Harper hires polling firm to guide his path on environment

[gerryhatrick]

Pollster urges Tories to go greener

Mike De Souza, CanWest News Service

Published: Friday, September 01, 2006

OTTAWA - A polling firm recruited by the federal government is advising Prime Minister Stephen Harper that he can use a major environmental policy announcement in the coming weeks as a ''wedge issue'' to sway voter opinion in the next election.

snip

Ryan Sparrow, a spokesperson for Environment Minister Rona Ambrose, refused to comment on the reasons for the study or its cost to taxpayers.

snip

http://www.canada.com/topics/news/politics...ca72&k=5185

Who would have thunk it...the Conservatives hire pollsters to tell them how to act.

Sort of like Frank Luntz I guess....he is a pollster. They're no doubt also following his model on the environment...i.e. don't say "global warming"...say "climate change".

Details here: http://allpoliticsnow.com/content/view/28/1/

scroll to "Luntz advises Conservatives to not talk about “global warming”"

But again....who would have guessed that Conservatives hire pollsters to tell them how to behave!

ON THE ENVIRONMENT OF ALL ISSUES!!!!

I'm flabbergasted.

[Ricki Bobbi]

Calling the Prime Minister pathetic. Good stuff gerry. Yet again playing by a different set of rules.

[tml12]

Calling the Prime Minister pathetic. Good stuff gerry. Yet again playing by a different set of rules.

It seems like Harper is trying to figure out what Canadians want and I'll bet he'll deliver for us if it's reasonable. Unlike the Liberals who talk a lot but walk very little.

[Ricki Bobbi]

Yeah, scary Conservatives. Imagine a government actually asking the people what they want in a policy rather than the benevolent paternalism of Liberal governments.

It seems like Harper is trying to figure out what Canadians want and I'll bet he'll deliver for us if it's reasonable. Unlike the Liberals who talk a lot but walk very little.

[gerryhatrick]

Calling the Prime Minister pathetic. Good stuff gerry. Yet again playing by a different set of rules.

"Is THIS pathetic" I wrote.

The obvious translation is that I ask if the hiring of the pollster is pathetic.

You warp it into me calling Harper himself pathetic. This is not the first time you've done this kind of thing. You are well capable of dishonesty, that much I've learned from the small amount I've seen you in action here.

Stop complaining that I an above the rules here. You've done it before, and it's BS. If you have a complaint about me alert the admin rather than start flame wars.

[gerryhatrick]

Yeah, scary Conservatives. Imagine a government actually asking the people what they want in a policy rather than the benevolent paternalism of Liberal governments.

It seems like Harper is trying to figure out what Canadians want and I'll bet he'll deliver for us if it's reasonable. Unlike the Liberals who talk a lot but walk very little.

You could look at it that way....or you could look at it in the light of reality.

They're finding out just what they can get away with on the environment.

They're finding out just how little they can get away with doing on global warming (or "climate change" as they're only willing to call it).

You don't poll on the environment, you act. You act with the best possible information for the good of our society and our world. At least you do if your name isn't Harper.

[tml12]

Calling the Prime Minister pathetic. Good stuff gerry. Yet again playing by a different set of rules.

"Is THIS pathetic" I wrote.

The obvious translation is that the hiring of the pollster is pathetic.

You warp it into me calling Harper himself pathetic. This is not the first time you've done this kind of thing. You are well capable of dishonesty, that much I've learned from the small amount I've seen you in action here.

Stop complaining that I an above the rules here. You've done it before, and it's BS. If you have a complaint about me alert the admin rather than start flame wars.

Come on Gerry it's fairly obvious you think Harper is pathetic...you've insinuated as much.

[tml12]

"You don't poll on the environment, you act."

I agree with you. We need action on the environment. The Liberals signed Canada on to Kyoto because it was what Canadians wanted. They proceded to do absolutely nothing while Canada's greenhouse gas emmissions rose 25% more than the big bad environment-hating USA. It's hard to believe a country governed by Bush is more environmentally-friendly than trendy Liberal Canada, but it's true.

[Ricki Bobbi]

If you just want to attack Harper, don't expect to do it here unchallenged.

Stop complaining that I an above the rules here. You've done it before, and it's BS. If you have a complaint about me alert the admin rather than start flame wars.

Go to babble, or complain to the moderator yourself. Your language is extremely disrespectful to our Prime Minister.

You already posted this issue on another thread.

Me thinks you broke this rule of the forum.

NO TROLLING/FLAMING

Do not post inflammatory remarks just to annoy people. If you are not bringing anything new to the argument, then do not say anything at all.

