you explain then cultural organizations, ethnic-based churches, separate banks, ethnic newspapers, ethnic neighbourhoods amongst past generations of immigrants? Those first generation immigrants were no less "foreigners", and perceived as such, than immigrants from today. With some differences. They weren't AS foreign as this bunch, and they integrated much faster and more smoothly. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
jbg Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 And they're still not. You're confusing cause with effect. The KKK was formed after the US Civil War as a white supremist group in response to changes brought about what they called carpet-baggers. That they commited crimes was a violent sideline.Their legality is extremely gray, since almost any conceivable involvement with the group would involve at least being an accessory to crimes. Not all were involved in various lynchings and/or cross burnings, but at some point the pre-knowledge of a crime combined with ability to prevent the crime by reporting its imminency, or knowledge, after the fact of a crime and failure to cooperate with authorities would bring most if not all members into the criminal arena. The Mafia (as we know it) in North America is an actual criminal organization as it was formed by Lucky Luciano not to promote the Italian interests in America...not to make some sort of political statement. But, rather, to exploit loopholes in the US Justice system via criminal enterprise.The Mafia may or may not be a formal entity. I doubt anyone has formed a corporation or limited liability company for the Mafia.The problem for anyone knowingly associated with the Mafia, even if not directly involved in drug dealing, policy or numbers rackets, or extortion is very similar to the problem most Klan members have. Many Mafia or KKK members are also found "not guilty" after prosecution because proving accessory links to crimes is not easy. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Jerry J. Fortin Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 It is time to deal with organized crime. Legalize drugs and prostitution, have the government hold the right to form companies to handle the trade, and tax the hell out of it. Quote
benny Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 It is time to deal with organized crime. Legalize drugs and prostitution, have the government hold the right to form companies to handle the trade, and tax the hell out of it. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted July 30, 2009 Report Posted July 30, 2009 Their legality is extremely gray, since almost any conceivable involvement with the group would involve at least being an accessory to crimes. Not all were involved in various lynchings and/or cross burnings, but at some point the pre-knowledge of a crime combined with ability to prevent the crime by reporting its imminency, or knowledge, after the fact of a crime and failure to cooperate with authorities would bring most if not all members into the criminal arena. None-the-less, the KKK had a similar goal to the National Socialists and it wasn't "criminal". It was a political goal...not for the ill-gotten money...nor to simply lynch their former slaves. Being that several southern US Governors and other politicians were actual Klan members, illustrates the political overtones found in the Klan...and its pretty much successful attempt to legitimize itself for a time...especially during the early 20th century. David Duke seems to be the last of the big-time Klan politicians...we'll see. The Mafia may or may not be a formal entity. I doubt anyone has formed a corporation or limited liability company for the Mafia. There is no Mafia. The problem for anyone knowingly associated with the Mafia, even if not directly involved in drug dealing, policy or numbers rackets, or extortion is very similar to the problem most Klan members have. Many Mafia or KKK members are also found "not guilty" after prosecution because proving accessory links to crimes is not easy. Yup...we're having a devil of a time putting away Hell's Angel members up here. They're all innocent bystanders that just happened to be present when so-and-so got his head blown-off. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
benny Posted July 31, 2009 Report Posted July 31, 2009 I couldn't help but notice you were unable to point out where Mark Steyn lies. Can you point out one of his more famous examples? Mark Steyn is only a clown without pity compared to Will Kymlicka. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted July 31, 2009 Report Posted July 31, 2009 Mark Steyn is only a clown without pity compared to Will Kymlicka. Well I have zero respect for you, as well. Go tell teacher. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
benny Posted July 31, 2009 Report Posted July 31, 2009 Could it be out of a sense of honor that inmates attack Shafia and Hamed!? http://www.vancouversun.com/news/Kingston+...1738/story.html Quote
CANADIEN Posted July 31, 2009 Report Posted July 31, 2009 Yup...we're at the start of the loop and you're still not getting it. As I have said often on other threads, I do not get non-sense. I couldn't help but notice you were unable to point out where Mark Steyn lies. Can you point out one of his more famous examples? Where did I say he was a liar? Let me check... nowhere... Quote
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