WIP Posted February 11, 2009 Report Posted February 11, 2009 Nope...but such Chicken Little sentiments gave us a great one hit wonder back in 1969:In the year 2525.... Either way...it has been a good run....whoa...whoa. Ever hear the lesson about how a frog thrown into boiling water will jump out immediately, but a frog in lukewarm water that is slowly increased in temperature, will stay in and get cooked.........well that frog has the same limited time frame that you do, and if a frog next to him jumped out of the pot, he'd be calling him "chicken little" for leaving the nice comfortable pond. Quote Anybody who believers exponential growth can go on forever in a finite world is either a madman or an economist. -- Kenneth Boulding, 1973
WIP Posted February 11, 2009 Report Posted February 11, 2009 Using Zimbabwe as an example is useless since so many factors there resulted in the downfall of the once glorious breadbasket of Africa. Yes, there are so many things that were wrong with Zimbabwe, beginning with the institution of one party rule, that it's a bogus comparison to the merits or problems of short term deficit spending to prevent severe recessions. Quote Anybody who believers exponential growth can go on forever in a finite world is either a madman or an economist. -- Kenneth Boulding, 1973
eyeball Posted February 11, 2009 Report Posted February 11, 2009 We are almost certainly in that ecological bottleneck right now, It seems we're circling the drain in a lot of places alright. The black bear population were I live has clearly suffered the last few years with far fewer cubs and more skinny adults apparent. The salmon they need in the fall have been getting scarcer and last year's berry crop was basically a bust. Where would you get the idea we are a durable species? Our ability to survive in just about every corner of the planet. Our strategy has been to alter our environment and there is no doubt the capacity to do so too the extent we have has been the sheer diversity of the planet. Like I said though we're also a very weedy species and like rats, we can make a go of it on some pretty meager supplies. We'll even eat ourselves if it comes down to sheer survival. The problem most people have in coming to the realization that we are in the midst of a mass extinction right now is that these events move very slowly, and our timeframes are only able to look back a few decades at most, when we determine what we consider to be a normal environment. No kidding, apparently we can't even tell if we're in an economic recession until its too late. If humans are alive when CO2 levels double or quadruple what they are today, the ocean current conveyor system starts to shut down and we have a return of anoxic, poisoned oceans, any humans still alive will look at the smelly green ocean water and consider it as normal as the greenish coloured sky he or she sees when looking up. Personally, I am skeptical about whether the human race will survive such a catastrophe if it cannot be stopped. I am skeptical about whether many humans would even want to but if anything can make a go of it on pond scum I bet it will be a human. I guess we know where the green in soylent green will come from. If mass famine breaks out in Africa or Asia, do we expect that they will remain in their areas and slowly starve to death? Past history reveals that many major mass migrations and barbarian invasions have been started by a sudden change in climate in the home country. Both the westward invasions of the Huns, and later the Mongols, can be correlated with locusts swarms and loss of agriculture in Central Asia. People had room to spread into before but that's not the case now. The impoverished just won't have a chance and I suspect the process of starvation will continue to be due to a lack of distribution and remain a rather slow one for the most part. An invasion from a really impoverished region will be far more likely to resemble a desperate attempt to flee than anything. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
guyser Posted February 11, 2009 Report Posted February 11, 2009 . The black bear population were I live has clearly suffered the last few years with far fewer cubs and more skinny adults apparent. Have the spring bear hunt cancelled for a couple of years and you may be overun with black bears. We could ship a few thousand from north of Toronto since there are more than there should be. Read your posts a fair bit since I too was a logger in BC , Rossland area, and in Chapleau On, so interesting to read your hunt/fish posts. Quote
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 11, 2009 Report Posted February 11, 2009 Ever hear the lesson about how a frog thrown into boiling water will jump out immediately, but a frog in lukewarm water that is slowly increased in temperature, will stay in and get cooked.........well that frog has the same limited time frame that you do, and if a frog next to him jumped out of the pot, he'd be calling him "chicken little" for leaving the nice comfortable pond. If you want to worry about such things....please carry on like a boiled frog. I prefer mine fried. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
eyeball Posted February 12, 2009 Report Posted February 12, 2009 Have the spring bear hunt cancelled for a couple of years and you may be overun with black bears. We could ship a few thousand from north of Toronto since there are more than there should be. No hunting probably wouldn't hurt and there's been fears some gall-bladder harvesting might be going on too. What the hell are your bears eating, people? Read your posts a fair bit since I too was a logger in BC , Rossland area, and in Chapleau On, so interesting to read your hunt/fish posts. You must mean logging/fish posts. I'm not a hunter, I have whole schools of fish ghosts to keep me awake at night already thanks. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