[August1991]

Who would have thunk it...the Conservatives hire pollsters to tell them how to act.

Sort of like Frank Luntz I guess....he is a pollster. They're no doubt also following his model on the environment...i.e. don't say "global warming"...say "climate change".

The link refers to a meeting between Frank Luntz and Stephen Harper in May 2006.

Then, without any reference to what was discussed in that meeting, the link provides a memo written for George Bush in 2000.

Gerry, can you please provide slightly more timely or pertinent links. You know, ones that don't refer to the Soviet Union or the US president...

(BTW, Luntz' communications advice is pretty good, even now.)

----

As to the CanWest article and the Strategic Counsel poll, are you really shocked to learn that politicians use polls? Really?

The environment poses numerous problems for the Conservatives. They are walking into an area where there is alot of prejudice. I'm not surprised that they would seek the advice of a pollster, particularly about how best to explain their policy to doubtful people.

[Ricki Bobbi]

I'm not sure if Luntz gets how different Canadian politics is than American, but so be it. He's a brilliant man. But like many geniuses he's a bit of a social retard. Sorta burned his bridges at the national level with the Republicans, i.e. the Bush clan. Things do change though. If he backs the right horse in the nomination he could be back on top again.

Then, without any reference to what was discussed in that meeting, the link provides a memo written for George Bush in 2000.

Gerry, can you please provide slightly more timely or pertinent links. You know, ones that don't refer to the Soviet Union or the US president...

(BTW, Luntz' communications advice is pretty good, even now.)

[uOttawaMan]

Partisan politics.. oh how I love thee.

[gerryhatrick]

Calling the Prime Minister pathetic. Good stuff gerry. Yet again playing by a different set of rules.

"Is THIS pathetic" I wrote.

The obvious translation is that the hiring of the pollster is pathetic.

You warp it into me calling Harper himself pathetic. This is not the first time you've done this kind of thing. You are well capable of dishonesty, that much I've learned from the small amount I've seen you in action here.

Stop complaining that I an above the rules here. You've done it before, and it's BS. If you have a complaint about me alert the admin rather than start flame wars.

Come on Gerry it's fairly obvious you think Harper is pathetic...you've insinuated as much.

Whatever. There's what I wrote, and there's the whining by RB over what thinks I wrote. I'm starting to think she's Stephen Harper's mom the way he chases me around crying over how mean I am to Harper!

[gerryhatrick]

If you just want to attack Harper, don't expect to do it here unchallenged.

Stop complaining that I an above the rules here. You've done it before, and it's BS. If you have a complaint about me alert the admin rather than start flame wars.

Go to babble, or complain to the moderator yourself. Your language is extremely disrespectful to our Prime Minister.

Disrespectful to the Prime Minister? Oh, I'm SO SORRY!!

What is wrong with you?

It's you who is trolling, so send those rules to yourself. I have little respect for the way Harper is attempting to lead this Country and it will be a cold day in H#LL before I betray that reality just because he's your beloved Prime Minister.

Blind allegiance and love for Bush is what's gotten the USA into the mess it's in.

I love Canada, not Stephen Harper.

[gerryhatrick]

As to the CanWest article and the Strategic Counsel poll, are you really shocked to learn that politicians use polls? Really?

Actually I'm quite shocked. After all the rightwing accusations against Liberals governing by polls it's amazing to see the Conservatives do it.

Of course the same people now think it's just a perfectly normal way of doing things. Go figure!

I would think that the environment wouldn't require polling. It's very telling that they poll on such a subject.

Get ready for Harpers plan for the environment. No doubt full of the words "clean","safe", and "healthy" - as Frank Luntz advises. No reference to "global warming", I'll wager.

Harper isn't genuinely interested in the environment. If he was, he'd state his opinion on global warming. Instead he avoids the subject....which isn't hard for him since he takes no questions!! And he polls on the subject...to find out just how little is required.

[Ricki Bobbi]

Disrespectful to the Prime Minister? Oh, I'm SO SORRY!!

What is wrong with you?

It's you who is trolling, so send those rules to yourself. I have little respect for the way Harper is attempting to lead this Country and it will be a cold day in H#LL before I betray that reality just because he's your beloved Prime Minister.

Blind allegiance and love for Bush is what's gotten the USA into the mess it's in.

I love Canada, not Stephen Harper.

Those are just the rules of the board. They don't apply to you, yet you are getting into a snit for somebody daring to point them out?

Why not find a board where you won't be breaking the rules to spew your vitirol about Harper?

