Belinda taking shots at own party

[mikedavid00]

Belinda is trying her best to reach the top of the Liberal party and will use any means necessary. She tried to head the 1 member, 1 vote system which would allow the Libearl leadship to be decided upon by all Libearl members. Belinda knows that she scores very high in polls and the media loves her. She's smart. She knows she can't fight the insiders behind the scenes at the concention. She lost her 1 member, 1 vote innitiative.

So to build her power, she's heading the Liberal womens caucus. And to further stereo-type women, releases a 'pink book'. Nice one Belinda.

She made these comment regarding her own Liberal party:

"Remember the Red Book?" she asked, in reference to Liberal campaign platforms she said were never fully honoured.

She said women may be barefoot and pregnant under the Conservatives, but they remained too poor to pay for rent and feed their children during 13 years of Liberal governments that cut employment insurance, refused to standardize the minimum wage and did little to address child poverty.

Ouch. That doesn't sound like a team player.

Her latest was questioning Dion's dual citizenship. Watch how she compares herself to Dion:

Belinda Stronach is developing quite the track record of undermining her party leaders. After only three days, Stronach is already questioning her new leader.:

The facts:

Stronach is questioning Liberal Leader Stephane Dion being a dual-citizen, suggesting that he should give up the dual-citizenship: “I don’t have dual citizenship, but I think he has to seriously consider that.” (CTV News, December 5, 2006)

After only three days, Stronach is already trying to undermine her new leader and questioning his decisions – quite possibly a record

After Dion loses the next election, it will be very fun to see Belinda work on trying to overthrow their leader. Sad thing is, I think people are going to back her.

[gc1765]

So? What's wrong with a bit of constructive criticism? Would you rather that all the Liberal MPs blindly followed their leader, and dont' speak out, like the Conservatives? I just hope that Dion doesn't do to Belinda what Harper did to Turner...

Belinda is trying her best to reach the top of the Liberal party and will use any means necessary. She tried to head the 1 member, 1 vote system which would allow the Libearl leadship to be decided upon by all Libearl members. Belinda knows that she scores very high in polls and the media loves her. She's smart. She knows she can't fight the insiders behind the scenes at the concention. She lost her 1 member, 1 vote innitiative.

So? The 1 member, 1 vote system is a good idea (albeit not perfect). Isn't that what the Conservatives use?

After only three days, Stronach is already questioning her new leader.:

Good for her.

After Dion loses the next election, it will be very fun to see Belinda work on trying to overthrow their leader. Sad thing is, I think people are going to back her.

This is the same Belinda who decided NOT to run for the leadership?....despite the supposed lack of tier-1 candidates.

[mikedavid00]

So? What's wrong with a bit of constructive criticism? Would you rather that all the Liberal MPs blindly followed their leader, and dont' speak out, like the Conservatives? I just hope that Dion doesn't do to Belinda what Harper did to Turner...

Dion very well might. In fighting under Martin got really ugly and was bad publicity for the party. It's something I don't think any first world nation has seen before in modern history "I dare him to fire me. He doesn't have the balls". That was just unprofessional and low class. Martin's caucus started acting like children. I don't think Dion is a very friendly or approachable guy. I think Belinda had better watch herself.

So? The 1 member, 1 vote system is a good idea (albeit not perfect). Isn't that what the Conservatives use?

It is a good idea to stop the internall corruption at these conventions. The CPC use the best stytem. They use a 1 member 1 vote system with an electory collage. Basically one big city can't control the vote. This is how the US system works.

NOTE that some polls showed higher support for Belinda when she was running against Harper. That's how well she does poltically.

This is the same Belinda who decided NOT to run for the leadership?....despite the supposed lack of tier-1 candidates.

She didn't run because she said this was more important to reform the system and make it democratic. She was right. She also said: "i'm not here to make friends".

She's too smart to be able to go against the establishment. Rae coulnd't do it. Ignatieff the front runner couldn't do it. Now I doubt she'll be leader because the old establishment behind the scenese wont back her. She almost won her 1 member 1 vote idea. It was so close. You should have seen the look on her face when she lost.

She was basically trying to ask the privilaged, at the convention, if they should open up voting outside the convention. It's the fair democratic thing to do for the party members. Nope. The privilaged couldn't let go and be fair to all the party members.

