theloniusfleabag

Dear Renegade, I am in complete agreement. The only addition I would make is 'the church' (whatever religion one may belong to), but that would probably be a subsection of 'charity'. If there is to be any sort of 'welfare system', there should be a caveat that one has to work for it. Even the 'disabled' look for jobs, if they can. If they can't, there are services, beyond those above, for them also.

Dear Yodeler, I did not include tobacco as it is not 'recreational' or 'debilitating' (at least to the mind, there are no warnings or prohibition to operating machinery or motor vehicles on a pack of smokes) like the others. You would have been shown this had you voted, or you could click on 'see results' (with a 'nil' vote) quite easily. However, at the time of this writing, there was 20 votes (which is the approximate number of 'legitimate posters' here at any given time).

Dear BHS, I wouldn't say they are 'hopes'. To quote Sir Humphrey Appleby (from the TV Series "Yes, Minister"), "A cynic is what an idealist calls a realist". There are two vastly different options, and I think Black Dog sees it too, as to what should happen in Iraq. The first one is to withdraw all foreign forces, and let them sort it out. If Iraqis want 'democracy', and now that Saddam is gone, they shall have to fight for it themselves, and they will have to win. When the dust settles, they will have, (and until then they will never have) the stability brought about by the 'internal' will of the majority. Whatever that may be. If it is secular, pro-western democracy, so be it. If it is not, the 'west' must also deal with it, however the cards fall. That must be, though, as a trader and a mentor, not as an enslaver or occupier. The other option is a bit unsavoury, but really the only option the US has if it hopes to end eternal conflict over it's, perceived or factual, 'less than truthful' dealings with Islamic and third world nations. That is, overwhelming and brutal force. Outlawing religious law in any country, instituting 'democracy' by force, in every country, whether or not it is perceived as 'a holy crusade against Islam' or any other religion or monarchy. It also must be fought with brutal efficiency, gloves off, lest the outcome be in doubt.

Dear FTA Lawyer, I must agree, we must tread lightly. One of the dangers of defining 'quality of life' (or passing judgement) for others is seeing things like eugenics rearing it's ugly head again. However, different cultures have different ways with dealing with death. Not so long ago, eskimos would place, (assumably willingly) grandma or grandpa on an ice floe when they reached a certain level of 'enfeeblement'. They thought that this method of 'leaving the land of the living' was very dignified.

Dear BHS, from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light_sweet_crude While the oil sands produce... among other things.source: http://www.westernoilsands.com/html/products/premium.html

Dear Argus, Indeed, 'phobia' means fear of, when a lot of derogatory and misguided pronouncements usually come from 'a hatred of'. Somewhat like Rev. Phelps and his website http://www.godhatesfags.com/ I suspect that the hatred isn't from God... RB, I have known a couple. I have to agree, one of by best friends is a 'faggot'. Great guy, and although there was one time I felt he may have been attracted to me, there was no 'sexual tension' (or fear on my part, I am a happily married hetero) or anything else. He moved to another city to open up a business, but we still keep in touch, and I do miss his company for fishing and billiards.

Dear PocketRocket, Right now, that is illegal. All of the crackheads in my neighbourhood fit that description, but the cops told me I can't do anything of the sort.

Dear cybercoma, In the thread "Blair pulls plug on Kyoto, you said... Now you say... I do not believe there is such an article. However, you can dispense with the 'CO2 is a good thing' bunk. Of course it is. Plants convert it (and sunlight) into oxygen. However, plants need water too. What isn't good for them is to be under 40 feet of it. However, that could, and probably will be, debated. (please bear in mind that I am not saying that plants will die from excess CO2)I don't think that there is any doubt that plants did just fine without humans. Global environment fluctuations and cyclical change occured, certainly, there is evidence of that. However, it is also safe to say that all emissions from mankind's activities (industrial, etc, I am not talking about 'shitting in a bush') are 'extra', and not part of the 'normal cycle'.

Dear Toro, I hadn't heard that they were considering it, but it makes sense. I posted a link that Iraq was switching to the euro...http://archives.cnn.com/2000/WORLD/meast/1...q.un.euro.reut/ You'd think that, but not really. The middle east is old. Really, really old. Capitalism isn't new. Trade isn't new. Only secularism for Iran will change (or 'reform') their society. Asking them (or forcing them) to put Mammon before God (or Allah) isn't a realistic scenario.

Dear cybercoma, No, I was being facetious. What I asked for was , "show me a 'scientific study' showing what the effects of burning fossil fuels (coal fired energy plants and cars, etc) or, not having them, has on the mean income of the average resident of Burkina-Faso'.

Dear newbie, That link is hilarious. I visited a 'creationist' website a while ago that said much of the same stuff. Sadly, there will never be a global shortage of loonies.

Dear cybercoma, That seems to be the crux of the matter. One argument is that the reduction of greenhouse gases will extend their lives. Show me a study directly linking fossil fuel consumption, limited vs. free, to individual income in developing nation's economies or I won't believe you. I'll be generous, and say that you can round it off to the nearest dollar.

