joan

The name of the film escapes me, but I believe she managed to hold onto the bridge support. Excuse me then for telling you things you already knew. Who woulda thought!

Well Pauline Johnson was a (Mohawk) "terrorist" too then! They are sons and grandsons, doing what their wives, mothers and especially their grandmothers want them too, that's all: defending the law, both theirs and ours ... because our governments don't 'observe' our laws or uphold our Constitution, see. Next time you see them, just wave and say thanks. Upholding Canada's Constitution is a tough job, but somebody has to do it!!

Only you would make a sick "observation" like that. You are the one protesting the police. I have no problem with them.

The truth is written in black ands white very clearly on the lease and mortgage agreements arranged by the government. They say that if payment is in default, the land reverts to Six Nations. The Haldimand Tract reverted to Six Nations long ago, but the government doesn't have the guts to tell Canadians that they issued them fraudulent 'land titles', though most people know it is true. Six Nations will do a much better job of informing people of the truth. Our governments don't seem to know what "truth" is. The 1841 surrender of the Plank Road is no longer relevant. It put the land in trust of the government, but none of the sales and lease payments were made - except a few lots in Caledonia perhaps - so all of the land reverted to Six Nations due to default on payment. I'm sure that if things were to happen to members of Six Nations not many people would be all that concerned anymore. That is a disgusting, threatening, violent statement, and will be saved and remembered in the event something does happen to anyone. I will point the cops to you. Seems like you are really losing your grip. :P :lol:

I don't believe there is any difference, noah: NONE but a few lots were paid, all are in default, and reverted to Six Nations long ago.

Speaking of 'race conscious', Angus ... you are just jumping all over about me mentioning 'white nationalists', aren't you? hmmm

Wet blanket time: At that time (OKA) two Canadian soldiers threw 2 fourteen year old girls from Kahnewake off the Mercier bridge. One narrowly avoided getting sucked into the propellor of a passing freighter, had a smashed pelvis and cannot have children. That is what I think of when I see that photo: How two young Canadian soldiers saw two angry 14 year old girls as enemies that should be disposed of.

HDI formalizes a process that has already been occurring since November 2006. Developers throughout the Haldimand Tract began approaching the Confederacy for consultation at that time, and have continued to line up at their doors since. To date, developers have maintained confidentiality about their agreements with the Confederacy. I understand developers have been told there is no point in them trying to sue the Confederacy because they would lose in court. As yet, there is no sign of the developers suing the municipality/province for issuing permits in bad faith.

Is Detlor plan a positive step forward? By WES KELLER Freelance Reporter DELETED by moderator http://www.citizen.on.ca/news/2008/0124/Local_news/041.html

I occasionally slip and refer to them that way, but they identify themselves as "white nationalists" just to be clear.

Well the particular group I was referring to above are those who call themselves "white nationalists". The choice of racializing their identity is theirs, not mine.

Certainly ... except none of the settlers paid their mortgages or leases, so all agreements are in default and the land HAS ALREADY reverted to Six Nations, according to the terms of the leases and mortgages arranged by the government. See? And the government has not provided an accounting of Six Nations trust fund, so they are not negotiating in good faith toward even a financial settlement, because it is too big for our govs/us taxpayers to handle. See? So Six Nations is asserting jurisdiction, wants a say in development and a share of revenues. This is a much less drastic, more collaborative approach than bankrupting the province. As they say, "We are all still going to be here". Gotta work it out. No question about that.

I am not talking about a race. I am talking about aho's. They come in all colours. However, I was referring to self identified white nationalists, as above. If the shoe fits ... ? Otherwise, I am not talking about you. Your choice.

I AM a non-aboriginal white woman.

There is a group of racist trolls who populate discussion boards to bait people and to promote their particular form of hatred. Their online home is stormfront.org. They are self-declared "white nationalists" who believe Canada should be a whiteman's country only. There are other paid agitators who also populate public discussion boards to promote their handlers' agenda, usually a corporate agenda. THAT is why every discussion about Aboriginal issues turns into a melee: because there are people who seek out such discussions to intentionally attack aboriginal people. It is either their (pathetic) 'life' or their livelihood. You can tell who they are: when confronted with their lie, they will turn around and say the same lie again tomorrow. It isn't about discussing and learning for them, but about imposing a rigid anti-native agenda on ALL Canadians. It is about sustaining systemic racism, for the cause of the white supremacists, or the corporations, or the governments, and in some cases the churches. I am pleased to hear you say the moderator is aware that such trolls are here to bait people. I am glad to know they are not the ones running the board.

