The cost of American Isolationism

[paxamericana]

In a few word; nuclear proliferation. Not every country can defend themselves in a conventional war. That leaves only one card to play, nuclear. Things will become desperate in the East. Russia, China, Germany are going into that Good Night. Quietly? I don’t think history supports that. The first to go will be energy and then food access, culminating in starvation of about 1.5 Billion people. There will be several war because of this. It would be surprising if it doesn’t involve nukes. American intervention akin to World War 2 or Iraq is much more expensive than 2% of GDP.

Edited November 10, 2025 by paxamericana

[gatomontes99]

1 minute ago, paxamericana said:

In a few word; nuclear proliferation. Not every country can defend themselves in a conventional war. That leaves only one card to play, nuclear. Things will become desperate in the East. Russia, China, Germany are going into that Good Night. Quietly? I don’t think history supports that. The first to go will be energy and then food access, culminating in starvation of about 1.5 Billion people. There will be several war because of this. It would be surprising if it doesn’t involve nukes. American intervention akin to World War 2 or Iraq is much more expensive than 2% of GDP.

Good gawd man! The US isnt some God that can dictate everyone's behavior nor is Europe, or the rest of the world so inept that they can't respond. 

Plus, there is no American isolationism. We bombed the shit out of Iran when they went to far and we are negotiating and ending wars/conflicts/disagreements all over the place. The premise of your argument is bunk. 

[paxamericana]

6 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said:

God that can dictate everyone's behavior nor is Europe

The post world war 2 Brenttenwood system did exactly that. We patrol the global sea trade and allow you access into our market so long as America can write your security policy. This has been the primary reason why nuclear proliferation has been relatively tamed. But to your point, America is no longer in the position of playing World Police and has been steadily moving away from that role. To be clear, I’m not a proponent of globalism in its current form, but I do think it’s important to point out the cost of American Isolationism. 

11 minutes ago, gatomontes99 said:

Plus, there is no American isolationism. We bombed the shit out of Iran when they went to far and we are negotiating and ending wars/conflicts/disagreements all over the place. The premise of your argument is bunk. 

American Isolationism isn’t a black and white thing, it’s a slippery slope of dis-engagement since the Cold War ended. We no longer rely on the Middle East for oil, America is a net oil exporter. Neither do we care that much about the war in Ukraine. The State most likely to get nuclear weapons are the Baltic states and former Soviet countries. They’re watching closely as America slowly withdraw support out of Europe.

[SpankyMcFarland]

We are already seeing that when America retreats China advances. On climate change, green energy, even global trade for crying out loud, China is taking the lead and portraying itself as a force for stability and progress. 

[paxamericana]

1 hour ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

America retreats China advances

This is the furthest from reality. China is in terminal decline , this is the last Decade that china remains a coherent economic force. China's diplomat got laughed out of the room when they told the belt and road countries that their Foreign Direct investment were not bribes and instead loans. See the thing with paying for friends is that people stop being your friend when you stop paying. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

On 11/10/2025 at 1:08 PM, paxamericana said:

This is the furthest from reality. China is in terminal decline , this is the last Decade that china remains a coherent economic force. China's diplomat got laughed out of the room when they told the belt and road countries that their Foreign Direct investment were not bribes and instead loans. See the thing with paying for friends is that people stop being your friend when you stop paying. 

Unfortunately, I just don’t see the evidence to justify your assertion. In the rest of the world China was leaning on the door. Now Trump has opened it. 

[User]

On 11/10/2025 at 7:29 AM, SpankyMcFarland said:

We are already seeing that when America retreats China advances. On climate change, green energy, even global trade for crying out loud, China is taking the lead and portraying itself as a force for stability and progress. 

On climate change? This is why I laugh at all you leftists climate change pushers. You are not honest or serious when you sit here bragging about China. China is leading the world in Coal plant use, building new coal plants, and folks like you ignore that your own leftist governments are sending all their coal to China to burn while bragging about not doing it themselves.