Eyeless in Gaza

[Higgly]

I'm surprised there hasn't been a post so far about the split between Hamas and Fatah with Hamas taking control of Gaza and Fatah dominating the West Bank. Already we have the 'west' announcing that it supports Fatah and Iranet al backing Hamas.

I watch the news fairly closely and this happened far below the radar of the western news sources. Another sign that the general press is completely out of touch with the Arab world. Aldous Huxley wrote and published a novel entitled "Eyeless In Gaza". I think I'm beginning to understand what he meant.

What we are headed for is a good old-fashioned proxy war. the USA and Israel against Iran and only Allah knows who else. I feel sorry for the poor buggers caught in the middle.

[scribblet]

I'm surprised there hasn't been a post so far about the split between Hamas and Fatah with Hamas taking

Maybe because it will result in personal attacks and accusations of racisim etc.....

The violence this week has reached a sickening level with men being thrown off buildings and gunned down in front of their families even by Palestinian standards, this is pretty bad. Imagine the screams if the Israelis were half as brutal, but there seems to be silence on this.

I think its a matter of days before Hamas takes the west bank as well. Wouldn't be surprised if Abbas is hanged or tossed off a rooftop eventually, then what will the world say.

If they take over the west bank could spread bringing in Israel, then watch out for the screaming then. Or, Egypt will get fed up with Hamastan, invade and take back the Gaza Strip.

[buffycat]

What we are headed for is a good old-fashioned proxy war. the USA and Israel against Iran and only Allah knows who else. I feel sorry for the poor buggers caught in the middle.

I agree.

This is the Israeli right's wet dream come true. How nice that the US and Israel are funding Fatah - and of course the thug Mohammed Dahlan. People here would do well to run a search on Dahlan, coupled perhaps with Elliot Abrams - heck throw Welch in there too for the Lebanese angle.

[scribblet]

Hamas has taken control of one of the heaviest populated poorest area in the world, the question is now, what will they do with it. Will they attempt to create a radical Islamist state, will this type of thinking prevail

In early June, a group calling itself the Islamic Swords of Justice threatened to kill female television news readers if they refuse to wear strict Islamic dress.

"You are without shame or morals," the group declared. "We will cut your throat from vein to vein if need be to protect the spirit and morals of this nation."

The same group claimed responsibility for a string of bomb attacks on Internet cafes, Christian bookstores and restaurants serving alcohol.

well, it could be because Hamas spokesman Islam Shahawan said so:: "The era of justice and Islamic rule has arrived" This type of violent religious fundamentalism will change the whole picture as after all, Hamas is an acronym for Islamic Resistance Movement, not a good omen for peace and it won't take much to completely cripple their allready poor economy.

Wet dreams aside of course.

[Higgly]

I see the Arab states in general are backing Abbas, with the exception of Iran, of course. Not sure where Syria sits in all of this. I'd be surprised if Hamas were able to dominate the West Bank over Fatah without a civil war.

One analyst I saw on the BBC said this is a direct result of the embargo of the Palestinian Authority by the west and the block put on access to Palestinian financial resources such as collected taxes by The US and Israel. As I pointed out in a another thread, this whole business reminds me of a psychology experiment in which a population of lab rats has its source of food steadily reduced until they start attacking each other, eating their young, etc..

[buffycat]

As I pointed out in a another thread, this whole business reminds me of a psychology experiment in which a population of lab rats has its source of food steadily reduced until they start attacking each other, eating their young, etc..

The Great Experiment

I would agree.

[scribblet]

Blaming Israel for Palestinian intransigency is at best biased. The Palestinians were offered a state by the Peel Commission, Barak even offered them in 2000 half of Jerusalem and 97% of Judea Samaria and Gaza. Morever the false symmetry of blame makes no real note of the way the Palestinians have acted over the years. From plane hijackings to suicide bombings to kidnappings, the Palestinians have never shown the slightest restraint in their actions.

Now they are promising to release kidnapped BBC journalist Alan Johnston who was snatched in Gaza three months ago Translation: Oh oh, guess the PR is so bad after murdering all those Fatah guys and civilians we’d better throw out a bone to silence the critics.

Even the palestinians don’t like the Palestinians now… A senior Palestinian source said. “They declare an area a closed military zone and shoot anyone who goes out into the street. Hamasniks strip Fatah men they capture, humiliate and beat them. They go from door to door with lists to hunt down Fatah people and execute them.”

Yeah, this is all Israel’s fault right, now how is Hamas going to supply electricity etc. and negotiate with Israel and – wiill Egypt continue to turn a blind eye to the arming of Hamas?

According to the left international left Israel is a fascist apartheid state, a brutal occupier, universally despised by the oppressed Palestinian people.

So where do the oppressed Palestinians look for sanctuary, when the terrorist government they elected begins the inevitable slaughter?" you got it - Israel

[jbg]

I'm surprised there hasn't been a post so far about the split between Hamas and Fatah with Hamas taking control of Gaza and Fatah dominating the West Bank. Already we have the 'west' announcing that it supports Fatah and Iranet al backing Hamas.

Great show of readiness for an independent state these "people" are showing.

[scribblet]

Too many threads on the same subject...

There's a good article here in the Wall St. Journal http://www.opinionjournal.com/weekend/hottopic/?id=110010219

Gaza's mayhem is the bitter fruit of terror as statecraft.

Scores of Palestinians were killed this week in Gaza in factional fighting between loyalists of President Mahmoud Abbas of Fatah and those of Prime Minister Ismail Haniyeh of Hamas. As if on cue, it took about 24 hours before pundits the world over blamed the violence on Israel and President Bush.

