Canadian Wheat Board

[bsigg]

Hello,

I just want to say a few things about the Canadian Wheat Board, or as many of us call it the 'CWB.'

First of all, the CWB doesn't throw farmers in jail for not using the CWB to market their grain. That group of farmers that were jailed went over the boarder without an export permit. So Canada Customs confiscated there trucks. They then proceeded to steal their trucks back from Customs.

Surprisingly, the only punishment was a fine. They chose to not pay the fine and chose jail time for publicity reasons. This would be the equivalent of getting pulled over for speeding, and starting a fist fight with the police and then claiming 'police-brutality.'

Secondly, without the CWB, farmers' will be at the mercy of the multinational grain companies that have no interest in helping farmers—all they care about is there own shareholders and profits.

Many of you are probably saying, "Well Harper and his government are only trying to give farmers choice on how they market their grain."

Many people believe that the CWB could exist in this 'choice' environment. The falsehood here would be that this 'choice' environment would not include the CWB, as the CWB could not exist. Turing the CWB into just another grain company with no export terminals and no elevators doesn't make any sense. The CWB would have to rely on it's competitors to handle and ship its grain. How exactly would that work?

The people promoting the destruction of the CWB are the same people that have failed farmers many many times in the past. They promoted the elimination of the crow rate (worth around $800 million per year for farmers). Gave plant breeders' rights to corporations and now corporations can sue you for growing your own grain. If the conservatives are so upbeat on property rights, why aren't they giving the farmers the right to grow their own grain?

For more information please visit http://www.savemycwb.ca

[margrace]

bsigg posting this on this board is a waste of time as far as I can see. There are people on here and quite a few of them who begrudge paying for food. They want cheap food so they can buy their gas gussling SUVs and their 3000 square ft. homes. I have found that people who complain about thngs want the necessities of life free and believe that any money they earn should be theirs alone.

[madmax]

While public opinion is important. You should be talking to the interested parties. Fact is, Alberta is solidly Conservative, and I think Sask. voted overwhelmingly Conservative. The publicity the arrested parties achieved was effective.

[Hydraboss]

I have found that people who complain about thngs want the necessities of life free and believe that any money they earn should be theirs alone.

margrace, the autobiography was unnecessary.

[bsigg]

While public opinion is important. You should be talking to the interested parties. Fact is, Alberta is solidly Conservative, and I think Sask. voted overwhelmingly Conservative. The publicity the arrested parties achieved was effective.

The people in rural communities have always voted for conservatives. Harper thinks that because this time, while campaigning to end the CWB, he wouldn't have won these seats if the farmers supported the CWB.

The people in the rural communities didn't vote about the CWB they voted about gay marriage or gun control or some other non issue like that.

Why urban people should care: Well Harper has shown that he doesn't care what people think, he only cares what his idealogy tells him. So what's next on Harper's Hit List: Supply Management for Dairy Products, etc.;

The CBC; Health Care. When he is done it will be a carbon copy of the U.S.

[White Doors]

While public opinion is important. You should be talking to the interested parties. Fact is, Alberta is solidly Conservative, and I think Sask. voted overwhelmingly Conservative. The publicity the arrested parties achieved was effective.

The people in rural communities have always voted for conservatives. Harper thinks that because this time, while campaigning to end the CWB, he wouldn't have won these seats if the farmers supported the CWB.

The people in the rural communities didn't vote about the CWB they voted about gay marriage or gun control or some other non issue like that.

Why urban people should care: Well Harper has shown that he doesn't care what people think, he only cares what his idealogy tells him. So what's next on Harper's Hit List: Supply Management for Dairy Products, etc.;

The CBC; Health Care. When he is done it will be a carbon copy of the U.S.

What a bunch of Bullshit.

The FARMERS voted and they VOTED to make participation in the Wheat Board voluntary.

Suck it up. Democracy has spoken.

Take your far left wing ideaological bullshit elsewhere or else stick to the facts. You have shown your resistance to this to be for partisan reasons only so far.

[bsigg]

While public opinion is important. You should be talking to the interested parties. Fact is, Alberta is solidly Conservative, and I think Sask. voted overwhelmingly Conservative. The publicity the arrested parties achieved was effective.

The people in rural communities have always voted for conservatives. Harper thinks that because this time, while campaigning to end the CWB, he wouldn't have won these seats if the farmers supported the CWB.

The people in the rural communities didn't vote about the CWB they voted about gay marriage or gun control or some other non issue like that.

Why urban people should care: Well Harper has shown that he doesn't care what people think, he only cares what his idealogy tells him. So what's next on Harper's Hit List: Supply Management for Dairy Products, etc.;

The CBC; Health Care. When he is done it will be a carbon copy of the U.S.

What a bunch of Bullshit.

The FARMERS voted and they VOTED to make participation in the Wheat Board voluntary.

Suck it up. Democracy has spoken.

Take your far left wing ideaological bullshit elsewhere or else stick to the facts. You have shown your resistance to this to be for partisan reasons only so far.

How do you suppose a voluntary Wheat Board will work? The same as a voluntary traffic light, I suppose.

You either have the Wheat Board or you don't. Simple as that. Harper is just spinning the Voluntary CWB nonsense because that option is popular with farmers, but not achievable.

[White Doors]

While public opinion is important. You should be talking to the interested parties. Fact is, Alberta is solidly Conservative, and I think Sask. voted overwhelmingly Conservative. The publicity the arrested parties achieved was effective.

The people in rural communities have always voted for conservatives. Harper thinks that because this time, while campaigning to end the CWB, he wouldn't have won these seats if the farmers supported the CWB.

The people in the rural communities didn't vote about the CWB they voted about gay marriage or gun control or some other non issue like that.

Why urban people should care: Well Harper has shown that he doesn't care what people think, he only cares what his idealogy tells him. So what's next on Harper's Hit List: Supply Management for Dairy Products, etc.;

The CBC; Health Care. When he is done it will be a carbon copy of the U.S.

What a bunch of Bullshit.

The FARMERS voted and they VOTED to make participation in the Wheat Board voluntary.

Suck it up. Democracy has spoken.

Take your far left wing ideaological bullshit elsewhere or else stick to the facts. You have shown your resistance to this to be for partisan reasons only so far.

How do you suppose a voluntary Wheat Board will work? The same as a voluntary traffic light, I suppose.

You either have the Wheat Board or you don't. Simple as that. Harper is just spinning the Voluntary CWB nonsense because that option is popular with farmers, but not achievable.

How so? So it is your position is that the wheat board will only work if Farmers are threatened with Jail if they do't use it?

Are you serious? And you think that not only that is correct but it is also a good reason to keep it going?

My god..

I don't know, buying groups seem to work very well in every other industry? Ever heard of a teeny tiny little company called Borg warner?

How is it that you suppose a relative neophite as far as farming goes can come on here and tear your whole premise to pieces? You seem to be affiliated with the Wheet board in some capacity?

If it is of such worth and you are in favour of ruling against the majority on this then surely to god it's not too much to expect that you can back up your baseless crap with something substantive?

Because so far it just looks like you are afraid that you are going to lose your cushy little job my friend and that, I couldn't give two little shits about.

[blueblood]

Now now now now, the CWB is going to be relegated to a different status as a marketing firm that's it that's all, it won't die out due to voluntary participation, enough people want both.

As a farmer that's the biggest bunch of malarkey I've ever heard. The CWB has 20% of the worldwide export wheat market share, they'll be fine trust me. Why don't eastern Canadian farmers have to follow their guidelines?

The CWB is basically eastern Canadian colonialism. We are forced to sell to the CWB which means we have to haul to the elevators and have to put up with the malarkey from the rail companies. Without the CWB that means plants will have to move out to the prairies to compete with the U.S., and the railways get cut out and they might have to shape up in order to compete. I'd sooner haul my grain to a biofuel plant by super B than be at the mercy of rail companies. This also means Timmy from Algeria is going to have to cough up more dough in order to compete.

The CWB can be a marketing firm and survive, there are some farmers that will still export their stuff coming due to the sky high grain prices that are coming. The CWB has to be made voluntary in order for our biofuel sector to thrive. This in turn boosts the Canadian economy.

Under the Liberal CWB and handout system farmers have been poorer, ever since the tories took the helm we are finally getting some positive returns, it looks like the Liberals won't get elected in rural Canada ever. Liberals should have no say in the Ag sector, everything they do screws us over.

[bsigg]

While public opinion is important. You should be talking to the interested parties. Fact is, Alberta is solidly Conservative, and I think Sask. voted overwhelmingly Conservative. The publicity the arrested parties achieved was effective.

The people in rural communities have always voted for conservatives. Harper thinks that because this time, while campaigning to end the CWB, he wouldn't have won these seats if the farmers supported the CWB.

The people in the rural communities didn't vote about the CWB they voted about gay marriage or gun control or some other non issue like that.

Why urban people should care: Well Harper has shown that he doesn't care what people think, he only cares what his idealogy tells him. So what's next on Harper's Hit List: Supply Management for Dairy Products, etc.;

The CBC; Health Care. When he is done it will be a carbon copy of the U.S.

What a bunch of Bullshit.

The FARMERS voted and they VOTED to make participation in the Wheat Board voluntary.

Suck it up. Democracy has spoken.

Take your far left wing ideaological bullshit elsewhere or else stick to the facts. You have shown your resistance to this to be for partisan reasons only so far.

How do you suppose a voluntary Wheat Board will work? The same as a voluntary traffic light, I suppose.

You either have the Wheat Board or you don't. Simple as that. Harper is just spinning the Voluntary CWB nonsense because that option is popular with farmers, but not achievable.

How so? So it is your position is that the wheat board will only work if Farmers are threatened with Jail if they do't use it?

Are you serious? And you think that not only that is correct but it is also a good reason to keep it going?

My god..

I don't know, buying groups seem to work very well in every other industry? Ever heard of a teeny tiny little company called Borg warner?

How is it that you suppose a relative neophite as far as farming goes can come on here and tear your whole premise to pieces? You seem to be affiliated with the Wheet board in some capacity?

If it is of such worth and you are in favour of ruling against the majority on this then surely to god it's not too much to expect that you can back up your baseless crap with something substantive?

Because so far it just looks like you are afraid that you are going to lose your cushy little job my friend and that, I couldn't give two little shits about.

The Farmers were throw in Jail because they stole their trucks back from Canada Customs, and didn't pay the resulting fine, they were given over a year to pay, but chose to get publicity for their cause.

Following your logic, it makes it prefectly ethical for Brian Mulroney to be on the Board of Directors of ADM, while at the same time being a political advisor to Stephen Harper. ADM stands to benefit the most from the destruction of the CWB. And yet you accuse me of being affiliated with the CWB.

The majority of farmers support the CWB single-desk, but if you muddy the waters and give a false option of 'marketing choice.' then that would get support, but it can't be achieved unless some how the CWB gets an export terminal, and grain elevators. Even if the CWB did have an export terminal and elevators that wouldn't guarantee that it would be able to survive, let alone get premiums for farmers. Without the CWB single-desk, the CWB would have to rely on its competitors to handle and ship its grain.

Many independent studies have shown that the CWB gets premiums higher than in the open market.

[bsigg]

Now now now now, the CWB is going to be relegated to a different status as a marketing firm that's it that's all, it won't die out due to voluntary participation, enough people want both.

As a farmer that's the biggest bunch of malarkey I've ever heard. The CWB has 20% of the worldwide export wheat market share, they'll be fine trust me. Why don't eastern Canadian farmers have to follow their guidelines?

The CWB is basically eastern Canadian colonialism. We are forced to sell to the CWB which means we have to haul to the elevators and have to put up with the malarkey from the rail companies. Without the CWB that means plants will have to move out to the prairies to compete with the U.S., and the railways get cut out and they might have to shape up in order to compete. I'd sooner haul my grain to a biofuel plant by super B than be at the mercy of rail companies. This also means Timmy from Algeria is going to have to cough up more dough in order to compete.

The CWB can be a marketing firm and survive, there are some farmers that will still export their stuff coming due to the sky high grain prices that are coming. The CWB has to be made voluntary in order for our biofuel sector to thrive. This in turn boosts the Canadian economy.

Under the Liberal CWB and handout system farmers have been poorer, ever since the tories took the helm we are finally getting some positive returns, it looks like the Liberals won't get elected in rural Canada ever. Liberals should have no say in the Ag sector, everything they do screws us over.

There is nothing stopping the biofuel plants from buying from the CWB right now. Except the fact the biofuel companies don't want to pay high prices for grain, they want the cheapest grain they can find. If its ethanol, they will probably import U.S. corn, or maybe use Canadian Wheat, which ever is cheapest at the time. They aren't going to pay more than they have to.

[Charles Anthony]

First of all, the CWB doesn't throw farmers in jail for not using the CWB to market their grain. That group of farmers that were jailed went over the boarder without an export permit. So Canada Customs confiscated there trucks. They then proceeded to steal their trucks back from Customs.

Export permit? Steal their own trucks back???

Who forces them to have an export permit?

Why should they have an export permit?

[blueblood]

Now now now now, the CWB is going to be relegated to a different status as a marketing firm that's it that's all, it won't die out due to voluntary participation, enough people want both.

As a farmer that's the biggest bunch of malarkey I've ever heard. The CWB has 20% of the worldwide export wheat market share, they'll be fine trust me. Why don't eastern Canadian farmers have to follow their guidelines?

The CWB is basically eastern Canadian colonialism. We are forced to sell to the CWB which means we have to haul to the elevators and have to put up with the malarkey from the rail companies. Without the CWB that means plants will have to move out to the prairies to compete with the U.S., and the railways get cut out and they might have to shape up in order to compete. I'd sooner haul my grain to a biofuel plant by super B than be at the mercy of rail companies. This also means Timmy from Algeria is going to have to cough up more dough in order to compete.

The CWB can be a marketing firm and survive, there are some farmers that will still export their stuff coming due to the sky high grain prices that are coming. The CWB has to be made voluntary in order for our biofuel sector to thrive. This in turn boosts the Canadian economy.

Under the Liberal CWB and handout system farmers have been poorer, ever since the tories took the helm we are finally getting some positive returns, it looks like the Liberals won't get elected in rural Canada ever. Liberals should have no say in the Ag sector, everything they do screws us over.

There is nothing stopping the biofuel plants from buying from the CWB right now. Except the fact the biofuel companies don't want to pay high prices for grain, they want the cheapest grain they can find. If its ethanol, they will probably import U.S. corn, or maybe use Canadian Wheat, which ever is cheapest at the time. They aren't going to pay more than they have to.

Do you have any idea how much U.S. corn is now? It is sky high, there aren't enough acres to meet demand as the U.S. has a much more powerful biofuel industry than we do. It makes more sense for me to truck my grain myself to the nearest biofuel plant, than to haul my grain to the terminal, sell it to the CWB, pay 1 dollar a bushel in rail fees, and then get screwed over by the pool effect of it. I am eliminating 3 middlemen by trucking it myself. The CWB only works in an export situation and should reorganize itself in that regard. The only people who will be screwed over with the CWB overhaul is CN and CP rail, and maybe some processors in Ontario, and Timmy from Algeria who will have to pay more to get his boat load of wheat.

[jdobbin]

Now now now now, the CWB is going to be relegated to a different status as a marketing firm that's it that's all, it won't die out due to voluntary participation, enough people want both.

Under WTO rules, the Canadian Wheat Board is an illegal state trading enterprise the minute it loses its monopoly. I doubt very much that dual marketing will exist.

[blueblood]

Now now now now, the CWB is going to be relegated to a different status as a marketing firm that's it that's all, it won't die out due to voluntary participation, enough people want both.

Under WTO rules, the Canadian Wheat Board is an illegal state trading enterprise the minute it loses its monopoly. I doubt very much that dual marketing will exist.

Looks like it's privatization time then, don't worry with the large support it has, it won't die.

[jdobbin]

Looks like it's privatization time then, don't worry with the large support it has, it won't die.

Privatization to what? It has no assets.

[blueblood]

Looks like it's privatization time then, don't worry with the large support it has, it won't die.

Privatization to what? It has no assets.

Why can't the gov't get out of it? The MB gov't pulled the plug on MTS, why can't the gov't pull the plug on the Wheat Board? The board would become a marketing firm, and a big one at that. Remember it has 20% of worldwide share, that would be gold for a private company and considering grain going up, why not. Hell make it a corporation.

[jdobbin]

Why can't the gov't get out of it? The MB gov't pulled the plug on MTS, why can't the gov't pull the plug on the Wheat Board? The board would become a marketing firm, and a big one at that. Remember it has 20% of worldwide share, that would be gold for a private company and considering grain going up, why not. Hell make it a corporation.

I repeat. Unlike MTS, it has no assets. It has no terminals, it has no ships, it has no elevators.

Federal marketing boards are illegal under WTO. Once the monopoly is gone, it is gone. The Wheat Board is gone.

[blueblood]

Why can't the gov't get out of it? The MB gov't pulled the plug on MTS, why can't the gov't pull the plug on the Wheat Board? The board would become a marketing firm, and a big one at that. Remember it has 20% of worldwide share, that would be gold for a private company and considering grain going up, why not. Hell make it a corporation.

I repeat. Unlike MTS, it has no assets. It has no terminals, it has no ships, it has no elevators.

Federal marketing boards are illegal under WTO. Once the monopoly is gone, it is gone. The Wheat Board is gone.

So things have to be government owned to be in the export business?

The CWB has grain and support at it's disposal. If the farmers who want to get in the export biz are smart they'll use the board as sort of a cartel. the nice thing about the biofuel thing is that we won't be held hostage by shipping and the rail companies anymore as we can put it on a super B to ethanol plants popping up all over the prairies. This would mean the future CWB has leverage on the shipping companies, terminals, and rail companies. Plus having the CWB as a cartel means Canadian wheat farmers can have some fun with worldwide grain prices.

[jdobbin]

So things have to be government owned to be in the export business?

The CWB has grain and support at it's disposal. If the farmers who want to get in the export biz are smart they'll use the board as sort of a cartel. the nice thing about the biofuel thing is that we won't be held hostage by shipping and the rail companies anymore as we can put it on a super B to ethanol plants popping up all over the prairies. This would mean the future CWB has leverage on the shipping companies, terminals, and rail companies. Plus having the CWB as a cartel means Canadian wheat farmers can have some fun with worldwide grain prices.

The WTO would be able to levy penalties on Canadian grain or other products if the CWB loses its monopoly.

I don't know how many times I can say the same thing: State trading enterprises are illegal once they lose their monopoly.

There can't be dual marketing. The minute the farmers get dual marketing, the Canadian Wheat Board cannot operate as a marketing board. Only provincial marketing boards are protected under the WTO. Federal ones aren't.

It isn't like the Wheat Board can be sold. It has no assets.

[blueblood]

So things have to be government owned to be in the export business?