Thats the Liberals for ya.

[gc1765]

I don't think Dion is a very friendly or approachable guy.

What makes you think he is unfriendly?

She didn't run because she said this was more important to reform the system and make it democratic. She was right. She also said: "i'm not here to make friends".

She's too smart to be able to go against the establishment. Rae coulnd't do it. Ignatieff the front runner couldn't do it. Now I doubt she'll be leader because the old establishment behind the scenese wont back her. She almost won her 1 member 1 vote idea. It was so close. You should have seen the look on her face when she lost.

She was basically trying to ask the privilaged, at the convention, if they should open up voting outside the convention. It's the fair democratic thing to do for the party members. Nope. The privilaged couldn't let go and be fair to all the party members.

Thats the Liberals for ya.

Sounds like you are now complimenting Belinda, whereas before it seemed you were criticizing her. She is trying to get rid of the "establishment" and make it more democratic, that is a good thing. If you want to criticize anyone you should be criticizing the delegates who voted against the 1 member 1 vote system. I'm not sure that I'd call them privilaged though...why would anyone want to pay thousands of dollars just to have one vote for the next leader?

[mikedavid00]

What makes you think he is unfriendly?

It's his party memebers that didn't support him during the convention. Supposedly he's not open to new ideas and only wants things to be seen his way. He's supposeldy difficult to work with. That's the rumors I heard.

Sounds like you are now complimenting Belinda, whereas before it seemed you were criticizing her. She is trying to get rid of the "establishment" and make it more democratic, that is a good thing. If you want to criticize anyone you should be criticizing the delegates who voted against the 1 member 1 vote system. I'm not sure that I'd call them privilaged though...why would anyone want to pay thousands of dollars just to have one vote for the next leader?

I agree. It's very good she is trying to do the right thing. But don't think it's not eventually for her own self interest. I do think those delegates deservce the blame. The who system is corrupt in it's current form.

[geoffrey]

What makes you think he is unfriendly?

It's his party memebers that didn't support him during the convention. Supposedly he's not open to new ideas and only wants things to be seen his way. He's supposeldy difficult to work with. That's the rumors I heard.

Exactly. When you have zero former cabinet support... that's ugly. He must really step on toes or really smell bad. Either one, your choice.

[gc1765]

It's his party memebers that didn't support him during the convention. Supposedly he's not open to new ideas and only wants things to be seen his way. He's supposeldy difficult to work with. That's the rumors I heard.

Aren't you the one who was saying that Dion was the "establishment" candidate? But now you're saying he isn't supported by his party members (or cabinet) aka the "establishment"? Make up your mind...is Dion supported by the establishment or not?

[mikedavid00]

It's his party memebers that didn't support him during the convention. Supposedly he's not open to new ideas and only wants things to be seen his way. He's supposeldy difficult to work with. That's the rumors I heard.

Aren't you the one who was saying that Dion was the "establishment" candidate? But now you're saying he isn't supported by his party members (or cabinet) aka the "establishment"? Make up your mind...is Dion supported by the establishment or not?

That's the thing. The other party members are the anti-establishment. Dion/Kennedy had the old establishment backing them. Chretien, Trudeaus son, and other people behind the scenes. Rae had the new establishment backing them and I'm sure Stronach wanted to get Rae in.

But the old Quebec establishment that owns the Liberal party pervaled.

[gc1765]

That's the thing. The other party members are the anti-establishment. Dion/Kennedy had the old establishment backing them. Chretien, Trudeaus son, and other people behind the scenes. Rae had the new establishment backing them and I'm sure Stronach wanted to get Rae in.

But the old Quebec establishment that owns the Liberal party pervaled.

Where did you hear that Chretien backed Dion? I thought he backed Rae.

So, if the party members are the anti-establishment, just who is the "establishment"?

[mikedavid00]

That's the thing. The other party members are the anti-establishment. Dion/Kennedy had the old establishment backing them. Chretien, Trudeaus son, and other people behind the scenes. Rae had the new establishment backing them and I'm sure Stronach wanted to get Rae in.

But the old Quebec establishment that owns the Liberal party pervaled.

Where did you hear that Chretien backed Dion? I thought he backed Rae.

So, if the party members are the anti-establishment, just who is the "establishment"?

