Sir Bandelot

Pakistani refugee crisis perilous for government Extremists are filling needs that the government can't Mon., May 25, 2009 Pakistan - Bacha Zab, a 32-year-old fruit salesman, dodged army shelling and Taliban sniper fire to escape his native Swat Valley. But when he reached the safety of a government-run refugee camp in this northwestern Pakistani city, he was told there was no more room. Instead, for the past 16 days, Zab, his wife and their four children have been in the care of a private Islamic charity with close ties to a banned militant organization. "We are asking for help from the government, but they won't give it," Zab said. "In the government camps, there are only problems." Only a fraction of the displaced civilians are receiving assistance in government-run camps. The rest are fending for themselves or getting help from private charities, including some that are allied with the very forces the Pakistani army is fighting in Swat. Well dude I hope that aid marked "Made in USA" is going to arrive real soon. Otherwise these are just more worthless military exercises resulting only in human suffering, and increasing hatred against the west. On the "State of the Union" (CNN) show yesterday a US senator admitted that al-qaida is now "stronger than they ever have been". I say this is why. We bomb the shit out of the militants but do very little to help the collaterals. That is not in our narrow purview.

lmao

Well Oleg, you did not answer my question... because you know that your son does not deserve jail just because he commits the "crime" of smoking marijuana. It may be a stupid thing to do, it may even lead him to become a lazy good for nothing bum (although there's many who smoke and yet do not become losers). But you must agree, jail is for the bad boys, not someone who likes to smoke a joint. Imagine if someone like him gets a criminal record, for the rest of their life treated like an ex-con, unable to get the good jobs, treated in the same way as rapists and thieves... that is not justice.

There is no urgent crime problem that must be dealt with, despite what this government is trying to tell us. The system is working. If anything, real deterrent begins by reducing poverty and improving the standards of education. The evidence is in- as our society becomes more tolerant and fair, crime numbers are going down. For the same reason I also think that proposed mandatory minimums are unnecessary. But despite that, there will never be a utopian society completely free of crime. Even if we do all the right things, there will always be defective personalities as well as crimes of passion.

In fact statistics are showing that violent crimes are on the decrease. I blame it on the liberal education systems, and multiculturalism.

Really? Then explain how a thread like this, with the provokative title is "mature"...

I have worked in the system for over 22 years. Incompetence is rampant. These numbers are probably lower than actual reality, due to cover ups and no investigations. People die also because of lack of proper funding, closing down services and lack of oversight in proper spending of the money- as in my case, where hospital management spends thousands a year to go on trips, "conferences" which include fancy dinners and entertainment events, yet the technical staff are denied proper training courses to upgrade their skills. That is just one small example. The reality of hospital life is not like "ER".

"Trusted politician"... an oxymoron.

Hecklers provoke, just to fan the flames. When you read the bulk of their posts you'll find, they really have no position at all.

Brand names such as "Liberal", "Conservative" have no meaning when applied to individuals. Who really is a "Liberal" through and through? Beyond their political party affiliations I mean. Even politicians jump ship, go to the "other side" when its to their personal advantage. I think such loyalty to a brand name with fixed ideas, is foolish. The whole idea that liberalism and conservatism must be mutually exclusive, is foolish.

That may all be true but the question I ask you now is, does your son deserve to go to jail for what he is now, I mean for smoking pot. Is he enough of a threat to others that he should be incarcerated? Will jail help him? Or will another, better approach help him? Think about whats best for your son, what he really needs and what he deserves, before you answer the question.

No, but then we become the terrorists. As it seems most terrorists are fearless, people of faith.

I said they have come to their own conclusion... that they want islamic sharia law, not western democracy. And they did not run away from the taliban, but they are running now. Now who is saying they don't think for themselves? You sir! Come on... Thats a crock of shit....been on any militay operations have you ? They been operating in the area for 8 years now i think the got the basics on how to fight a protracted Campaign ....and while i will agree with you there are alot opf people that don't want our help....most of them are terrorized that it will bring about a taliban reprisal.....not because we are not understood....or we are alien to them.... Been hearing that for a while now. Maybe the people don't want the Taliban, but they don't want us even more. My call is, they are all the Taliban. Our government calls anyone who opposes the western forces for whatever reason, Taliban. The people in swat valley are not taliban, but they would welcome them before they welcome western infidels. It is against their religion. Of course government spokesmen will speak to the contrary. What else would you expect. Again, 10,000 vocal supporters in swat valley hold a different view. And as for aid being stolen and diverted- UN says Hamas seized Gaza food aid and blankets Aid Groups Say Myanmar Food Stolen by Military Donations Diverted Food Aid For Storm Victims Rerouted And Sold At Marketplace $13 Billion in Iraq Aid Wasted Or Stolen, Ex-Investigator Says etc. I suggest we wait for another month or so and see where this is at. I hope you are right, that there will finally be some real progress. But so far every map I look at shows the Taliban rising. Troops clear out an area, then move on, then the Taliban come right back in again. They offer food and medicine to the people. Probably stolen, but I suspect that they also have financial support from outside. If you can't get the people to believe in you, its just a wasted effort. And lots of aid money from the west helps grease the wheels.