WIP Posted February 12, 2009 Report Posted February 12, 2009 Our ability to survive in just about every corner of the planet. Our strategy has been to alter our environment and there is no doubt the capacity to do so too the extent we have has been the sheer diversity of the planet. Like I said though we're also a very weedy species and like rats, we can make a go of it on some pretty meager supplies. We'll even eat ourselves if it comes down to sheer survival. Our altering of the environment so far is unsustainable, so I can't buy the argument that we are a resilient species just based on our technological success. Ultimately, we are still part of the planet's biosphere, and we cannot survive if we totally devastate our own environment. As for what animals are resilient: first, I would begin with simple bacteria, as they have survived on this planet for three billion years before the first complex, multicellular organisms started developing. And they will continue on after earth changes kill off multicellular life about 500 million years from now. The type of life that we regard as important, have only been on this Earth about 500 million years....a small part of the planet's history in actual fact -- http://www.washington.edu/newsroom/news/20...e/k011303a.html Quote Anybody who believers exponential growth can go on forever in a finite world is either a madman or an economist. -- Kenneth Boulding, 1973
guyser Posted February 12, 2009 Report Posted February 12, 2009 No hunting probably wouldn't hurt and there's been fears some gall-bladder harvesting might be going on too. What the hell are your bears eating, people? Berries , lots of garbage, more berries. Ive tried to train them to eat a few poeple, but damn things are picky. The lack of srping bear hunt means there are lots around. You must mean logging/fish posts. I'm not a hunter, I have whole schools of fish ghosts to keep me awake at night already thanks. Correct, sorry about that. Dont know where I got hunter from. Quote
madmax Posted March 3, 2009 Report Posted March 3, 2009 Hamilton mill temporarily closes, affecting 2,100 And another ones bites the dust The move is driven by slumping demand in the steel sector. US Steel had already shut down their mills in the US, to deal with slumping demand. USSTEEL generated another record profit from its Nanticoke and Hamilton operations in the last quarter of 2008. One positive from this is that this is a temporary closure like layoffs of old. The vast numbers of plants that left while earning profits has hit Ontario Terribly hard. These jobs won't be coming back. Quote
Oleg Bach Posted March 3, 2009 Report Posted March 3, 2009 129 thousand individuals multiply that by three and that could create a lot of UIC dependant people - who if they did not recover and continued to decay emotionally and finacially would make for a lot of welfare cases.....now that was just the January figure for lost jobs in a certain sector. If this continues at this rate - total socialism will not be just the dream of some bleeding heart extremists, it will be not just a fancey but a neccessity - we will have no choice..people must be sustained...in the end all will come out stronger and we will have a better society in time - we could not continue as we were with over encouraged and expected continual growth. Consumerism as a reason for living could not continue either (walmart stampede and trampling) - was a sign.. The sky will be beautiful and blue and things will change as we slip into a higher form of consciousness - a more heavely state - things are changing - probably for the better - IF YOU WANT IT. No one will perish. Quote
madmax Posted March 5, 2009 Report Posted March 5, 2009 http://www.lfpress.ca/newsstand/Business/2...172431-sun.html How quickly things change... U.S. Steel more than doubles profit Wed, January 28, 2009 Email Print Write Size: A A A Share: By DANIEL LOVERING, THE ASSOCIATED PRESS PITTSBURGH -- United States Steel Corp.'s fourth-quarter earnings soared as strong pipe sales and an acquisition-related gain boosted results, but the steel maker forecast an operating loss in the current quarter due to the global economic slowdown. Within a few weeks of this announcement US STEEL has had to IDLE its' "acquisition". While the Hamilton Operation has been fingered for eventual closure, the highly profitable LEW has caught politicians by surprise. Perhaps the public should be surprised, but not politicians. Unless these politicians have their heads in the sand. Tony Clement was just in Sudbury making a statement how a recent foreign purchase and closure has "caught him by surprise". He uses the same comments in Hamilton. Is this his Industrial Policy? "Caught by Surprise" Get ready for US STEEL to line up at the trough. Quote
Oleg Bach Posted March 5, 2009 Report Posted March 5, 2009 Corporations can be shifty and super self serving. My little buddy Allan - was given the highest honour by a the biggest American Insurance company - they gave him the PRODUCER OF THE YEAR AWARD -- four months later they fired him for being incompetent. Go figure - maybe they hired an immigrant for mimium wage to replace the executive? This company simply got greed - they were insuring things and people in Iraq and Afhanistan - the premiums must have been huge...but just like a woman I know - who managed a Tim Hortons - that generated 3 million a year...they fired her...and hired a brown person for less..even though she got the place up and running. Speaking of Timmies...the first manager was fired also - but she sued for wrongful dismissal...and she was granted money very quickly....because her employment record was impecable....so what head office did after that to protect themselves from further possible litigations in the future - they created a new set of employment records for managers - all reading....incompitent and needing improvement" - to para phrase...so those corporations that take bail outs or simply bail out and leave workers stranded because the high management is rich and has had enough..working for a living...well...what can I say? Quote
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