Religious Right in Canada

[Oleg Bach]

Havung the taxpayer foot the bill isn't compasion its stupidity. We Can have a universally accessible healthsystem, that isn't 100% taxpayer funded.

They have a point. This is not the destruction of health care but maybe a re-creation of the old system that worked just fine. Sixty years ago the doctor made home visits - if you were poor - you could give him a chicken - if you had some means you could pour him a drink and give him a crisp bit of cash..as long as he was paid something he was pleased.

What might be worrying us is that the American system we so much fear has become persecutive.. Patients without money or little money are called "indigent" or "charity cases" and are held in contempt because doctors earn far to much and are maybe arrogant. The American system is a two tier system..ours would not be - It's kind of like those new resturants that say - pay what you can - some toss in 30 bucks and some toss in 3 bucks...and it all works out well.

[WIP]

Maybe instead of sentences we can interrogate the druggies to find out who their drug dealers are. Then we can administer tough justice to the dealers.

Look, this song and dance about a "war on drugs" has been played by politicians on both sides of the border for over 30 years now. Individual rights have been compromised, the powers of police have been increased, non-violent drug addicts have been thrown into prisons to be preyed upon by psychotics and violent offenders; and after decades of "tough on crime" politicians, there are more drugs on the streets, more drug addicts, and more profits for those who are willing to sell drugs on the blackmarket.

There is an old saying that goes something like: a sure sign of insanity is doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results! And when it comes to vice crimes, social conservatives are insane, or made insane because they are hung up on fighting sin instead of trying solutions that produce positive results. I'll be willing to wager that the tough on crime approach actually makes the overall situation worse, not better -- since the periodic police raids of marijuana grow-ops and crack houses, does not eliminate the demand for the product -- it only drives up the street prices for the drugs, and desperate addicts rob more people, break into more houses, steal more cars, do more tricks....whatever it takes to get the money to get the drugs from the available dealers who haven't been picked up in the sweep that is featured as the page one headline on the local newspaper.

How about if we try a different approach! Treat drug addiction as a public health problem, not a sin or a crime issue, since there is a segment of the population that is prone to compulsive/addictive behaviour, and are drawn like magnets to drugs, alcohol, gambling, risky sexual behaviour.....all sorts of reckless behaviour because of an unhealthy need for constant stimulation. Since addiction is better understood today, it should be time to treat them as people with an illness, rather than criminals, and in most cases, turning them into outright criminals to feed their addictions.

[Oleg Bach]

Maybe instead of sentences we can interrogate the druggies to find out who their drug dealers are. Then we can administer tough justice to the dealers.

If I know who all the drug dealers in the hood are - then the cops know...they are professionals - you don't pick on some chump user - and "interrogate" them ---- the user has no clue who the dealer is...What I observed is that one person will sit with a lap top...who appears to be the big cheeze dealer but is paid to supply a diversion...hires a person you would least expect to do drugs or carry them - physically carries the product. This is the delivery boy - and he does not deliver - another party goes to him as if he is the pantry and takes out what needs to be sold...Then the higher level dealer is some sixty five year old man who makes arrangements and collects the cash..This is not a complex system..and police don't bother wasting time with users - when they are ready they will take out the big guy - they are not stupid...but is there a political will to stop the sale of dope? I doubt that there is - we globaly next to oil are all dependant of the drug trade. Our modern economy partly depends on it - would you like to get rid of all drugs and find yourself the common guy suffering because of it...this is very entrenched and wide spread.

[Canapathy]

The Bible also teaches that homosexuality is a sin as is adultry and abortion.

Would you stone your disobediant child to death? Since you and the church pick and choose the Biblical teachings you abide by, how valid is the Bible as a moral compass?

[normanchateau]

Would you stone your disobediant child to death? Since you and the church pick and choose the Biblical teachings you abide by, how valid is the Bible as a moral compass?