Dear cybercoma, We don't have empirical knowledge of it, only observation and extrapolation. However, what gives most 'good science' credibility is that they can prove 'B follows A', (though experiments, or empirical knowledge) and furthermore, why (a priori knowledge). I think that most of the debate is not whether 'global warming' can happen, it is rather about 'is it happening?'. The problem with skepticism is that while one can legitimately question 'Will the sun come up tomorrow?', (it is possible, though extremely unlikely, that it won't, at least from our perspective) it is also possible that one can waste valuable time bickering over the possible outcomes, when the outcome doesn't care what you think.

Dear Shady, I bought Scheuer's book, "Imperial Hubris" and read it a couple of times. While Clinton did call off a couple of opportunities to kill Bin Laden for fear of 'collateral damage' and the ensuing negative press, he did try to kill Bin Laden. Don't forget, this was pre-9/11, and public opinion in the US was vastly different than after.

Dear cybercoma, certain radiations aren't blocked, that is true. Of the three main types of 'radiation', Alpha, Beta and Gamma, gamma radiation can only be blocked by lead. Not sure what you mean. Chlorofluorocarbons (CFC's) have been pretty much banned since it was discovered that they 'ate' ozone.

Dear Toro, I should think that you are wasting your time feeding the troll. As 'it' states, it is neither left, nor right, just a disruption. Not a fanatic, just a phoney. However, since this is the thread the rest of the real posters are debating on, I do believe it is serious, as it relates to the supremacy (and the value) of the USD. While you are entirely correct with.. it is the confidence in the dollar that is in peril. And, with the US' penchant for racking up debt, both in budget and trade deficits, any undermining of it's apparent value, and investor confidence, is extremely important. (Though it is merely a 'cog in the machine', it is nevertheless an important factor, and connected to other things)

Dear cybercoma, This is the textbook definition of 'the greenhouse effect'. http://earthguide.ucsd.edu/earthguide/diagrams/greenhouse/ http://www.epa.gov/globalwarming/kids/greenhouse.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenhouse_effect

Dear August1991, Where else does the fault lie? Church picnics? The Boy Scouts helping old ladies cross streets? Very well, I'll shift the blame to consumerism. I have offered, on more than one occasion, what I consider to be viable alternatives to straight 'dumping', so I don't want collapse, just responsibility. I beleive that this can be accomplished without 'damaging the profit system'. Environmental 'responsibility' can be acheived one of two ways; through legislation (ie: Kyoto, which is a negative way) or through incentives (tax breaks, a positive way). I would much prefer the latter, as it could create lessen pollution, create employment, and still not damage profitability.

Dear ConservativeJoe, Um...er...11 'milleniums', actually....and with 'millenia' being the plural for 'millenium', I am thinking that 11,000 yrs qualifies...

Dear ConservativeJoe, I found Geology 200 at the UofC the most interesting class I took. (one of the few I took care to pass!) A lot can be gleaned from sedimentary strata. Not exact temperatures, of course, but a host of related information. Certainly, climate is cyclical, as are the positions of the continents. (tectonic plates, etc. and all that other 'junk science' as B.Max puts it) The most important thing I learned in geology class, though, was how to reckon time. Climactic change and glacial advance take millenia. If it is observed in the brief lifespan of a couple of generations of 'homo erectus', I would say that qualifies as unusual. If it occurs within the lifespan of a couple of mayflies, look out.

Dear Argus, I often wondered why rednecks (not meaning you, I don't share some other's opinion of you in that light) were thought of as 'anti-gay' when it means more available 'chicks'? Mind you, there are some women that are drawn to homosexual men like moths to a light....the ones that hang around the gay male 'scene' are called, (using the vernacular) 'fag-hags'. I was told that they seem to think that they are 'the one', the woman so 'womanly', that they could 'straighten them out'.

I'll bet you think you hear lots of things...

Dear ConservativeJoe, I believe that is a very dangerous view. Climactic change due to mankind's actions are observable in every major city, some more than others. Even a city such as Calgary heats up the surrounding atmosphere to the point where it affects the weather above it. How can it be claimed that the billions and billions of tonnes of emisions from people and industry can have no effect whatsoever? True, there is no precedent, (we cannot look back at another civilization that was exactly like ours 20 million years ago and compare effects), but we still have logic. Not entirely, but B.Max does little credit to the naysayers. You make some good points about Kyoto, and I agree, the setup is crazy. I certainly think that there are other ways to cut emissions, and of pollution, without harming industry. Tax breaks, for example, even at ratios of 1:1 for companies that install scrubbers on industrial exhausts, could motivate positive change without negative repercussions. But I can see so much farther from up here than you...lol

Dear Montgomery Burns, Greg has asked us not to feed the troll. If you can't kill it, just ignore it.

Dear Montgomery Burns, Hilarious choice of words. Not entirely correct, but mostly. There are private schools for those than can afford it, and they are not forced to be 'communist indoctrination camps'. As to the rest, publicly funded education is a good thing. It offers the opportunity of education to all children equally, and ostensibly gives them equal opportunity, rather than having them educated according to their parent's ability to pay.