Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I thought we were speaking about the war with Lebanon?Israel has shown willingness to negotiate land for peace. The problem is the 'peace' part. hard to negotiate with people who consider you to be monkey's. Well of course the Palestinians might say that it's hard to negotiate with someone who calls you a cockroach. The title of the Thread is "Israel, Palestine and Canada". Where did Lebanon come into this? Israel has shown almost no inclination to give up land for peace, starting from Ben Gurion and proceeding through Meir, Shamir, Netanyahu, Sharon, etc... In fact, Israeli intransigence on the subject of land has been one of the major reasons for the failure to negotiate a settlement. The only Prime Minister who agreed to give up land for peace (Oslo) was Rabin who was assassinated by an ultra-right Jewish religious fanatic who had been energized by Binyamin Netanyahu's anti-Oslo rhetoric. Rabin's widow refused to shake Netanyahu's hand when he came to offer his sympathies. In the following elections, Netanyahu campaigned on the platform that he would not implement Oslo and would continue to build settlements. He was elected and the settlement building accelerated. Israel has consistently persued an expansionist policy while throwing up a "why do they hate us" smokescreen of mythinformation. Palestinian terrorist activity has been, and continues to be, a terribly misguided reponse to an impossible situation and is very wrong on many levels. However, Israel has its own terrorist baggage. Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
normanchateau Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 It's not debatable. Israel is not in Africa. Perhaps you're thinking of Egypt which is. Yeah that's something I would do. Confuse Israel with Egypt. It's possiible given your belief that Israel is in Africa. Quote
scribblet Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I thought we were speaking about the war with Lebanon?Israel has shown willingness to negotiate land for peace. The problem is the 'peace' part. hard to negotiate with people who consider you to be monkey's. Agreed, while I'm sure most Palestinians just want peace and jobs, they sure didn't act that way when they voted in Hamas. They seem to reject peace every time with murderous attacks on innocent civilians. Israel general fulfills its cease-fire committments a while back? They opened up the airport in the Gaza Strip opened the borders between Jordan and Egypt and Israel lifted the barricade or the siege beyond the Palestinian city. what the did the PLO do, oh yea, declare a day of rage, it was supposed to be a ceasefire. What where they raging about then - the cease fire, the chance of peace? Then we have Hamas deliberatly sabotaging peace talks when they undermined Abas days after he agreed to implement a new road map to peace. Sharon and Abbas agree to a ceasefire and from Hamas· 'We are not bound by ceasefire' - Hamas Quote Hey Ho - Ontario Liberals Have to Go - Fight Wynne - save our province
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 It's possiible given your belief that Israel is in Africa. OK. Have it your way. It's in Asia then. Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
Argus Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 The problem I have with Harper announcing that Canada is now pro-Israel is that it runs counter to the wishes of the majority of Canadians who have shown a preference for a neutral stance in successive polls. I believe that we can do the most good by not taking sides. What good did we do last year? Or the last ten years? In fact, we were not entirely neutral. The Liberals sucked up to the Arab vote by refusing to vote against grossly prejudiced, and one-sided UN resolutions. Now we do. Good. MLW Members who routinely refer to previous governments as being apologists for terrorists or supporters of terrorists are being dishonest - it was the previous government who put Hamas and Hezbollah on the terrorist list. And it was the previous prime minister who attended a terrorist fund raiser for the Tamil Tigers, and then laughed and jeered at his questioners when asked about it in the House. I am reporting Argus for bigotry. He routinely slags entire groups of people; I don't know how he has gotten away with it for so long. Cause I look great in heels? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I am reporting Argus for bigotry. He routinely slags entire groups of people; I don't know how he has gotten away with it for so long. Cause I look great in heels? Let me change that then. I don't know how it has gotten away with it for so long. Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
Argus Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 Israel has consistently persued an expansionist policy while throwing up a "why do they hate us" smokescreen of mythinformation. If Israel wanted to expand it could easily drive all the Arabs out and just take over. Why shouldn't they? Who's gonna stop them? The UN? Which squealed impotently about ethnic cleansing in Yugoslavia? The same UN which is squealing impotently about ethnic cleansing in Darfur? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 Canada has always taken pains to remain neutral, Former Foreign Affairs Minister John Manley: "We have never been neutral in the Middle East - we have always been a friend of Israel." http://johnmanley.blogspot.com/2006/08/joh...-on-israel.html Sure they were, like when they were sitting on their hands during all those UN sessions and votes condemning Israel for defending itself. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I wonder if people realize that by other nations taking sides in the eternal conflict found in the middle east that we are perpetuating their misery. No, the Arab world is perpetuating misery by funding the terrorists who attack Israel, and rewarding suicid bombers. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 If Israel wanted to expand it could easily drive all the Arabs out and just take over. Yeah that would work. Just like they did in Lebanon. . Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
M.Dancer Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I wonder if people realize that by other nations taking sides in the eternal conflict found in the middle east that we are perpetuating their misery. No, the Arab world is perpetuating misery by funding the terrorists who attack Israel, and rewarding suicid bombers. Without Israel and the Jews, who would be their scapegoat? Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Argus Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I am reporting Argus for bigotry. He routinely slags entire groups of people; I don't know how he has gotten away with it for so long. Cause I look great in heels? Let me change that then. I don't know how it has gotten away with it for so long. Cause I'm smarter than you are. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 Cause I'm smarter than you are. Not from what I've seen so far. Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