I am not interested in your personal life. I was just pointing out your use of the "broadbrush" in ascribing motives to ALL ABORIGINAL PEOPLE based on your experience with a few.

See the ? It was a joke! get a grip.

For the benefit of Six Nations ... funds to be placed in their trust account, which the government 'managed' as trustee. Whatever was not paid for is still their land. Very few payments were made, and money was embezzled from their account without permission. That is why the land in the Haldimand Tract is still theirs. Six Nations has been asking for an accounting of their trust fund for decades, possibly more than a century, and the government has not done it yet! WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU??

I think, to be fair, I have to say that Dalton has told developers to consult with the HDI, just not to pay them. Interesting that he is now incorporating HDI into the formal process of municipal planning. Excellent! That is what is needed to resolve disputes before they start! AND it is the LAW ! So ... He had better make this the requirement for all other municipalities too! And he'd better shut up about not paying them too: All the municipal people in those discussion are being paid!

QUOTE(kengs333 @ Jan 23 2008, 08:37 AM) * Boy, you heathens just don't get it, do you? you are very funny

Sorry ... no link to article. Here's the link to the paper (subscription required) http://www.theturtleislandnews.com/ This will provide you with another side of the story, since the mainstream media just doesn't 'get it'. Turtle Island News, Six Nations: Editorial Ontario offered nothing, HDI fills void For the first time in 200 years Six Nations has begun to exert its jurisdiction over land it owns within the Haldimand Tract, that's land 10 km (or six miles) on either side of the Grand River. And that has Ontario throwing a hissy fit. Ontario wasn't overly concerned with Six Nations huffing and puffing about jurisdiction, land claims or sovereignty. To Ontario those are nice little political catch phrases that have meant nothing to the province as it continues on its merry way to develop Six Nations lands, without permission, and selling and buying Six Nations land without permission. But the political landscape has changed. Canada's Supreme court has ordered governments to consult with First Nations in cases of land disputes or where they have an aboriginal interest in the land. And that has Ontario kicking and screaming. For the first time they actually have to talk to First Nations people in Ontario, the province with the largest population of First Nations people, but the province with the least interest in working with First Nations and talking to them, until now, when the courts ordered them to. And despite the Supreme Court order, Ontario is still trying to wiggle out of its obligation to consult and there lies the rub. Instead of talking to Six Nations and working with them on a plan for lands under dispute, Ontario would rather hold a press conference and decry only Ontario municipalities can issue development fees. Yet Ontario doesn't bother to explain when it got permission from Six Nations in the first place to issue any kind of fees on Six Nations lands along the Grand. And it launches a misinformation campaign to Ontario voters that continues to leave them in the dark about Six Nations and other First Nations rights. In fact the campaign is bordering on terrorist activities. Instead, just like the Mafia style extortion tactics it accuses First Nations of, Ontario is using mainstream media who also don't understand their news stories aren't news, but propaganda that they too are spewing, simply because no one in Ontario wants to admit that in fact maybe, just maybe Six Nations is right. Because if Six Nations is right, so are all the other First Nations. The Six Nations Confederacy Council came up with a plan. A plan that brings all the parties to the table and invokes a disciplined policy that satisfies both the developers involved and allows for Six Nations interests. Ontario offered nothing. Because Ontario failed to fill the void, Six Nations did. Rather than see development stop up and down the Grand as frustration continues to grow among Six Nations people tired of no resolution to their long outstanding land claims, the Confederacy Council put in place a policy and plan that works with all the parties involved. And that no doubt irritates Ontario who wants to decide for Six Nations what 'consultation' will be. The attitude is paternalistic, smacks of political terrorism with the threat of OPP hanging over First Nations heads, but McGuinty grabbed a headline and satisfied the very small but vocal group of misguided individuals in Caledonia who's only gripe is no one has bought their houses, in their peaceful neighbourhood for the outrageous prices they have set on them, (some three times what the property is worth). The local economy is damaged not because of any Reclamation but because of the antics of Caledonia residents themselves. As a result of their road blocks, harassment, assaults, racism and threats, Six Nations people stopped shopping in that town, a town that suddenly realized that they exist because of Six Nations money. Talk about extortion rackets. Ontario wrote the book, implemented laws to justify their actions and then whined when Six Nations said enough is enough! ............................. A different story than you will hear from our governments and our media. Canada has no claim to the land, because Canada defaulted on payment and the Haldimand Tract land reverts to Six Nations, according to the original agreements. However, the negotiators won't tell the truth because the governments won't, so Six Nations is telling the truth to all people living in their jurisdiction, and they are asserting rights to have a say in development and a share in revenues. I say ... good for them! Because our governments will NEVER tell us the truth! Even though we all as citizens have to be aware ... sometimes they lie, or fail to tell the whole truth ... no different ... to the court they are both lies ... our courts ... are not entirely bad ... but our governments are. imo Now I have a few links to find for documents you may want to check out. - The supposed 1841 land surrender No. 50 pages 119, 120, 121, 122 & 123. http://www.canadiana.org/ECO/PageView?id=6...play=91942+0204 What was surrendered was not ownership, but management of the lands, for the benefit of Six Nations. None of the terms of the leases and mortgages were ever kept (i.e., payments), so the land reverts to Six Nations according to the lease and mortgage agreements. I understand now why the developers are not pursuing litigation against the HDI, etc.: They have been advised they will lose. The law in Ontario, and the Supreme Court in Canada are coming through with the straight goods. Canadians listen up ... ... a say in development, a share of revenues in their territory.

