Ottawa Needle Exchange Program

[jay22]

There are citizens that are affraid of the drug users as some are very agresive.Aslo needles are beeing left all over the place and the list goes on.Is it time will scrap it and got for a 500 bed treatment centre.

[AngusThermopyle]

There are citizens that are affraid of the drug users as some are very agresive.Aslo needles are beeing left all over the place and the list goes on.Is it time will scrap it and got for a 500 bed treatment centre.

I'm not really sure what your post is trying to say specifically. Are you asking if the needle exchange program should be scrapped and a 500 bed treatment center be opened instead?

[DogOnPorch]

There are islands in the high arctic that would make fine 'treatment facilities'. Needle 'exchange' programs just leave large amounts of 'junkie-refuse' clogging our alleys, parks and any other area those idiots shoot-up.

A solution? Free high-grade (pure, even) heroin...their last and best high. Voila. No more junkies.

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I had not taken a bath in a year nor changed my clothes or removed them except to stick a needle every hour in the fibrous grey wooden flesh of heroin addiction. I did absolutely nothing.

---William S. Burroughs

[guyser]

Needle 'exchange' programs just leave large amounts of 'junkie-refuse' clogging our alleys, parks and any other area those idiots shoot-up.

Uh DoP.....imagine for a moment what the "exchange" part in "needle exchange" is.....

Think it might be a one for one trade, in most instances?

[eyeball]

No more junkies? No, there will always be an endless supply of junkies I'm afraid.

Some pharmacists in Vancouver's Downtown Eastside routinely pay cash to drug addicts for filling their prescriptions, a CBC hidden-camera investigation has found.

The practice was revealed after several doctors complained that pharmacies were giving $10 a week or more to clients for each prescription filled if the drugs were dispensed daily. The daily prescription entitles the pharmacist to a daily dispensing fee, rather than a single fee for a long-term prescription.

A CBC hidden camera captured this image of a pharmacist giving cash to a customer filing a prescription on Vancouver's Downtown Eastside.

In the drug-ravaged neighbourhood, $10 cash buys a "rock" of crack cocaine.

Story

Apparently the government has been aware of this for months, presumably the same government that will be directed to round up junkies. The same one that sells booze while cracking down and getting tough with addicts...

The whole issue of substance use and especially the management of the issues it raises is just about as corrupt and perverted as it gets. Is there some supporting principle anywhere that provides a reason to believe DOP's solution will be the final one? Who's next in line after the junkies?

[DogOnPorch]

Uh DoP.....imagine for a moment what the "exchange" part in "needle exchange" is.....

Think it might be a one for one trade, in most instances?

"Needle Exchange" = Free Needles

They don't have to return the old spikes...at least in my area. There's a LOT of junkies here because of the program.

No sympathy...I deal with this garbage.

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Heroin...it's my wife...it's my life.

---Lou Reed

[DogOnPorch]

No more junkies? No, there will always be an endless supply of junkies I'm afraid.

Maybe not all. But after a good dose of pure heroin, the numbers should be down to a less disgusting level. Most of the crap on the street is very watered down.

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I dont know just where I'm going

But I'm gonna try for the kingdom, if I can

cause it makes me feel like I'm a man

When I put a spike into my vein...

---Lou Reed

[guyser]

"Needle Exchange" = Free Needles

They don't have to return the old spikes...at least in my area. There's a LOT of junkies here because of the program.

No sympathy...I deal with this garbage.

And I will apologize, I should have read your location and know it is different out there. My experience here is that they are given a needle to use in house, and thus not discarded outside.

But it would be worse without the exchanges available.

[DogOnPorch]

And I will apologize, I should have read your location and know it is different out there. My experience here is that they are given a needle to use in house, and thus not discarded outside.

But it would be worse without the exchanges available.

Towns and cities with the programs get to be known and actually attract junkies. Those less friendly...less junkies. My city tends to cater to them with numerous programs meant to help. The so-called 'four pillar' approach, I believe. Great for junkies...less so for normal citizens.

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Heroin, be the death of me...

[eyeball]

Maybe not all. But after a good dose of pure heroin, the numbers should be down to a less disgusting level. Most of the crap on the street is very watered down.

I'm just wondering, do you have a political party in mind that would give junkies a good dose of pure heroin? Are these treatment facilities you're proposing voluntary publicly funded suicide centers or did you have something more like a death camp in mind? Again I'm left wondering what political party you think might entertain this idea never mind facilitate it.

[DogOnPorch]

I'm just wondering, do you have a political party in mind that would give junkies a good dose of pure heroin? Are these treatment facilities you're proposing voluntary publicly funded suicide centers or did you have something more like a death camp in mind? Again I'm left wondering what political party you think might entertain this idea never mind facilitate it.

How is the weather up there in that ivory tower? Always sunny?

Anyways, when you wake up with a junkie passed out on your car, ask me that question again.

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Crossin' the highway late last night

He shoulda looked left and he shoulda looked right

He didn't see the station wagon car

The skunk got squashed and there you are!

---Loudon Wainwright

[eyeball]

Towns and cities with the programs get to be known and actually attract junkies. Those less friendly...less junkies. My city tends to cater to them with numerous programs meant to help. The so-called 'four pillar' approach, I believe. Great for junkies...less so for normal citizens.

Its more than just those less friendly, its those that are not willing to shoulder any responsibility for locating treatment facilities in their own neighbourhoods. You see the same sort of fear and loathing with mental illness. In my town, council turned down a proposal for an assisted living facility for mentally ill people. The reasons for doing so were a fear of needles in the streets amongst other things. Its no surprise your city attracts a lot of mentally ill people too given the stigma that drives so many away from their homes and families.

I'm convinced the fear and loathing for mentally ill people flows from the same well-spring that the vindictivness towards addiction does.

Now the mental illness NIMBY's are conspiring with the RCMP to profile addicts, and probably a few mentally ill people, and recruiting people to form neighbourhood spy and snitch committees. I couldn't help but notice the Stephan Harper election sign on one such committee member's lawn this morning.

Perhaps the plan is to herd all the addicts and wierdos towards Vancouver. The better to round them all up I suppose.

[guyser]

Anyways, when you wake up with a junkie passed out on your car, ask me that question again.

I have.

But I told her to go in and feed our kids.

[DogOnPorch]

Its more than just those less friendly, its those that are not willing to shoulder any responsibility for locating treatment facilities in their own neighbourhoods. You see the same sort of fear and loathing with mental illness. In my town, council turned down a proposal for an assisted living facility for mentally ill people. The reasons for doing so were a fear of needles in the streets amongst other things. Its no surprise your city attracts a lot of mentally ill people too given the stigma that drives so many away from their homes and families.

I'm convinced the fear and loathing for mentally ill people flows from the same well-spring that the vindictivness towards addiction does.

Now the mental illness NIMBY's are conspiring with the RCMP to profile addicts, and probably a few mentally ill people, and recruiting people to form neighbourhood spy and snitch committees. I couldn't help but notice the Stephan Harper election sign on one such committee member's lawn this morning.

Perhaps the plan is to herd all the addicts and wierdos towards Vancouver. The better to round them all up I suppose.

How many junkies in your 'hood'?

--------------------------------

Where a man can not be free

Of all of the evils of this town

And of himself, and those around

Oh, and I guess that I just dont know...

---Lou Reed

[DogOnPorch]

I have.

But I told her to go in and feed our kids.

How quaint. (refrains from cheap joke)

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Love is a bird, she needs to fly

Let all the hurt inside of you die

Youre frozen

When your hearts not open

---Madonna

[eyeball]

How is the weather up there in that ivory tower? Always sunny?

Anyways, when you wake up with a junkie passed out on your car, ask me that question again.

I've found a drunk or two passed out in my boat, that's pretty much the same thing don't you think?

[eyeball]

How many junkies in your 'hood'?

A few, nowhere near as many alcoholics though.

[guyser]

Perhaps the plan is to herd all the addicts and wierdos towards Vancouver. The better to round them all up I suppose.

It is actually easier than that.

Van and Toronto attract them for many reasons. All the junkies (ok not ALL) migrate to Van since they have 1) the weather. If I want to live on the street Fernie or 100 Mile House aint the place to do it ...2)facilities, needle exc etc,... 3)if I want help or to get into a recovery spot, Van is the place to start, ...4) if I want to blend in, Van is the place,...5) if I want good smack its hard to find in Castlegar , Rossland Fruitvale or Creston.

Toronto, much the same without the mild winters. All others factor the same.

Plenty of people in both locations take far more than their share of the junkies of society. Thats what grates most people.

[eyeball]

It is actually easier than that.

Van and Toronto attract them for many reasons. All the junkies (ok not ALL) migrate to Van since they have 1) the weather. If I want to live on the street Fernie or 100 Mile House aint the place to do it ...2)facilities, needle exc etc,... 3)if I want help or to get into a recovery spot, Van is the place to start, ...4) if I want to blend in, Van is the place,...5) if I want good smack its hard to find in Castlegar , Rossland Fruitvale or Creston.

1. Check

2. Check again

3. Van is the place of last resort because of small town NIMBYISM. Why should it or Toronto shoulder the burden?

4. The city is a place of refuge from the social stigma resulting from NIMBYISM.

5. I doubt it.

Toronto, much the same without the mild winters. All others factor the same.

Plenty of people in both locations take far more than their share of the junkies of society. Thats what grates most people.

So it should but that's no excuse for just taking aim at the junkies, they're mostly a symptom and victimized much like the mentally ill are. Its no coincidence the treatment for one is pretty much the same as treating the other. Its also no coincidence that both are easy targets for NIMBY's.