This is the Israel that dismantled its settlements in Gaza in August 2005, a unilateral concession for which it asked, and got, nothing in return. And it is the U.S. President who, in a landmark speech five years ago this month, called on Palestinians to "elect new leaders, leaders not compromised by terror." Had Palestinians done so, they could be living today in a peaceful, independent state. Instead, in January 2006 they freely handed the reins of government to Hamas in parliamentary elections. What is happening today is the result of that choice--their choice.

That election didn't simply emerge from a vacuum, however. It is a consequence of the cult of violence that has typified the Palestinian movement for much of its history and which has been tolerated and often celebrated by the international community. If Palestinians now think they can advance their domestic interests by violence, nobody should be surprised: The way of the gun has been paying dividends for 40 years.

[jbg]

If Palestinians now think they can advance their domestic interests by violence, nobody should be surprised: The way of the gun has been paying dividends for 40 years.

Gee whiz, I thought the purpose of the UN was to make sure that violence wasn't rewarded.

[buffycat]

How anyone can say that Israel is devoid of any kind of responsibility in this whole bloody affair is beyond me.

Hello??????

Had Israel not been 'given' (silver spoon in hand) land by the British (who really had NO right to do so) this disgusting mess would not even be occuring.

That said, it is clear we are stuck with this incarnation of Israel, whose desire has always been to be a Jewish State, too bad she did not actually embrace democracy and one man one vote. It was a grand opportunity lost. I don't think that the majority of Palestinians miss this FACT.

Are Palestinians killing one another? Sadly, yes. Put any group of folk into an open air prison and deny them the control over their own destiny and what do you get? Warsaw Ghetto? Gaza? The point is, while Israel did evacuate her illegal settlers from Gaza, she never in any way whatsoever allowed for any kind of autonomy to the PA to govern. ALL borders and airspace was still completely controlled by her, all movement in or out - controlled by Israel. The overflights and sonic booms NEVER ceased - even though for many many months the ceasefire was held by the PA. Israel is like the little teacher's pet always provoking others then crying out when finally someone strikes back. She is a bully. Plain and simple.

I often put of links to maps - have any of you who advocate letting the Palestinains have the West Bank even looked at them? Do any of you realize how the West Bank is carved up? How even there, there is little freedom of movement? How about the house demolitions? Not only in the WB but also in Gaza?

So much is reported in NA without context. No wonder there is such hatred, such bigottry that folk need to use quotations to describe Palestinians and 'People'. Sad.

[scribblet]

If Palestinians now think they can advance their domestic interests by violence, nobody should be surprised: The way of the gun has been paying dividends for 40 years.

Gee whiz, I thought the purpose of the UN was to make sure that violence wasn't rewarded.

Nah, they just like to reward the Cult of Violence and blame Israel for everything..

If Arabs riot, it's Israel's fault

If Arabs commit terrorist acts, it's Israel's fault

If Arabs kill each other (from Timbuctoo to Iraq)... it's Israel's fault and responsibility

Honour killings - Israel's fault too

It was Israel's fault that the Arabs rejected the partition in 1948 ( and btw, it was also their fault that the Arabs fled the war zone at the behest of their leaders)

It was Israel's fault that they closed the Suez canal and amassed their armies on our borders in 1967.

It was Israel's fault that the Arab nations have made NO EFFORT whatsoever to accommodate the Arab refugees who live in their countries.

It's Israel's fault that they are poor, uneducated witha tendency to violence, that they discriminate against women and homosexuals etc. etc.

Maybe this is the soft racism of low expectations - the Palestinians or Arabs are never at fault something like a child is never at fault - they are not credited with knowing any better.

[bush_cheney2004]

...Had Israel not been 'given' (silver spoon in hand) land by the British (who really had NO right to do so) this disgusting mess would not even be occuring....

Now this is a very interesting observation ....where do you think Canada's "land" came from? Israel's historical sovereignty is more "legitimate" than either the USA's or Canada's. We still have "PalestIndians" to this day.

[ScottSA]

Are Palestinians killing one another? Sadly, yes. Put any group of folk into an open air prison and deny them the control over their own destiny and what do you get? Warsaw Ghetto?

Tell us about the Warsaw Ghetto. Did those nasty Jews set about killing each other in that open air prison? I must have missed that part of history...no doubt covered up by some sinister Jewish plot. Please explain.

[jbg]

Had Israel not been 'given' (silver spoon in hand) land by the British (who really had NO right to do so) this disgusting mess would not even be occuring.

How about acknowledging that the Zionist settlers made the land habitable for many more people, and most of the Arabs came after.

That said, it is clear we are stuck with this incarnation of Israel, whose desire has always been to be a Jewish State, too bad she did not actually embrace democracy and one man one vote. It was a grand opportunity lost. I don't think that the majority of Palestinians miss this FACT.

And how about acknowledging that it would be "one man, one vote, one time", and slaughter would follow? Also, why are Muslims the only ones fit for a state and not Jews?

Are Palestinians killing one another? Sadly, yes. Put any group of folk into an open air prison and deny them the control over their own destiny and what do you get? Warsaw Ghetto? Gaza? The point is, while Israel did evacuate her illegal settlers from Gaza, she never in any way whatsoever allowed for any kind of autonomy to the PA to govern. ALL borders and airspace was still completely controlled by her, all movement in or out - controlled by Israel. The overflights and sonic booms NEVER ceased - even though for many many months the ceasefire was held by the PA. Israel is like the little teacher's pet always provoking others then crying out when finally someone strikes back. She is a bully. Plain and simple.

You mean the Arabs butchering each other in Iraq are in an "open air prison" of Israel's making?