THose backings were fronts for the public to make it look like there wasn't any quebec insider stuff going on.

The establishment are a slew of people behind the scenese, Trudeau, Chretien, and that legacy which is all tied together. Dion is part of that. So is Kennedy.

Anti-establishment was Rae and all the people standing next time him. Along with teh people who were backing Belinda when she was trying to topple the establishment via 1 member, 1 vote.

My brother is smarter than me, he said before the whole thing began "the person who wins is going to be who the establishment behind the scenes want to win". I thought nah... it's going to be Rae or Ignatieff..

He was right after all.

And the new Liberal president is Quebecois.

[Saturn]

Ouch. That doesn't sound like a team player.

What does a team-player mean to you? An obedient brownnoser?

What she said is true - I don't see anything wrong with noting the truth.

[normanchateau]

It's his party memebers that didn't support him during the convention. Supposedly he's not open to new ideas and only wants things to be seen his way. He's supposeldy difficult to work with. That's the rumors I heard.

Aren't you the one who was saying that Dion was the "establishment" candidate? But now you're saying he isn't supported by his party members (or cabinet) aka the "establishment"? Make up your mind...is Dion supported by the establishment or not?

That's the thing. The other party members are the anti-establishment. Dion/Kennedy had the old establishment backing them. Chretien, Trudeaus son, and other people behind the scenes. Rae had the new establishment backing them and I'm sure Stronach wanted to get Rae in.

So what you're saying above is that Dion, Kennedy and Rae were all backed by the establishment. ..two by the old establishment and one by the nerw establishment. However, as many Liberal MPs backed Ignatieff as the other three candidates put together. So that makes Ignatieff as the candidate of the Liberal MP establishment unless you view Liberal MPs as not the establishment. One could argue that all four were backed by the establishment.

Why is being an establishment candidate bad in your opinion? And is Harper who was a Reform MP beginning in 1993 then an Alliance MP then a Conservative MP not a candidate of the Conservative establishment?

[betsy]

That's the thing. The other party members are the anti-establishment. Dion/Kennedy had the old establishment backing them. Chretien, Trudeaus son, and other people behind the scenes. Rae had the new establishment backing them and I'm sure Stronach wanted to get Rae in.

But the old Quebec establishment that owns the Liberal party pervaled.

Where did you hear that Chretien backed Dion? I thought he backed Rae.

So, if the party members are the anti-establishment, just who is the "establishment"?

Right on that election day, media were all gushing about the "uncle-nephew" relationship of Dion and Chretien, of how it was Aline Chretien who brought her husband's attention to Dion, saying "you should get that guy into politics...", how Dion and Chretien regularly fish together in the summer....

After his win, media were following and speculating the moment he would go pay his homage to Chretien....and it was like watching sports the way media covered his victory walk....like doing the big score when finally he reached Chretien, "...and there it is, folks," announced the anchorperson!

[jdobbin]

Right on that election day, media were all gushing about the "uncle-nephew" relationship of Dion and Chretien, of how it was Aline Chretien who brought her husband's attention to Dion, saying "you should get that guy into politics...", how Dion and Chretien regularly fish together in the summer....

After his win, media were following and speculating the moment he would go pay his homage to Chretien....and it was like watching sports the way media covered his victory walk....like doing the big score when finally he reached Chretien, "...and there it is, folks," announced the anchorperson!

Did Chretien or his people back Dion for the leadership?

[fellowtraveller]

It does make one wonder if Belinda Beleader has been working for the Tories all along.....

Maybe her dramatic floorcrossing scene was staged, after all the Tories dodged an election they could not win at that time. Maybe now her role is to be the worm in the Liberal apple.......

[betsy]

Right on that election day, media were all gushing about the "uncle-nephew" relationship of Dion and Chretien, of how it was Aline Chretien who brought her husband's attention to Dion, saying "you should get that guy into politics...", how Dion and Chretien regularly fish together in the summer....

After his win, media were following and speculating the moment he would go pay his homage to Chretien....and it was like watching sports the way media covered his victory walk....like doing the big score when finally he reached Chretien, "...and there it is, folks," announced the anchorperson!

Did Chretien or his people back Dion for the leadership?

What do you think? He could've backed both Rae and Dion....following the "anyone-but-Ignatieff" mentality.