Evening Star

I'm just not totally sure, in this case, why Chamberlain would be a 'leftist' and Churchill would be a 'rightist'. Churchill also had a significant stint in the Liberal Party and also believed in many statist measures. He led a wartime coalition with Clement Attlee's truly socialist Labour Party, to whom he entrusted the domestic economy.

You know Chamberlain was a Conservative, right?

Indonesia did take and rule East Timor from 1975 to 1999, right?

But were Bill Davis's PCs really conservative in the present-day sense? I haven't studied it much but what I've heard and read, they were a little to the left of the Ontario Liberals of the time on labour and social programmes.

If that's all it was, the NDP should have been popular, not Broadbent himself. And, while the party did do better in 1988 than it ever had before, Broadbent was far more popular personally than his party, more so even than Mulroney, who was a brilliant communicator. Because Petro Canada and the FIRA are less universally loved than socialized health insurance, I'm guessing? Broadbent is important mainly for leading the NDP to what used to be a record level of success.

I was wondering the same thing.

I don't get that either. Broadbent was the most popular party leader in the 80s. I'm guessing this must indicate that he had an ability to communicate (as opposed to, say, dashing good looks). My point was just that the NDP's failure cannot be blamed on their leaders' inability to communicate. I just don't agree that the 'left' message is inherently more superficially appealing to people

I know that it's constitutionally protected but, yes, I think the biggest fundamental problem with public education in ON is public funding for Catholic schools (and no, Tory's proposal would not have helped things. Btw, I'd kind of been assuming that, since they're publicly funded, our Catholic schools still have to teach a standard curriculum when it comes to e.g. evolution. Tell me I'm not wrong? Do agree here. And since I may not have been clear earlier, I genuinely think that higher education is in a state of dire crisis right now.

I was referring to subsidies for the Alberta oil sands, the proposed cancellation of which has not been an asset for Layton in AB. What about cuts to the GST? Cuts to income and corporate taxes, generally? August, is this why the NDP has dominated postwar Canadian political history so thoroughly? Douglas, Broadbent, and Layton have all been strong communicators after all, so that's not the issue. "We will protect you from the enemies outside our borders (by ramping up military spending) and give you freedom from the parasites within our borders (by slashing your taxes and building prisons)" has certainly proven to be a saleable message in the US. The milder version seems to work here. I certainly don't think it's any less marketable than "We will raise taxes and spend the money on collective projects." Janice McKinnon was Romanow's finance minister in SK.

Yeah, with secondary education, I can see some of the things you're talking about, though we didn't have school swimming pools iirc! Stuff like "Do your OAC in France!" seemed a little OTT to me even then. 13 grades was totally unnecessary, I agree. I graduated in 1997 so I guess I missed the full force of the cuts to elementary/secondary ed and felt them in university. (Actually, I remember teachers bitching about Rae's social contract in my day!)

I have to wonder what "everyone" means here. No one accuses Layton of saying "yes" to the oil industry, for example, or to asbestos mining companies, or to the pro-Israel lobby. It was not Layton's idea to give tax credits for things like children's sports programmes. Does it only count as saying "yes" to 'everyone' when you say "yes" to the poor or disadvantaged?

If these are the only three options, I prefer the current system. -- I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to some moderately higher consumption taxes though. I thought it was a mistake to reduce the GST.

The definition of a "progressive tax" is that the tax rate itself (not just the number of dollars) grows progressively higher as income increases, right?

Oh sure, but you earn significantly more than minimum wage (and even more than a postal worker, I'm guessing) as an owner/manager. People were comparing letter carriers to the minimum-wage guy who gets your order at Tim Horton's (a job I've done, albeit rather briefly). And I do think that carrying a 35-lb bag outdoors all day, regardless of the weather, would place greater physical demands on someone, with a much higher incidence of workplace injury.

Well, here's the Fraser Institute study I was referring to: http://www.fraserinstitute.org/publicationdisplay.aspx?id=17134&terms=fiscal+performance+premiers Do you have a source for your claim to the contrary?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_Way_%28centrism%29 I always assumed that folks like Rae were referring especially to Tony Blair's 'New Labour' approach. -- That's still relatively fuzzy, though, which may be what you're getting at.

Yeah, actually, I have no real sense of his views on economic policy or if he even has very strong ones, beyond a general appreciation for the 'Third Way'. As I said, I'm not sure if he was all that committed to social democracy even when he was an NDP premier. Odd, considering he was Broadbent's finance critic.

Tbh, though, my sense is that, even as an NDP premier, Rae was more sincerely committed to issues like same-sex benefits, employment equity, Native rights, standardization in education, 'distinct society' BS, etc than he was to a serious effort at social democratic economic policies or labour advocacy.

This was a pretty well-known statement, giving reasons why he left the NDP: http://www.cjpac.ca/statements/read/8/235 I do believe that he was sincere about those reasons. He posts regular statements on his blog: http://bobrae.liberal.ca/ Whether all of this adds up to a compelling alternative to the Conservatives and NDP is another question, however. The answer to that remains to be seen imo. I can see how it could. (Giving the length of his service, I kind of doubt he was short on pension btw.)

It's possible to have that viewpoint, and even to ask your guest tough questions, without being completely disrespectful and also somewhat incoherent. Erickson didn't even pose an intellectual challenge for Gillis as much as she just acted completely obnoxious. Compare this to e.g. the way Michael Coren treats Sid Ryan on his show. Even Glenn Beck let Frank Llewellyn speak without interrupting him in the way Erickson did: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSqy3BmMBGs

Could you expand on this? Are you talking strictly about elementary/secondary education or post-secondary as well? I'm really curious since I'm in the field of post-secondary education, which really doesn't seem obese to me, although it's certainly doing better than in parts of the States. Actually, I'll be teaching much smaller classes for better pay in SK in the fall. I was in high school during the Harris era, actually. I don't remember the cuts as being super-devastating but I also never had the feeling that the system was excessively bloated, although I'm not even sure what that would mean tbh. -- OK, let me fix that. I was in both high school and undergrad in the Harris era. The ramp-up in tuition over the course of my four years of undergrad was definitely impressive. I tend to blame Martin for that at least as much as Harris though.

Letter carriers' jobs are surely more physically demanding than Tim Horton's workers'.

He was a Young Liberal in the 60s but, at least according to Wikipedia, became an NDP member in 1974. He was a prominent NDP MP and finance critic from 1978-1982, playing an important role in bringing down Clark's government. He spent more than two decades in the NDP. I personally tend to think Rae's views did genuinely change over his career.

Tilter's previous post was about the NDP though: I do agree that it's not fair to stereotype Conservatives.

Not at all. They are politicians.