Universities will provide Muslim footbaths

[kimmy]

If I was a non-Muslim student at that university, my only complaint would be the amount of money being spent on this.

$25000? That seems like an awful lot of money.

My extensive research indicates that a portable mini-mosque could be installed for a thrifty price of $59.99.

-k

[ScottSA]

If I was a non-Muslim student at that university, my only complaint would be the amount of money being spent on this.

$25000? That seems like an awful lot of money.

They forgot to mention that the entire bathroom has to be re-oriented so as to not crrrap in the direction of Mecca, as is happening in the UK. I have another issue, however, and that is this: if people are not crapping in the direction of Mecca; in which direction are they crapping? I strongly suspect that the bathrooms are re-oriented under the guise of goodness so as to spew caca in the direction of Scotland. Ever since Bannockburrrn, the English speaking world has had it in for we wee Scots. I've had enough, and I'm seriously thinking of blowing myself up in the name of an oak tree of whatever my filthy heathen strong but savage ancestors worshipped before the English God came prancing along on his high wee harse. Crrrap on Scotland, will ye?

[buffycat]

Warning to Scott: Sit down and breathe deeply - it seems a 'quiet reflection' room is also being added at the U:

U designates room for quiet reflection

Of course, I see nothing wrong with this. When I was in Uni there was a christian room and a Jewish room for religious purposes - so what.

[ScottSA]

Warning to Scott: Sit down and breathe deeply - it seems a 'quiet reflection' room is also being added at the U:

U designates room for quiet reflection

Of course, I see nothing wrong with this. When I was in Uni there was a christian room and a Jewish room for religious purposes - so what.

"Quiet reflection rooms" are not the same as foot baths, and I sincerely doubt you had two "reflection rooms" when and if you were in university, since any one I've been to (as well as hospitals) have a multifaith room, if any. Muslims don't share their rooms with anyone else, so I suspect the "uni" will now have a multifaith room and a Muslim room. If you've ever heard Muslims at prayer, you'll know that "quiet reflection" isn't very descriptive of it. Muslims tend to caterwaul and blare prayers from microphones in high places, and lately they seem to have added bomb factories to the mix. At least it ought to be a stimulating learning environment, what with Muezzins bellowing from the clock tower 5 times a day, footbaths soaking the floorboards and the odd explosion in the Student Union building.

[buffycat]

Well Scott, the uni I attended did in fact have a Christian room and a Jewish room. They may have had a Muslim room too - not sure - it could have been in one of the arts buildings which I never entered as none of my classes were in the 'arts'. But hey, feel free to believe what you will.

Did you even read the article? The Muslim students rep said she thinks that the room will be very useful to those of that faith who wish to pray. It is a multi faith room - iow no displays of any of the religions - just a quiet space for spiritual reflection.

BTW not all Muslims scream while praying - just as not all Christians speak in tongues. Man, talk about nasty generalisations.

[ScottSA]

BTW not all Muslims scream while praying - just as not all Christians speak in tongues. Man, talk about nasty generalisations.

Do tell. Have you had a great deal of experience with Islamic prayer? Which Muslims don't believe in a call to prayer 5 times a day?

[ScottSA]

Well Scott, the uni I attended did in fact have a Christian room and a Jewish room. They may have had a Muslim room too - not sure - it could have been in one of the arts buildings which I never entered as none of my classes were in the 'arts'. But hey, feel free to believe what you will.

Can I feel free to disbelieve you entirely? Did they have a Wiccan room too? How about a Rastafarian smoker's room? Because, you see, "unis" have multifaith rooms for precisely that reason...so they are not inundated by requests for rooms for various cults. Which university was it that broke that cardinal custom? I don't believe you.

[Guest American Woman]

U of M is a culturally diverse university. It meets the needs of all the students, which includes students of all faiths. The university also has an affirmative action policy in place and it even gives benefits to same sex couples.

"For the purpose of this policy statement, any benefits, privileges, rights and responsibilities that accrue to spouses of University faculty and staff by virtue of their status as spouses will accrue to committed same-sex partners of University faculty and staff by virtue of their status as same-sex partners."

To say this issue is about 'favoring Muslims' is totally off the wall. As I said, the university strives to meet the needs of all students, from all walks of life. It's to be commended.