According to our Prime Minister, there is a right and wrong determined merely by religious faith:

http://www.vancouversun.com/business/fp/Re...6754/story.html

[bjre]

Maybe instead of sentences we can interrogate the druggies to find out who their drug dealers are. Then we can administer tough justice to the dealers.

You know what, some US assemblyman want to legalize marijuana to rescue economy:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20090313/us_time/08599188495600

[eyeball]

You know what, some US assemblyman want to legalize marijuana to rescue economy:

QUOTE (MontyBurns @ yadda yadda)

Maybe instead of democracy we can shoot politicians who want to cut and run. Then we can administer tough justice to whoever we want.

[whowhere]

Would you stone your disobediant child to death? Since you and the church pick and choose the Biblical teachings you abide by, how valid is the Bible as a moral compass?

I doubt you have read the old testament and new testament. If you did you would know it is contradictory. You are free to think and believe what you want as it ultimately will not matter for you are still going to be dead, dead, dead. As I have stressed throughout the threads is septuagint was intoduced to greek society 300 years before jesus. The old testament stories were certainly widely circulating by the time of Jesus. It took 300 years for Christianity to pick up steam after his crucifixion.

This is historical fact. Was jesus legitimate or a fraud? Jesus said alot of things. Argueing over passages with whoever is pointless and waste of time. You either understand or you don't. In times of strife you must soldier on against the Human trash of the world.

When society becomes that of sodom and gommora, repressive and tyrannical you must rally the forces of life and obliterate the trash from your path to a happy and prosperous life.

Eye for Eye, tooth for a tooth. The fact is no one has any ground to stand on in the realm of God and Man. Do not let anyone brainwash you otherwise.

[MontyBurns]

Was jesus legitimate or a fraud? Jesus said alot of things.

Do you say this to your Islamic friends about Mohammed? I bet that you don't.

[DrGreenthumb]

In my view, if you break the law you pay the price. For example, if you are caught traffiking drugs you should be whipped publicly then thrown in jail. You cannot have a world where there are no consequences for bad behavior. It would be anarchy.

So we should punish people for committing a victimless "crime" by comitting assault with a weapon against them? The crime you advocate has a victim. I think we should make being an intolerant dick a crime punishable by a good public whipping, and then see if that makes Monty shut up. If not then I guess we can rule out the deterrant theory.

[normanchateau]

Was jesus legitimate or a fraud?

I suspect one's religious beliefs might influence one's answer, e.g., Christian vs Jewish or Muslim.

For those with no religious beliefs, one must rely on inferences and preferences rather than blind faith. Since Jews and Muslims believe they can't eat bacon and Christians and atheists can, Jesus sounds reasonably messiah-like.

[eyeball]

I suspect one's religious beliefs might influence one's answer, e.g., Christian vs Jewish or Muslim.

For those with no religious beliefs, one must rely on inferences and preferences rather than blind faith. Since Jews and Muslims believe they can't eat bacon and Christians and atheists can, Jesus sounds reasonably messiah-like.

I recall a Morrocon fellow that stayed with us years ago telling me that resisting the smell of frying bacon was just about the toughest test of faith he'd ever had to endure. I think it's probably what drove him to drink with us.

[normanchateau]

I recall a Morrocon fellow that stayed with us years ago telling me that resisting the smell of frying bacon was just about the toughest test of faith he'd ever had to endure. I think it's probably what drove him to drink with us.

And besides dead pig, Jesus also threw the door wide open to prawns, lobsters, crabs, squid, scallops and a bunch of other good fare which those who don't recognize him as the Messiah are prohibited from eating to this very day.

They'd love him in China if they weren't such materialist, godless atheists. :angry:

[whowhere]

I suspect one's religious beliefs might influence one's answer, e.g., Christian vs Jewish or Muslim.

For those with no religious beliefs, one must rely on inferences and preferences rather than blind faith. Since Jews and Muslims believe they can't eat bacon and Christians and atheists can, Jesus sounds reasonably messiah-like.