Exactly. The "Saudification" of society... what our country really needs.

I do not portray them as such, nor do I believe they are stupid, so you stop putting words in my mouth. As for knowing why this war started, if your trying to say that the civilians are on the governments side, I doubt it. When I read that 10,000 supporters in the swat valley came to hear the local cleric give a speech, saying that democracy is anti-islamic, I think that story speaks for itself. As I said earlier, they did not have to run away when they were under their own sharia law. Incidentally, they are Pashtun, not Taliban as the media portrays. It's clear that the pashtun want to live by sharia law. I hope so, we shall see about that. Or will it instead be stolen, diverted elsewhere by forces who don't want that aid to arrive, who would rather see them starve than get help from the west? It's happened before. This is a war of ideology, not as simple as shooting some people and then shaking hands with tribal leaders. There are many, many there who don't want our interference, in ANY way. And more each day, as resentment grows. We are just as alien to them, as they are to us. No, NOT regardless of what they spend the money on, this is the same foolish knee-jerk reactionary response we have seen before. Its obvious that what we want is not what they want, they couldn't care less what we want, but they'll take our money make some platitudes to keep us happy, then meanwhile quietly continue on their agenda. There are people at the highest level of government, in both Afghanistan and Pakistan, who support the fundamentalists. This just shows what a snake pit we are in. You don't think that expanding their nuclear arsenal with the help of foreign aid is a problem? Can't you think past the end of your own rifle? This has becoming a worse problem every day, in some very surprising ways. We must not ignore the longer term outcomes, just because we have to scramble to put out daily fires... they do keep getting bigger. "the taliban will be destroyed...." We've been hearing that one for about 8 years now. Looks even less likely today than it did then. Unless of course you plan on killing every single rag head.

Glad that you have a sense of humour... I could not resist taking that cheap shot at you! But you really do set your ass up for it, sometimes... I will try to show more restraint in the future. I think your posts are fine. Highly varied in scope, funny at times, but fine... Anyway my point is, let he who is without sin, etc. Theres the drug that is legal and the drug thats illegal. But everyone's taking some. Some people, muslims for instance do not drink alcohol, for a variety of reasons, religious, physical health (some cannot digest it because they lack the enzyme). As a certain judge told my friend in his minor possession case several years ago, "Well, even I need a drink after a hard days work, although I've never smoked pot..." The charges were dropped. So if there is no other crime committed besides the substance abuse, whats the problem. We all agree that any substance abuse taken to extremes can be harmful to the user. So now all who are on valiums for the past thirty years, raise your hand- its a coping mechanism, a medical problem. Not for the criminal court, and thats my position on it. Only real problem I see is, now that its been prohibited for so long, if/ when it ever becomes decrim there will be a party across the land, an orgy of rampant and excessive abuse in the short term while users celebrate with complete abandon. I could be wrong... I hope I'm wrong. To answer this one could look at the UK, who downgraded their classification of marijuana, but then about one year later upgraded it back to a controlled substance again. The real reason for this move is not quite clear.

Thats the problem in an ideological war, you can't win unless you kill every one of them, and put their children into re-education camps. Even if they surrender and say they accept our culture and our politics, there's always a suspicion that they are just faking it, and so ideological wars are much more brutal than wars for control of land or resources. In this case I doubt that the Taliban will arrive at the refugee camp in a truck that says "Taliban" on the roof. But here's a situation I think we must avoid- If we do nothing to help the 1 million or so refugees, if they are instead helped by a group that supports islamic fundamentalism, ie. the Home-boys who already live there, what will happen? Those people will say, "We are here to help you, to protect you from the infidel westerners who drove you out of your homes." Then we lose the war of ideas. On the other hand, I understand that certain military aid now being sent to Pakistan is being diverted to build more nukes. Not directly... they take the money to pay for civilian and military operations, then use their own money to build more A-bombs. Pakistan has a history of using western aid, weaponry and troops to bolster their position in the region.

no its not

"Following a month of abstinence, men and women who smoked pot at least 5,000 times in their lives performed just as well on psychological tests as people who used pot sparingly or not at all, according to a report in the latest edition of the Archives of General Psychiatry." http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/2001/1.../marijuana.html There doesn't seem to be a relationship between heavy marijuana use and stupidity/ low intelligence. But for information on the effects of long term alcohol abuse, please refer to the body of Oleg's posts.

No difference than booze looks like currently, I'd guess. One difference is second hand smoke, I heard it can get other people high, whether they want to or not.

Get a room

LoL Ok, sorry

Yup, just take a look at the story going around about Nancy Pelosi. They all know about it, and when outed they try to point the finger the other way. Thats why I hold no "loyalty" to a party, just because they call themselves such and such. Whether it be left or right, in this case that is for mindless flag waving fools. Actually the loyal followers of GOP should be very pleased with the Obama administration, except that they can't get over the brand name.

Oh, you forgot your little joke face... though I'm quite sure you were just dieing to use it. Guess I had an impact on you

Don't flatter yourself... you are not that important. I just find you boring, and irrelevant.