Edited August 7, 2007 by American Woman

[jbg]

To say this issue is about 'favoring Muslims' is totally off the wall. As I said, the university strives to meet the needs of all students, from all walks of life. It's to be commended.

Generally, during the school day people attend classes. They generally don't worship.

[Guest American Woman]

Generally, during the school day people attend classes. They generally don't worship.

Have you been to university? Students' schedules vary greatly, including taking classes part time, going full time, taking night classes, etc., and many students of all faiths do indeed pray[i/] during the day.

[buffycat]

Have you been to university? Students' schedules vary greatly, including taking classes part time, going full time, taking night classes, etc., and many students of all faiths do indeed pray[i/] during the day.

I was going to say the same thing, but you beat me to it!

University is not all about the academics - there is a social element as well.

(edited for spelling)

Edited August 7, 2007 by buffycat

[ScottSA]

I was going to say the same thing, but you beat me to it!

University is not all about the academics - there is a social element as well.

(edited for spelling)

Hey, you didn't answer me. What university did you go to that had two or more separate prayer rooms for different faiths?

[buffycat]

Hey, you didn't answer me. What university did you go to that had two or more separate prayer rooms for different faiths?

You know what Scott? I am NOT going to answer that on this public forum since it is personal information and you stalk me enough here thanks.

Whine all ya want - makes no difference to me. I walked by these rooms on a daily basis as they were right between my buildings (sciences) and the library.

[bk59]

If you've ever heard Muslims at prayer, you'll know that "quiet reflection" isn't very descriptive of it. Muslims tend to caterwaul and blare prayers from microphones in high places, and lately they seem to have added bomb factories to the mix.

BTW not all Muslims scream while praying - just as not all Christians speak in tongues. Man, talk about nasty generalisations.

Do tell. Have you had a great deal of experience with Islamic prayer? Which Muslims don't believe in a call to prayer 5 times a day?

With statements like those made by ScottSA it isn't surprising that so much of this thread is overreaction & a waste of time. These ideas about how Muslims pray are pretty misinformed, at least as far as North America goes. And when called on it ScottSA responded by changing the subject. It's pretty clear that buffycat was talking about the statement regarding screaming, and nowhere mentioned anything about how many times per day Muslims pray. It's a pretty sad attempt at trying to deflect from the fact that ScottSA apparently does not know what he/she is talking about.

Hey, you didn't answer me. What university did you go to that had two or more separate prayer rooms for different faiths?

I think it is safe to assume that not everywhere in the world operates the way you think it does or should. Is it really that hard to believe that at some university, at some time, there existed two rooms for Christians and Jews?

[ScottSA]

With statements like those made by ScottSA it isn't surprising that so much of this thread is overreaction & a waste of time. These ideas about how Muslims pray are pretty misinformed, at least as far as North America goes. And when called on it ScottSA responded by changing the subject. It's pretty clear that buffycat was talking about the statement regarding screaming, and nowhere mentioned anything about how many times per day Muslims pray. It's a pretty sad attempt at trying to deflect from the fact that ScottSA apparently does not know what he/she is talking about.

I think it is safe to assume that not everywhere in the world operates the way you think it does or should. Is it really that hard to believe that at some university, at some time, there existed two rooms for Christians and Jews?

Is there some purpose to this post? You're not actually saying anything...you're simply making accusations. What would you call the calls to prayer from atop minarets? I call it screaming...would you prefer to call it "speaking loudly?"

[bk59]

Is there some purpose to this post? You're not actually saying anything...you're simply making accusations. What would you call the calls to prayer from atop minarets? I call it screaming...would you prefer to call it "speaking loudly?"

This purpose was simply to show how gross generalizations are never justified, and when called on them the usual answer is to claim that the poster was saying something else.

You claimed that when Muslims pray it is always loud (caterwauling and blaring prayers from high places). When called on it, you instead claimed that the poster was denying the number of times Muslims pray per day. This is misdirection.

Do you consider Christian prayer to not be quiet reflection because some churches ring bells before services? Muslim prayer is not necessarily loud & disruptive. This is obvious to anyone, at least here in North America, who has lived in a community with a Muslim population. I am not saying that all calls to prayer are quiet, all the time, all over the world. All I am saying is that describing all Muslim prayer as screaming is just plain wrong.