Figleaf Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 Sputtering, infantile drivel. Boo hoooooo! Argus doesn't like me. As a people - there is great sickness with the Palestinians' culture. Yes, its called Israeli Occupation. Israel didn't give them a death cult to worship. They created that themselves. Oh yes? And what precipitated it? Quote
Figleaf Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I wouldn't call backing a democratically elected government defending it's citizens from murderour terrorists who started the war, 'taking sides'. Who started which war? The facts of history might well surprise you. Harper is standing up for what is right, not necessarily popular. Good for him. What would be right is demanding Israel obey international law and desist from oppressing the Palestinians. Israel has shown willingness to negotiate land for peace. The problem is the 'peace' part. Actually, Israel has expressed willingness, but SHOWN unwillingness. The policy of illegal settlement outside its borders alone is sufficient to disprove any real willingness to achieve a negotiated settlement. Basically, it looks like Israel really wants the Palestinians to die quietly and be forgotten by history. Quote
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 Without Israel and the Jews, who would be their scapegoat? Another convert to the "Poor us, why do they hate us?" mythinformation campaign. Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
M.Dancer Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 When Israel starts planting bombs in Argentina, get back to me......... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 When Israel starts planting bombs in Argentina, get back to me......... Well there was a little episode during which it was planting them in theatres and mailboxes in Egypt. Does that qualify? Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
White Doors Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I wouldn't call backing a democratically elected government defending it's citizens from murderour terrorists who started the war, 'taking sides'. Who started which war? The facts of history might well surprise you. Hezbollah started the war. Harper is standing up for what is right, not necessarily popular. Good for him. What would be right is demanding Israel obey international law and desist from oppressing the Palestinians. They are not oppressing the Palestinians. Israel has shown willingness to negotiate land for peace. The problem is the 'peace' part. Actually, Israel has expressed willingness, but SHOWN unwillingness. The policy of illegal settlement outside its borders alone is sufficient to disprove any real willingness to achieve a negotiated settlement. Basically, it looks like Israel really wants the Palestinians to die quietly and be forgotten by history. Really, they completely pulled out of Gaza and got rocket attacks for thanks. Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
Figleaf Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 I wouldn't call backing a democratically elected government defending it's citizens from murderour terrorists who started the war, 'taking sides'. Who started which war? The facts of history might well surprise you. Hezbollah started the war. Harper is standing up for what is right, not necessarily popular. Good for him. What would be right is demanding Israel obey international law and desist from oppressing the Palestinians. They are not oppressing the Palestinians. Israel has shown willingness to negotiate land for peace. The problem is the 'peace' part. Actually, Israel has expressed willingness, but SHOWN unwillingness. The policy of illegal settlement outside its borders alone is sufficient to disprove any real willingness to achieve a negotiated settlement. Basically, it looks like Israel really wants the Palestinians to die quietly and be forgotten by history. Really, they completely pulled out of Gaza and got rocket attacks for thanks. Withdrawal from Gaza was not remotely sufficient to redress the causes of the conflict, and LO! the conflict continued. After Italy pulled out of Ethiopia, were the Allies wrong to invade Italy? Quote
Higgly Posted November 1, 2006 Report Posted November 1, 2006 Really, they completely pulled out of Gaza and got rocket attacks for thanks. Israel had no choice but to pull out of Gaza. The cost of defending a handful of settlers was horrendous, and even an idiot like Sharon had to recognize that Gaza is completely unmanageable. How many people have those rockets killed? Say compared to the constant extra-judicial helicopter gunship assassinations that Israel now carries out as an almost daily routine.... Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
jbg Posted November 2, 2006 Report Posted November 2, 2006 I wonder if people realize that by other nations taking sides in the eternal conflict found in the middle east that we are perpetuating their misery. No, the Arab world is perpetuating misery by funding the terrorists who attack Israel, and rewarding suicid bombers. Without Israel and the Jews, who would be their scapegoat? Each other, as in the way Sunnis and Shi'ites are butchering each other in Iraq or Janjaweed and other Muslims are butchering each other in Sudan. Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
Higgly Posted November 2, 2006 Report Posted November 2, 2006 Each other, as in the way Sunnis and Shi'ites are butchering each other in Iraq .... Funny how that all came about isn't it? Quote "We have seen the enemy and he is us!". Pogo (Walt Kelly).
Argus Posted November 2, 2006 Report Posted November 2, 2006 When Israel starts planting bombs in Argentina, get back to me......... Well there was a little episode during which it was planting them in theatres and mailboxes in Egypt. Does that qualify? I don't seem to recall that. Was it, like, way before I was even born? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted November 2, 2006 Report Posted November 2, 2006 Sputtering, infantile drivel. Boo hoooooo! Argus doesn't like me. As a people - there is great sickness with the Palestinians' culture. Yes, its called Israeli Occupation. Israel didn't give them a death cult to worship. They created that themselves. Oh yes? And what precipitated it? I'm glad you asked. It seems this Jew visited the Golden Temple, and this set off years of rioting and bloodshed called "The intifada", wherein the Palestinian terrorist groups killed every Jew they could lay their hands on. Needlss to say, this created all kinds of security problems for Israel, but it has managed to survive regardless. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
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