Being Atheist is still a belief, A belief in ones superiority and vanity. Bear in mind people can project this onto the world but you will only do so until someday someone holds you to account. Yes, I would agree identifying yourself as a Jew, Christian, or Muslim could influence ones actions/Reactions to life's forces. I myself look at the world we are in and then cross reference it with the stories to arrive at a conclusion.

Religion is for losers and corrupt societies.

Good and happy societies are to busy living and enjoying life to be dragged to the gutter. If society is going to wait for "God" to enforce what is right I suggest people read the old testament to get the consequences of such thinking. On the flip side if society is going to fan their is no God onto the people all the while engage in tyrannical and repressive attitudes on the people is a sure fire recipe for people to dust of the Old Testament and the New testament alike and inflict God Wrath upon the human trash of the world.

Once you have expunged the trash from the world, feel confident that God will obliterate them out of existence entirely. That is the story of the OT and NT.

As for refraining from eating Bacon and what not if it translates into Health and long living do it. If you know of people who are eating bacon and dying at 50 years old: Wake up!

[WIP]

Being Atheist is still a belief,

Look it up sometime! Atheism literally means NO theism, or no belief in God or Gods whatever. Atheism describes what a person doesn't believe, not what they do believe. To find that out, you may ask an atheist what they do believe in. Just don't expect every atheist to give you the same answer.....personally, I'm a secular humanist......so there! That's my belief.

A belief in ones superiority and vanity. Bear in mind people can project this onto the world but you will only do so until someday someone holds you to account.

So, you think it's vain to want to have reasons for believing in things, rather than just blindly following the family tradition, or plunging into a religion on faith? Someone like you, who believes punishment awaits those who have the wrong beliefs, does not have the luxury to be completely honest about the validity of Christian theology. A belief system that hangs out the threat of hellfire for not buying the evidence, is weak on actual evidence, since it has to resort to blackmail to convince adherents to stay with the faith.

[ToadBrother]

Being Atheist is still a belief, A belief in ones superiority and vanity.

Inventing private definitions is a fundamentally dishonest tactic. Doesn't the Bible state very clearly that you shall not bear false witness?

[normanchateau]

As for refraining from eating Bacon and what not if it translates into Health and long living do it. If you know of people who are eating bacon and dying at 50 years old: Wake up!

Being Jewish, Moses didn't eat bacon and according to the Old Testament, Moses lived to the age of 120...

[whowhere]

Inventing private definitions is a fundamentally dishonest tactic. Doesn't the Bible state very clearly that you shall not bear false witness?

Which book are you refering to? The old testament or the new? If you are refering to the old testament then you would know in that book it identifies two types of people. Those who believe in and support the of God of Adam and Eve and those who are heathens.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_...7&version=9

15And they rejected his statutes, and his covenant that he made with their fathers, and his testimonies which he testified against them; and they followed vanity, and became vain, and went after the heathen that were round about them , concerning whom the LORD had charged them, that they should not do like them.

16And they left all the commandments of the LORD their God, and made them molten images, even two calves, and made a grove, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served Baal.

[whowhere]

Look it up sometime! Atheism literally means NO theism, or no belief in God or Gods whatever. Atheism describes what a person doesn't believe, not what they do believe. To find that out, you may ask an atheist what they do believe in. Just don't expect every atheist to give you the same answer.....personally, I'm a secular humanist......so there! That's my belief.

Congratulation you have strung together letters from the Latin Alphabet to arrive at a word Atheism. You proceeded to define your world as such. Good on you. What do I care what you believe in. You are still slipping towards death to never be seen from or heard from ever again. In 10000 years people will dust off the The king James and look at the stories for what they are and cross reference it with the post history of the Roman Empire and likely shake their head at you losers.

So, you think it's vain to want to have reasons for believing in things, rather than just blindly following the family tradition, or plunging into a religion on faith?

I think you misunderstand my position. The world has been gripped by the proud and the arrogant. These people parade around as if they are gifts to the universe. Maybe so, but I am saying they will only project themselves on their fellow man until one day someone holds them to account for their imposing "pride."