[gerryhatrick]

Those are just the rules of the board. They don't apply to you, yet you are getting into a snit for somebody daring to point them out?

I am breaking no rule.

I would yet AGAIN tell you to take it to the admin, but I suspect you already have. I have a feeling greg is getting sick of you.

[tml12]

Gerry,

What would you like Harper to do on the environment: follow the Chretien Liberal "do-nothing but talk big" approach? The U.S. under Bush pulled out of Kyoto but the U.S. followed a "Made In USA" approach and the EPA saw to it that the U.S. released it's greenhouse gas emmissions 25% MORE THAN CANADA. Canada has no EPA, no Clean Air Act, just a lot of promises so we can tell the world we're better than the USA.

Currently, the joke seems to be on you. And is Harper comes through with his own plan, the joke will REALLY be on you.

[gerryhatrick]

Currently, the joke seems to be on you. And is Harper comes through with his own plan, the joke will REALLY be on you.

Uh huh, right.

I personally can't wait to see Harpers plan. From the previews it's been getting it sounds like it will take the rug out from under him. Canadians aren't stupid, they will recognize a lack of action on important issues even if it's dressed up in good-sounding language.

If in fact Harpers plan DOES take some real action on global warming I will give due praise.

[Ricki Bobbi]

Sure you will Gerry. Something tells me no matter what Harper does or the action he takes it won't be enough for you.

btw, what do you think of Brian Mulroney's record on the environment?

If in fact Harpers plan DOES take some real action on global warming I will give due praise.

[tml12]

Currently, the joke seems to be on you. And is Harper comes through with his own plan, the joke will REALLY be on you.

Uh huh, right.

I personally can't wait to see Harpers plan. From the previews it's been getting it sounds like it will take the rug out from under him. Canadians aren't stupid, they will recognize a lack of action on important issues even if it's dressed up in good-sounding language.

If in fact Harpers plan DOES take some real action on global warming I will give due praise.

I am in fact very pro-environment. If the environment was the only issue, I would probably vote NDP.

Can you at least recognize that the Liberals failed us with their environmental plan?

[Ricki Bobbi]

There is the rub. Kyoto is not a good thing for Canadians. Can we come up with a better plan? Definitely. Will we? Remains to be seen.

But anybody who calls the Prime Minister *pathetic* for actually asking the Canadian people what they want to see in an environmental plan is too blinded by partisanship to actually give credit, or blame, where it is due.

I am in fact very pro-environment. If the environment was the only issue, I would probably vote NDP.

Can you at least recognize that the Liberals failed us with their environmental plan?

[tml12]

There is the rub. Kyoto is not a good thing for Canadians. Can we come up with a better plan? Definitely. Will we? Remains to be seen.

But anybody who calls the Prime Minister *pathetic* for actually asking the Canadian people what they want to see in an environmental plan is too blinded by partisanship to actually give credit, or blame, where it is due.

I am in fact very pro-environment. If the environment was the only issue, I would probably vote NDP.

Can you at least recognize that the Liberals failed us with their environmental plan?

I should correct myself. I am as pro-environment as most NDP members but I agree Kyoto is not a good thing for Canadians. We never had a Kyoto plan anyway. Furthermore, I don't think Kyoto was realistic from an international point of view.

We would be much better off creating and enforcing our own environmental laws here in Canada, which is exactly what I think Harper is trying to do.

[Ricki Bobbi]

That's the mission Rona Ambrose has been given.

We'll have to see if she can pull it off. But I think Harper recognizes how important this issue is to winning his cherished majority so I think he will ensure it happens.

I should correct myself. I am as pro-environment as most NDP members but I agree Kyoto is not a good thing for Canadians. We never had a Kyoto plan anyway. Furthermore, I don't think Kyoto was realistic from an international point of view.

We would be much better off creating and enforcing our own environmental laws here in Canada, which is exactly what I think Harper is trying to do.

[tml12]

That's the mission Rona Ambrose has been given.

We'll have to see if she can pull it off. But I think Harper recognizes how important this issue is to winning his cherished majority so I think he will ensure it happens.

I should correct myself. I am as pro-environment as most NDP members but I agree Kyoto is not a good thing for Canadians. We never had a Kyoto plan anyway. Furthermore, I don't think Kyoto was realistic from an international point of view.

We would be much better off creating and enforcing our own environmental laws here in Canada, which is exactly what I think Harper is trying to do.

Minister Ambrose seems to be a flexible person. She is known for being more libertarian. Perhaps it is better this way as she will be willing to offer more flexible solutions that will be worked out here instead of bureacratic internationally-unflexible regulations.