Edited September 8, 2008 by eyeball

[DogOnPorch]

A few, nowhere near as many alcoholics though.

Lots of those here, as well. Meth and crack-heads are another fine group.

I've found a drunk or two passed out in my boat, that's pretty much the same thing don't you think?

While booze can indeed be a huge social problem, it is legal in this country. Heroin, meth and crack are different animals. If you don't see that, you haven't really been exposed to it, I suspect. Meth-heads in particular can be rather crazy-violent. But, no worries...you won't find them passed out unless they're crashing. Then they seem almost dead. You can even drag them up or down stairways.

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Yeah, I know I'm ugly...I said to a bartender, 'Make me a zombie.' He said, 'God beat me to it.'

---Rodney Dangerfield

[eyeball]

Lots of those here, as well. Meth and crack-heads are another fine group.

While booze can indeed be a huge social problem, it is legal in this country. Heroin, meth and crack are different animals. If you don't see that, you haven't really been exposed to it, I suspect.

Meth-heads in particular can be rather crazy-violent. But, no worries...you won't find them passed out unless they're crashing. Then they seem almost dead. You can even drag them up or down stairways.

Just like a drunk, passed out after bingeing on governement supplied liquor.

Sure we see meth, heroin and crack here. Booze however is by far and away the biggest problem though, the rest don't even come close. Even when the kids from the cities come into town for the big rave they hold here every year, booze is the number one problem that the rest of all the drugs used at these things don't even come close to posing. My kids are involved with the security at this annual event and I know several of the ambulance staff that confirm the same thing. The cops of course are primarily focused on the illegal drugs.

Stories about court cases involving alcohol fuelled family violence easily outnumber stories about other court cases in our local paper by about 10 - 1. Why is it legal again? Would there be some over-arching ethical or social principle at stake if it wasn't?

[guyser]

While booze can indeed be a huge social problem, it is legal in this country. Heroin, meth and crack are different animals.

Careful there dog. Booze is a huge problem. Probably costs us more than the others combined.

And since when is the legality of the product an excuse for the damage caused? Do we really care that my car was keyed by a junkie or a drunk? I was robbed, does it matter he was drunk or smacked out?

Eyeball, you are correct that it is no excuse, I was just positing why people get frustrated.

By the way, that was your boat? Sorry man, they all look alike.

[DogOnPorch]

When I say 'seems dead' I mean seems dead. One constable and I were positive one was a goner only to come to 'life' after paramedics had a go at him. Then he got violent.

Not sure why booze is legal. Too much tax money, no doubt. Marijuana seems to cause a lot less problems. Some suspect that the reason is that booze was a 'white thing' while pot was a 'black thing'. Now if that's true or not, I'm, again, not sure.

I used to conduct raves...they truly suck from a security point-of-view. Stopped doing them after numerous problems including violence and drugs. "E" and LSD were the big drugs at those things.

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There are three side effects of acid: enhanced long-term memory, decreased short-term memory, and I forget the third.

---Dr. Timothy Leary

Edited September 8, 2008 by DogOnPorch

[DogOnPorch]

Careful there dog. Booze is a huge problem. Probably costs us more than the others combined.

And since when is the legality of the product an excuse for the damage caused? Do we really care that my car was keyed by a junkie or a drunk? I was robbed, does it matter he was drunk or smacked out?

Eyeball, you are correct that it is no excuse, I was just positing why people get frustrated.

By the way, that was your boat? Sorry man, they all look alike.

I never said booze wasn't a problem. However, many folks enjoy a few brew without beating their wives or clubbing their husbands with a golf club. At least in my experience. Same with pot. Seems to 'mellow them out' more than making them all hyper.

Re: keying cars. Junkies and drunks key cars? Any proof that the two are linked..ie drugs and keying cars?

Re: being robbed. Were you robbed, ever? Was the robber drunk, stoned or sober? Could you tell?

Most property crime here in this city and I believe as well in Vancouver is the result of drug addicts stealing stuff to sell for a fix.

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A junkie runs on junk time. When his junk is cut off, the clock runs down and stops. All he can do is hang on and wait for non-junk time to start.

---William S. Burroughs

Edited September 8, 2008 by DogOnPorch

[eyeball]

I never said booze wasn't a problem. However, many folks enjoy a few brew without beating their wives or clubbing their husbands with a golf club. At least in my experience. Same with pot. Seems to 'mellow them out' more than making them all hyper.

Re: keying cars. Junkies and drunks key cars? Any proof that the two are linked..ie drugs and keying cars?

Re: being robbed. Were you robbed, ever? Was the robber drunk, stoned or sober? Could you tell?

Most property crime here in this city and I believe as well in Vancouver is the result of drug addicts steeling stuff to sell for a fix.

You are aware of the detailed knowledge about the relationships between prohibition, supply and demand, crime, the need to steal etc aren't you, or do you just choose to dismiss it?