Someone like you, who believes punishment awaits those who have the wrong beliefs, does not have the luxury to be completely honest about the validity of Christian theology. A belief system that hangs out the threat of hellfire for not buying the evidence, is weak on actual evidence, since it has to resort to blackmail to convince adherents to stay with the faith.

I suggest you read my posts. I have openly railed against so called christians. Christians have built their caslte out of glass. Their claim to fame is jesus had some connection with the children of Isreal and the Catholics are of the original church started by Jesus's apostles. The vatican uses the Latin Roman Language which the so called English Language is derived from.

The fact is, the Roman's god was jupiter and all other god's were subordinate to this God. These letters belong to Jupiter and that's a fact. So when you are at deaths door I suggest you figure out what you are about because really no one cares. The only one who does is you. Think how you want. That will not alter what is contained in the Old and new tesatment.

[WIP]

Congratulation you have strung together letters from the Latin Alphabet to arrive at a word Atheism. You proceeded to define your world as such. Good on you.

I can let alot of things slide by, but claiming that atheism is a belief system is not one of them, since it is a cheap tactic used by people who can't provide evidence for their own beliefs to claim that everyone has a religion, and atheists just have a different religion than the god-believer...no sale!

Once again, atheism negates believing in things that cannot provide evidence of their existence. From there the atheist is free to adopt or develop a wide array of naturalistic belief systems; so once again, if someone tells me they are atheistic, I do not know if they are on my wavelength other than not believing in the things that I don't believe in.

What do I care what you believe in. You are still slipping towards death to never be seen from or heard from ever again.

And I suppose you're going to live forever! Sounds like this mortality thing has you all bent out of shape. The truth is people who have come to terms with being mortal and living in a mortal universe (which will also die!) do a better job of preparing for the end than all of the religious people who claim that they have immortal souls which will live on after their bodies die. Maybe that's why, instead of the common wisdom that religious faith helps people deal with death and dying, this research paper published recently and cited by Huffpost blogger Valerie Talarico indicates the opposite: the devout cancer patients are three times as likely to seek aggressive, life-prolonging treatments and less likely to have their personal affairs in order than those who don't believe in life after death. So how firmly held is the belief in personal immortality? Apparently not firm enough since they show classic signs of avoidance behaviour.

In 10000 years people will dust off the The king James and look at the stories for what they are and cross reference it with the post history of the Roman Empire and likely shake their head at you losers.

In 10,000 years, the KJV bible will be of no more significance than any other religious text written during the Reformation....and it can't be cross-referenced with Roman historical records or any other historical period mentioned in the books of the bible......and assuming that they will call us losers from not seeing whatever magical significance you are looking for is not only an insult, it's an idiotic claim of possessing special secret knowledge!

I think you misunderstand my position. The world has been gripped by the proud and the arrogant. These people parade around as if they are gifts to the universe. Maybe so, but I am saying they will only project themselves on their fellow man until one day someone holds them to account for their imposing "pride."

The world is always gripped by the proud and arrogant....when has that ever changed? And who is going to hold them to account? End time apocalyptic nonsense.

I suggest you read my posts. I have openly railed against so called christians. Christians have built their caslte out of glass. Their claim to fame is jesus had some connection with the children of Isreal and the Catholics are of the original church started by Jesus's apostles. The vatican uses the Latin Roman Language which the so called English Language is derived from.

I have read previous posts, but I'm still lost when I try to follow your arguments.

The fact is, the Roman's god was jupiter and all other god's were subordinate to this God. These letters belong to Jupiter and that's a fact. So when you are at deaths door I suggest you figure out what you are about because really no one cares. The only one who does is you. Think how you want. That will not alter what is contained in the Old and new tesatment.

One thing I am sure of, when I am at death's door, assuming that I'm not killed in an accident or something first, the last thing I'll be thinking about is this crypto-gnostic nonsense.