I am picking up this thread where it was before it was derailed ... Angus, you have just identified the source of your anger at Aboriginal people and it has nothing to do with land claims, law, whatever: It's personal.Perhaps you should look past your own experience and not paint all Aboriginal people with the same broad brush. Most men just all hate women after a breakup, not a whole race too. We cannot deny the legitimacy of their claims. Why they pursue them, what they hope to gain is their business, not ours. If someone steals my lawnmower, I do not have to give an explanation about why I want it back. If I don't need it but just want it back for the power of controlling the person who stole it ... doesn't matter ... it's mine, that's all. If I choose to use it for parts, turn it into a go-kart, let it sit and rust, doesn't matter ... it's mine to do with as I please.

Hm ... I thought I posted this earlier I think it is not as simple as choosing NOT to have a Queen. I think there are issues of Canadian sovereignty without the Queen, related to the land treaties with the Crown.

And WE ARE NOT ALONE ... Assertion of rights on traditional Indigenous lands is a worldwide issue: http://www.dominionpaper.ca/articles/1616 Indigenous Rights and the Mayan Victory in Belize Implications for Indigenous Title Rights in Canada http://americas.irc-online.org/am/4907 Energy Development Threatens Native Lands (U.S.) http://www.1-1-2008.com/wiki/index.php?tit...ndence_movement Independence movement: Republic of Lakotah (U.S.) On December 20, 2007, Indian activists announced the withdrawal of their group of Lakota Sioux from all treaties with the United States government. http://upsidedownworld.org/main/content/view/1099/68/ Chile-Argentina: Pascua Lama Mining Project on Hold Written by Daniela Estrada* Tuesday, 22 January 2008 (Tierramérica) - Nearly two years after winning environmental approval from the Chilean government, the controversial Pascua Lama gold mining project of the transnational Barrick Gold Corporation remains without a launch date. And elsewhere in Ontario ... SHABOT FIRST NATION CHIEF ENCOURAGED BY URANIUM MINE TALKS Chief Doreen Davis, of the Shabot Obaadjiwan First Nation indicated yesterday that she is pleased by the progress of mediated discussions that have been taking place between the Government of Ontario and her Community since December 2007. The mediation is with regard to a dispute over proposed uranium mining exploration near Sharbot Lake, Ontario on traditional First Nation lands that are the subject of on going land claims negotiations. Quite simply, imo, the 21st century is the century of Indigenous Peoples ... and the environment.

sure ... whatever! :lol: