Does our charter cater to cults?

[Leafless]

In Canada we are all suppose to be equal according to charter rights.

Some groups it appears, are granted an extension of legal rights elevating them to a higher level of importance and superiority as compared to all other Canadians supposedly to create a sense of equality.

But just who are these extended rights being granted to?

They are basically Quebec, Aboriginals and homosexuals.

But if you look at these groups, they are or could be, identified as cults, as pertaining to the 'Cult of Quebec', The Cult of Homosexuality, and the Cult of Aboriginals since they are mostly dependent on their own identity and entity.

Is this really how you treat the rest of the population of Canada, as second class citizen's and forcing them to support these cults?

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Leafless,

We also support the cult of christianity, the cult of judaism, and the cult of big business. What choice to make? All, none or some?

[Leafless]

Dear Leafless,

We also support the cult of christianity, the cult of judaism, and the cult of big business. What choice to make? All, none or some?

I am surprised you would call Christianity a cult, when you very well must know it is a bona fide religion, within the framework of an established society.

Big business serves the requirements of society and without it we would not have much of a society, that is in a freer democratic society.

The cults I am referring to, are cults supported by the 'Charter of Rights and Freedoms'. These cults are self serving and politically aloof in a way that sabotages and holds hostage the rest of society to meet their demands.

The weird part is, this recognition is government created and flies in the face concerning the whole purpose of a society and ordered community initially.

[jbg]

But just who are these extended rights being granted to?

They are basically Quebec, Aboriginals and homosexuals.

But if you look at these groups, they are or could be, identified as cults, as pertaining to the 'Cult of Quebec', The Cult of Homosexuality, and the Cult of Aboriginals since they are mostly dependent on their own identity and entity.

Is this really how you treat the rest of the population of Canada, as second class citizen's and forcing them to support these cults?

Dear Leafless,

We also support the cult of christianity, the cult of judaism, and the cult of big business. What choice to make? All, none or some?

Paul Johnson described the 1970's as America's Suicide Attempt (link). When one orients a society for the benefit of its freaks rather than its producers and accomplishers, that society, temporarily or permanently, is imploding. Hopefully that won't happen to Canada; it took Reagan to rescue us from our funk.

[guyser]

Dear Leafless,

We also support the cult of christianity, the cult of judaism, and the cult of big business. What choice to make? All, none or some?

I am surprised you would call Christianity a cult, when you very well must know it is a bona fide religion, within the framework of an established society.

Big business serves the requirements of society and without it we would not have much of a society, that is in a freer democratic society.

The cults I am referring to, are cults supported by the 'Charter of Rights and Freedoms'. These cults are self serving and politically aloof in a way that sabotages and holds hostage the rest of society to meet their demands.

The weird part is, this recognition is government created and flies in the face concerning the whole purpose of a society and ordered community initially.

Christianity is in my mind a cult, and using your above description of same, I see you must agree, although I dont think that was your intent.

But leaving that one alone, please indicate where you or society have been held hostage to meet their demands?

[Leafless]

Christianity is in my mind a cult, and using your above description of same, I see you must agree, although I dont think that was your intent.

But leaving that one alone, please indicate where you or society have been held hostage to meet their demands?

There is a major difference between a religion and a cult. This is primarily relating to religion:

(1) A cult uses phychological coercion, to recrute, indoctrinate and retain members.

(2) Forms an Elist society.

(3) Founder leader is self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable.

(4) Belives 'end justifies the means' in raising funds and recruitment.

(5) Its wealth does not benefit its members or society.

Pertaining to how Canadian society is held hostage to their demands is all in the charter of rights and freedoms.

I think you mentioned you are not familiar with Canadian politics, therefore I would suggest you read fully the charter which not only serves as a protection of rights and freedoms for all Canadians, but also tries to create 'equality' for groups the government considers worthy of extra attention.

This is what the contentious issue is all about and how the government implements it to do just that within the confines of a supposedly democratic country. The end result being is that the majority of Canadians become second class citizens, as a result of this discriminatory policy with a total lack of controls to prevent an abuse of powers, as well as paying for the demands or rights given to these groups (cults) as they nicely fit the description.

[jbg]

There is a major difference between a religion and a cult. This is primarily relating to religion:

(1) A cult uses phychological coercion, to recrute, indoctrinate and retain members.

(2) Forms an Elist society.

(3) Founder leader is self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable.

(4) Belives 'end justifies the means' in raising funds and recruitment.

(5) Its wealth does not benefit its members or society.

What about "religions" such as Islam that satisfy four out of the five criteria? See above for one that does not apply to Islam (unless dead founder counts, since Muhamet was definately "self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable")? IMHO Islam is a "death cult".

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Leafless,

There is a major difference between a religion and a cult. This is primarily relating to religion:

(1) A cult uses phychological coercion, to recrute, indoctrinate and retain members.

(2) Forms an Elist society.

(3) Founder leader is self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable.

(4) Belives 'end justifies the means' in raising funds and recruitment.

(5) Its wealth does not benefit its members or society.

the charter which not only serves as a protection of rights and freedoms for all Canadians, but also tries to create 'equality' for groups the government considers worthy of extra attention.

Let's see, #1...telling your children, and anyone else that will listen, that they will burn in hell for eternity if they don't worship how they've been told fits this description nicely. Don't forget, most of the world's 'christian' population were converted by conquest.

#2, you seem to wish this 'elitist' society yourself, so that the law of the land is dictated by your beliefs, whether or not it is the majority.

#3,...ever heard of 'papal infallability'? Millions flocking to Rome to hear a ninety year old mumble mass in Latin?

#4, again, most of the world's populace funded (and joined) the church at some point in history through the sword.

#5...what good does the church give to it's members by hoarding golden goblets and gilded columns? The 'church' in Rome is one of the few entities that has it's own 'secret service', protecting is ass(ets)...with billions in revenue and trillions in real estate, whom do they serve, god or mammon? Society and 'it's members' are merely the trough.

As to the last bit, it is not 'extra attention' that is being demanded, but inclusion. That is, coming up from less to become equal, but you choose to see it as 'extra', because it is more than they presently have.

[jbg]

As to the last bit, it is not 'extra attention' that is being demanded, but inclusion. That is, coming up from less to become equal, but you choose to see it as 'extra', because it is more than they presently have.

How about the kind of "inclusion" people such as George Washington Carver, a child of slaves who invented just about every use for the peanut known to man? This person solved the problem of pellagra in the Old South, and contributed much to the greatness of the country.

What about the kind of "inclusion" S.I. Hiakawa (sp), a Japanese-American, linguist and former president of University of California at Berkely got?

What about the kind of "inclusion" Rudolph Guiliani, an Italian-American, got?

Certainly, Stevie Wonder, a blind African-American, is a member of two "disadvantaged" groups. Does he lack for inclusion in American society?

Give your head a shake.

[guyser]

There is a major difference between a religion and a cult. This is primarily relating to religion:

(1) A cult uses phychological coercion, to recrute, indoctrinate and retain members.

(2) Forms an Elist society.

(3) Founder leader is self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable.

(4) Belives 'end justifies the means' in raising funds and recruitment.

(5) Its wealth does not benefit its members or society.

Pertaining to how Canadian society is held hostage to their demands is all in the charter of rights and freedoms.

I think you mentioned you are not familiar with Canadian politics, therefore I would suggest you read fully the charter which not only serves as a protection of rights and freedoms for all Canadians, but also tries to create 'equality' for groups the government considers worthy of extra attention.

This is what the contentious issue is all about and how the government implements it to do just that within the confines of a supposedly democratic country. The end result being is that the majority of Canadians become second class citizens, as a result of this discriminatory policy with a total lack of controls to prevent an abuse of powers, as well as paying for the demands or rights given to these groups (cults) as they nicely fit the description.

Yes I am familiar with Canadian politics . Born and raised here.

#1-2-3-4-5-sounds like the Catholic Church, Mormon Church, Jehovahs et al.

I still cannot see where you (or me) have been made a second class citizen. And what money have we expended for the "demands and rights " given these groups?

All "cults" get tax breaks.

[Slavik44]

(1) A cult uses phychological coercion, to recrute, indoctrinate and retain members.

So like if you took your child to church and every week he heard your life was not worth living for a second if you don't have jesus...where does that fall on the recruit, indoctrinate, and retain scale?

(2) Forms an Elist society.

1 Peter 2:9 (King James Version)

But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

(3) Founder leader is self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable.

John 14:6

Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

(4) Belives 'end justifies the means' in raising funds and recruitment.

(5) Its wealth does not benefit its members or society.

Oh I get it, they are not building nice big fancy buildings with custom stained glass windows or ornate drawings on the roof?

Pertaining to how Canadian society is held hostage to their demands is all in the charter of rights and freedoms.

Does that mean we can finally do away with those tax exemptions?

[Leafless]

There is a major difference between a religion and a cult. This is primarily relating to religion:

(1) A cult uses phychological coercion, to recrute, indoctrinate and retain members.

(2) Forms an Elist society.

(3) Founder leader is self appointed, dogmatic, charismatic and unaccountable.

(4) Belives 'end justifies the means' in raising funds and recruitment.

(5) Its wealth does not benefit its members or society.

Pertaining to how Canadian society is held hostage to their demands is all in the charter of rights and freedoms.

I think you mentioned you are not familiar with Canadian politics, therefore I would suggest you read fully the charter which not only serves as a protection of rights and freedoms for all Canadians, but also tries to create 'equality' for groups the government considers worthy of extra attention.

This is what the contentious issue is all about and how the government implements it to do just that within the confines of a supposedly democratic country. The end result being is that the majority of Canadians become second class citizens, as a result of this discriminatory policy with a total lack of controls to prevent an abuse of powers, as well as paying for the demands or rights given to these groups (cults) as they nicely fit the description.

Yes I am familiar with Canadian politics . Born and raised here.

#1-2-3-4-5-sounds like the Catholic Church, Mormon Church, Jehovahs et al.

I still cannot see where you (or me) have been made a second class citizen. And what money have we expended for the "demands and rights " given these groups?

All "cults" get tax breaks.

If you think #1,2,3,4 and 5 refer to Christianity rather then the makings of a cult, then there is no sense carrying this discussion any further as your brain is incapable of recognizing the difference between religion and a cult.

Religion is a welcome addition to most countries and forms the backbone in societies to harmonize the relationship between government and religion to help establish a strong united country especially pertaining to families.

Domesticated religions harm no one and is simply the believe in a superhuman controlling power especially in a personal God entitled to obedience and worship.

But, I can see a difference of opinion being created in Canada (more so) by certain governments to try to remove the importance of the church entirely. This is because the emphasis is now removed from family, to accommodate large scale immigration and attend to their religions and other needs at the expense of the needs of Canadian society.

This is what I call a government shooting itself in the foot and WILL be doomed to failure as for certain a backlash will develop over a multitude of unresolvable issues.

You ask "I still cannot see where you (or me) have been made a second class citizen. And what money have we expended for the "demands and rights " given these groups?"

Well take official languages Sec. 16 to 22 including 'official bilingualism under federal entities' for instance.

You tell me (if you have any idea) what this cost Canada since its conception?

You tell me if this is not responsible for the creation of an elite society, separate and only serving its own interest within the confines of Canadian society?

You tell me if this has not humbled and humiliated English speaking Canadians to the level of second or third class or even worse, Canadian citizens?

You tell me if language in Quebec is a way to recruit Canadians and immigrants to the ideologies of Quebec?

You tell me if wealth created within Quebec is beneficial to Canadian society? This is a hypothetical question considering Quebec has always been a 'have not province' but yet enjoys rights, privileges and programs other provinces can only dream about.

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Leafless,

If you think #1,2,3,4 and 5 refer to Christianity rather then the makings of a cult, then there is no sense carrying this discussion any further as your brain is incapable of recognizing the difference between religion and a cult.

Um, actually, the point that you are missing is that we are not saying 'rather', but instead 'also'.

Domesticated religions harm no one and is simply the believe in a superhuman controlling power especially in a personal God entitled to obedience and worship.

This is fine, and you are welcome to it. Perhaps you can lobby have 'the right to personal beliefs that harm no one' included in the Charter of Human Rights and Freedoms.

This is because the emphasis is now removed from family, to accommodate large scale immigration and attend to their religions and other needs at the expense of the needs of Canadian society.

Interesting that you use the term 'their religions'...this is logically opposite of 'our' religion', but more to the point, 'your' religion. Mine and yours are not the same. So, were you to re-write the sentence as: "Immigrants are undermining the supremacy of my religion", it sounds rather silly and selfish.

Secularism is the notion of keeping all religions out of gov't (and laws, and the justice system), and in my opinion, rightly so.

[Leafless]

theloniusfleabag

So to sum it up, Quebec, homosexuals, Aboriginals, atheist, new mass immigration with all their baggage, are all riding the same gravy train screwing up an existing established society, all benefiting from that HOLY GOVERNMENT BIBLE, the CHARTER of RIGHTS and FREEDOMS. All of this, thanks primarily to Quebec.

This at the same time of course is depleting the resources of the tax payers of Canada, putting them in the poor house while corporations rub their hands with glee, with the influx of refugees and assisted immigrants all ready to spend their free government dollars on their products.

I have a feeling and it won't be all that long hopefully, that this country will collapse under the weight of its own STUPITY, when then we could possibly all become U.S. citizens, HOPEFULLY.

[Drea]

theloniusfleabag

So to sum it up, Quebec, homosexuals, Aboriginals, atheist, new mass immigration with all their baggage, are all riding the same gravy train screwing up an existing established society, all benefiting from that HOLY GOVERNMENT BIBLE, the CHARTER of RIGHTS and FREEDOMS. All of this, thanks primarily to Quebec.

This at the same time of course is depleting the resources of the tax payers of Canada, putting them in the poor house while corporations rub their hands with glee, with the influx of refugees and assisted immigrants all ready to spend their free government dollars on their products.

I have a feeling and it won't be all that long hopefully, that this country will collapse under the weight of its own STUPITY, when then we could possibly all become U.S. citizens, HOPEFULLY.

You could go to the US and claim refugee status based on "my morals are being infringed upon!" -- I'm sure they will be sympathetic to your plight.

Better yet, why not get an application to live there. Get yourself a green card and a job and you will be all set. No sense ruining Canada for the rest of us just because you hate it here.

[Leafless]

theloniusfleabag

So to sum it up, Quebec, homosexuals, Aboriginals, atheist, new mass immigration with all their baggage, are all riding the same gravy train screwing up an existing established society, all benefiting from that HOLY GOVERNMENT BIBLE, the CHARTER of RIGHTS and FREEDOMS. All of this, thanks primarily to Quebec.

This at the same time of course is depleting the resources of the tax payers of Canada, putting them in the poor house while corporations rub their hands with glee, with the influx of refugees and assisted immigrants all ready to spend their free government dollars on their products.

I have a feeling and it won't be all that long hopefully, that this country will collapse under the weight of its own STUPITY, when then we could possibly all become U.S. citizens, HOPEFULLY.

You could go to the US and claim refugee status based on "my morals are being infringed upon!" -- I'm sure they will be sympathetic to your plight.

Better yet, why not get an application to live there. Get yourself a green card and a job and you will be all set. No sense ruining Canada for the rest of us just because you hate it here.

I have principles.

And the main one is: No Bunch of LOSERS will EVER force me to leave MY COUNTRY and millions of other Canadians FEEL THE SAME WAY.

[Drea]

But you hate your country... What makes you proud to be Canadian? What makes you like it here?

Those "millions" you speak of ... if there are so many, why don't you all get together and vote for the Christian Heritage Party?

Sheesh, quit complainin' and DO something already!

[guyser]

Still waiting leafless for your post of "stripped rights" . Will I have to wait long?

[Leafless]

Still waiting leafless for your post of "stripped rights" . Will I have to wait long?

What we have in Canada is a system 'Governmental Apartheid' allowing minorities to strip away the RIGHTS of majority English speaking Canadians concerning an existing ESTABLISHED country.

The rights stripped away from Canadians involve a loss of linguistic rights and traditional rights pertaining to religious traditions relating to Christianity as well as the federal government excluding the rest of Canada from obtaining the SAME PROVINCIAL RIGHTS and POWERS as those given to Quebec.

English the majority language of commerce is now legally hampered by unwanted government legislation creating a form of APARTHEID, creating English second class citizens by forcing French minority linguistic rule both in the federal government and throughout whatever provinces the federal government feels like promoting that French minority language over the existing rights of provincial language legislation.

The original proposed bicultural Canada was rejected in favour of a charter protected multicultural Canada which in effect DESTROYED the OLD CANADA with this oppressing , highly discriminating system of federal government apartheid.

This is a horrible event for English speaking Canadian Christians to be so trapped within the bowels of government with absolutely NO INDEPENDENT SAY in their own CONSTITUTION.

[guyser]

What we have in Canada is a system 'Governmental Apartheid' allowing minorities to strip away the RIGHTS of majority English speaking Canadians concerning an existing ESTABLISHED country.

The rights stripped away from Canadians involve a loss of linguistic rights and traditional rights pertaining to religious traditions relating to Christianity as well as the federal government excluding the rest of Canada from obtaining the SAME PROVINCIAL RIGHTS and POWERS as those given to Quebec.

English the majority language of commerce is now legally hampered by unwanted government legislation creating a form of APARTHEID, creating English second class citizens by forcing French minority linguistic rule both in the federal government and throughout whatever provinces the federal government feels like promoting that French minority language over the existing rights of provincial language legislation.

The original proposed bicultural Canada was rejected in favour of a charter protected multicultural Canada which in effect DESTROYED the OLD CANADA with this oppressing , highly discriminating system of federal government apartheid.

This is a horrible event for English speaking Canadian Christians to be so trapped within the bowels of government with absolutely NO INDEPENDENT SAY in their own CONSTITUTION.

I am still waiting leafless. Will it be much longer ?

Oh...that was an answer? Who knew. Umm.....where are the rights that English speaking CDN's were stripped of in your post.? What specific rights were denied you?

[Leafless]

I am still waiting leafless. Will it be much longer ?

Oh...that was an answer? Who knew. Umm.....where are the rights that English speaking CDN's were stripped of in your post.? What specific rights were denied you?

The Rights Canadians SHOULD HAVE to DECIDE the RIGHTS to cults, namely Quebec, Aboriginals and homosexuals.

[theloniusfleabag]

Dear Leafless,

The Rights Canadians SHOULD HAVE to DECIDE the RIGHTS to[...] Quebec, Aboriginals and homosexuals

I and another had a long discussion with Hugo about 'what constitutes a right', and it came down to how rights are dispensed and to whom. Hugo asked, "Do you feel that the Jews in the gas chamber have the right to life?" My answer was, "the Nazi's didn't give them that right". Only intervention, and the vanquishing of that power, led to the re-allotment of the right to life to Jews. By the rest of the world. At least in that place in time.

So, Leafless, you seem to be marking, in an elitist way, who rates as qualifying for human rights protections and who doesn't. Or, who qualifies as human and who doesn't.

[Leafless]

Dear Leafless,

The Rights Canadians SHOULD HAVE to DECIDE the RIGHTS to[...] Quebec, Aboriginals and homosexuals

I and another had a long discussion with Hugo about 'what constitutes a right', and it came down to how rights are dispensed and to whom. Hugo asked, "Do you feel that the Jews in the gas chamber have the right to life?" My answer was, "the Nazi's didn't give them that right". Only intervention, and the vanquishing of that power, led to the re-allotment of the right to life to Jews. By the rest of the world. At least in that place in time.

So, Leafless, you seem to be marking, in an elitist way, who rates as qualifying for human rights protections and who doesn't. Or, who qualifies as human and who doesn't.

Your argument is badly flawed, as NO Canadian was ever DENIED the same rights as any other Canadian.

What the problem is, these cultist refuse to UTILIZE these same rights as other Canadians do, NOT that they are denied RIGHTS.

For any government to pander to individualism to destroy initial democratic rights of ALL other Canadian citizens, is a direct form of APARTHEID mastered and controlled by a dictatorship.

Canadians as a group have been led down the garden path, in the same hypnotic fashion as members being indoctrinated into a CULT.

[jbg]

Still waiting leafless for your post of "stripped rights" . Will I have to wait long?

From what I understand, and from limited personal experience in Montreal, the requirement of bi-lingualism from civil service participants is in fact highly discriminatory against English-speakers. Allegedly bi-lingual Federal security personal patrolling the Gomery hearing were not willing to speak English when I stumbled into the hearing area in search of a bathroom. They feigned not understanding the word "bathroom" and shook a set of handcuffs at me, until I said, awkwardly, "salle de baines, sivouplez (sp)".

I understand from some career military people that their promotion and advancement career was destroyed by the discrimination in favor of Francophones. These are no piddling matters.

[Figleaf]

But just who are these extended rights being granted to?

They are basically Quebec, Aboriginals and homosexuals.

Such humbug!