The CWB has grain and support at it's disposal. If the farmers who want to get in the export biz are smart they'll use the board as sort of a cartel. the nice thing about the biofuel thing is that we won't be held hostage by shipping and the rail companies anymore as we can put it on a super B to ethanol plants popping up all over the prairies. This would mean the future CWB has leverage on the shipping companies, terminals, and rail companies. Plus having the CWB as a cartel means Canadian wheat farmers can have some fun with worldwide grain prices.

The WTO would be able to levy penalties on Canadian grain or other products if the CWB loses its monopoly.

I don't know how many times I can say the same thing: State trading enterprises are illegal once they lose their monopoly.

There can't be dual marketing. The minute the farmers get dual marketing, the Canadian Wheat Board cannot operate as a marketing board. Only provincial marketing boards are protected under the WTO. Federal ones aren't.

It isn't like the Wheat Board can be sold. It has no assets.

I'm not suggesting it stay a state marketing board, I'm suggesting it morph into a farmer run cartel. It already has structure and support so the leg work is done, the gov't can pull out and it won't be a state trading enterprise, it will be just a trading enterprise. What is wrong with that?

[jdobbin]

I'm not suggesting it stay a state marketing board, I'm suggesting it morph into a farmer run cartel. It already has structure and support so the leg work is done, the gov't can pull out and it won't be a state trading enterprise, it will be just a trading enterprise. What is wrong with that?

The government could certainly sell it to farmers for a buck. I don't know why farmers would bother taking the risk for a wheat pool when almost all the wheat pools have disappeared into corporate entities.

My feeling is that the Wheat Board would be shut down as soon as dual marketing became a fact.

[blueblood]

I'm not suggesting it stay a state marketing board, I'm suggesting it morph into a farmer run cartel. It already has structure and support so the leg work is done, the gov't can pull out and it won't be a state trading enterprise, it will be just a trading enterprise. What is wrong with that?

The government could certainly sell it to farmers for a buck. I don't know why farmers would bother taking the risk for a wheat pool when almost all the wheat pools have disappeared into corporate entities.

My feeling is that the Wheat Board would be shut down as soon as dual marketing became a fact.

AU has farmers on its board of directors if that's any conciltation to you. At the beginning when the Pools were set up they were to compete and give returns. Over time they evolve. It would make sense for a wheat pool of this magnitude. They'd risk because if a corporation gave them a generous buyout, they'd take it, i could see a pool like this around for a while.

[jdobbin]

AU has farmers on its board of directors if that's any conciltation to you. At the beginning when the Pools were set up they were to compete and give returns. Over time they evolve. It would make sense for a wheat pool of this magnitude. They'd risk because if a corporation gave them a generous buyout, they'd take it, i could see a pool like this around for a while.

Agricore is a corporation with assets. The CWB has none. To compete, it would have to buy lots of assets with no guarantee that it wouldn't lose market share. Farmers would be better to buy shares in Saskpool or AU. They have assets.

I shouldn't be telling you anything new here. If and when the CWB loses it monopoly, it will cease to exist altogether. It isn't a company. It is a marketing board with no assets to buy.

[madmax]

AU has farmers on its board of directors if that's any conciltation to you. At the beginning when the Pools were set up they were to compete and give returns. Over time they evolve. It would make sense for a wheat pool of this magnitude. They'd risk because if a corporation gave them a generous buyout, they'd take it, i could see a pool like this around for a while.

Agricore is a corporation with assets. The CWB has none. To compete, it would have to buy lots of assets with no guarantee that it wouldn't lose market share. Farmers would be better to buy shares in Saskpool or AU. They have assets.

I shouldn't be telling you anything new here. If and when the CWB loses it monopoly, it will cease to exist altogether. It isn't a company. It is a marketing board with no assets to buy.

I believe the farmers in the west are well aware that you cannot have both. It is up to the farmers and they have made a decision. If the question put to them was unfactual, then that is a problem the Federal Government will have to address in the future.