This type of misinformation is responsible for people overreacting to something that is completely trivial. So the university upgraded a bathroom & included a foot bath. So what? The Muslim community was prepared to raise money for this, but the university decided to pay for it themselves. That is the university's right. They also included the diaper changing station. Again, good for them. You should note that the foot bath is not limited to religious purposes. Everyone can use them. This is not the same as encouraging or pandering to a particular religion.

[ScottSA]

You should note that the foot bath is not limited to religious purposes. Everyone can use them. This is not the same as encouraging or pandering to a particular religion.

I will bet you $50 that within a year of their installation we'll hear cries of rage from these people that someone is desecrating them with infidel feet or whatever. If you were familiar with the tactics of the organizations behind these pushes, you'd know that.

As to the rest of your post, you can use whatever term you want to describe Muslim calls to prayer. Muezzins do not climb to the top of minarets to whisper calls to prayer. They shout, bellow, screech, holler...whatever verb one wants to use, that's what they do. And they do it 5 times a day. Do I object to it? You bet I do...this is not their country, and I have no problem at all claiming a preference for church bells over muezzin hollers...when church bells start evoking the same imagery as muezzin hollers, I'll start not liking them much too.

Edited August 7, 2007 by ScottSA

[Guest American Woman]

If you were familiar with the tactics of the organizations behind these pushes, you'd know that.

There was no "push" by the Muslims for the footbaths; the university decided to install them to make the bathrooms safer for everyone. Surely all of you making so much out of this realize wet floors are a hazzard.

[ScottSA]

There was no "push" by the Muslims for the footbaths; the university decided to install them to make the bathrooms safer for everyone. Surely all of you making so much out of this realize wet floors are a hazzard.

Here's another ruckus in the making: So when the school recently approved installing two footbaths in a pair of new unisex bathrooms

Blood will flow over this one...mark my words.http://www.canadianlattitude.ca/view_topic.php?id=8457&forum_id=56&jump_to=64117

[jbg]

Have you been to university? Students' schedules vary greatly, including taking classes part time, going full time, taking night classes, etc., and many students of all faiths do indeed pray[i/] during the day.

I went to Cornell. That was not my experience.

[jbg]

These ideas about how Muslims pray are pretty misinformed, at least as far as North America goes. And when called on it ScottSA responded by changing the subject. It's pretty clear that buffycat was talking about the statement regarding screaming, and nowhere mentioned anything about how many times per day Muslims pray.

I hear that in Dearborn, the muzzim (typo fixed to muezzin, (link) thanks Buffycat) lead prayers in that manner. I am no "ScottSA" but my best information is that he is largely correct. Edited August 8, 2007 by jbg

[Guest American Woman]

I went to Cornell. That was not my experience.

I find it difficult to believe that things at Cornell would be so different from Michigan; Michigan even has Saturday classes, and of course off-campus classes, on-line classes, etc. At any rate, it goes to show that you can't draw conclusions based solely on your own experiences.

[buffycat]

I hear that in Dearborn, the muzzim lead prayers in that manner. I am no "ScottSA" but my best information is that he is largely correct.

What the heck does 'muzzim' mean?

If it is a slur jbg, is that not against forum policy? I have never seen that word before, and I am pretty sure it doesn't mean Imam.

If it is a racist/bigotted name like the n-word, or the k-word then that is truly pretty petty and low of you.

Edited August 8, 2007 by buffycat

[jbg]

What the heck does 'muzzim' mean?

If it is a slur jbg, is that not against forum policy? I have never seen that word before, and I am pretty sure it doesn't mean Imam.

If it is a racist/bigotted name like the n-word, or the k-word then that is truly pretty petty and low of you.

Oops, mis-spelling. Should be "muezzin". Will be fixed, thanks. Click link to decide if this is a slur.

[ScottSA]

What the heck does 'muzzim' mean?

If it is a slur jbg, is that not against forum policy? I have never seen that word before, and I am pretty sure it doesn't mean Imam.

If it is a racist/bigotted name like the n-word, or the k-word then that is truly pretty petty and low of you.

I see you're now reduced to namecalling. Getting a little free and easy with the "r" and "b" words, aren't we? And no, I don't mean rockabilly "LOL!" ! gag me with a spoon!

Edited August 8, 2007 by ScottSA