CdnFox Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 8 hours ago, DUI_Offender said: according to many historians, yes. Not one historian. Only political pundits who claim that they have read something about history, but it immediately becomes apparent they haven't. Quote There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
impartialobserver Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 Legally.. if Trump was assassinated then Vance would assume the Presidency. I do not see this being the case. There is no evidence of a current or ongoing plot to kill him. In fact, its remarkably quiet. Quote
NAME REMOVED Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 7 minutes ago, CdnFox said: Not one historian. Only political pundits who claim that they have read something about history, but it immediately becomes apparent they haven't. https://hac.bard.edu/amor-mundi/the-danger-in-a-second-trump-presidency-2024-10-27 https://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/trump-threat-to-democracy-worse-2024-than-2016-2020-by-daron-acemoglu-2024-08 https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-is-a-threat-to-democracy-saying-so-is-not-incitement.html https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-historian-timothy-snyder-has-an-important-warning-on-trumps-threat-to/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/11/06/trump-victory-threatens-democracy/ Quote
CdnFox Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 39 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said: https://hac.bard.edu/amor-mundi/the-danger-in-a-second-trump-presidency-2024-10-27 https://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/trump-threat-to-democracy-worse-2024-than-2016-2020-by-daron-acemoglu-2024-08 https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-is-a-threat-to-democracy-saying-so-is-not-incitement.html https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-historian-timothy-snyder-has-an-important-warning-on-trumps-threat-to/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2024/11/06/trump-victory-threatens-democracy/ Pundit has podcast and speaks on politics and also bascially says he's NOT hitler and it's a wrong comparison. Pundit, writes articles, not a historian AND doesn't even mention hitler. You're just out and out lying now. Pundit, also doesn't' suggest he's hitler, you're just a loser now. Pundit, doesn't even suggest his hitler. Writer, no mention of hitler at all. So basically all you did was prove you're a liar who can't even use google. NOT. ONE. HISTORIAN. You're far too stupid to debate me most days, don't double down on the stupid if you can help it. Quote There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
NAME REMOVED Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 (edited) 55 minutes ago, CdnFox said: Pundit has podcast and speaks on politics and also bascially says he's NOT hitler and it's a wrong comparison. Never said Trump was as bad as Hitler. The question was: "Is trump Hitler and an existential threat to democracy?" I believe Trump is an existential threat to democracy. I misread the question, since Trump is obviously different than Hitler. However, he is definitely going to end US democracy as we know it. 55 minutes ago, CdnFox said: I am far too stupid to debate you most days, and I am a failure in life. Yikes. Edited November 21, 2024 by DUI_Offender Quote
CdnFox Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 Pay attention kiddo. Lets go through it. 59 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said: Never said Trump was as bad as Hitler. The question was: "Is trump Hitler and an existential threat to democracy?" IS trump HITLER...... AND a threat. Not "or a threat". You replied: Quote according to many historians, yes. And I said - Not one historian. You then provided quotes that did NOT tie him to hitler AND but even more telling - not ONE was a historian. Did you also misread your own reply Quote I believe Trump is an existential threat to democracy. I misread the question, since Trump is obviously different than Hitler. I'd buy that if you quoted at least one historian but you did not. ANd why would a historian comment on whether he's a threat - you DO need one to comment on whether he's Hitler or not. You didn't misread the question. You realized you were wrong, tried to baffle with a little bullsh^t And are now backpedaling. And you should know by now if I say a thing I'm probably right. Not always but that's almost always the way it goes. So next time before you say I'm wrong And post a whole bunch of links that have absolutely nothing to do with the point being discussed at least take the time to reread everything and make sure you're on the right side. Historians don't think he's a threat, DEMOCRATS think he's a threat and they only make that case by comparing him to hitler. Quote However, he is definitely going to end US democracy as we know it. there's virtually no evidence for that. In fact I would like to hear what you think the mechanism is for that assuming he wanted to. Go ahead, it's 2028 and trump has decided he doesn't want any more elections. How does he pull that off? How exactly does that work? He says I'm not leaving and everybody just says okay fine? Please, walk me through the process here. Give me a plausible and workable method for him to seize control and end democracy Quote There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
NAME REMOVED Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 (edited) 16 minutes ago, CdnFox said: Historians don't think he's a threat, DEMOCRATS think he's a threat and they only make that case by comparing him to hitler. Many historians think Trump is a threat to democracy. Some do not. While Trump is not Hitler, he is in the same league as Hitler. An autocratic dictator, who wants to destroy his enemies, and has no plans to uphold the democratic institutions that have made America great. 16 minutes ago, CdnFox said: there's virtually no evidence for that. There is tons of evidence. Just look at Trump's new cabinet, and read about Project 2025. 16 minutes ago, CdnFox said: In fact I would like to hear what you think the mechanism is for that assuming he wanted to. Go ahead, it's 2028 and trump has decided he doesn't want any more elections. How does he pull that off? How exactly does that work? He says I'm not leaving and everybody just says okay fine? Nobody will be able to stop Trump from doing what he wants, including either cancelling elections, delaying them, or rigging the elections so he will win. This is typical of autocratic leaders. Trump will listen to Putin on how to achieve these goals, as he idolises him, and wants to emulate his style. Edited November 21, 2024 by DUI_Offender Quote
CdnFox Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 2 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said: Many historians think Trump is a threat to democracy. Some do not. Well you didn't quote any. Given that a number of historians are democrats I would probably accept without evidence that many on the left think that trump is a threat to democracy and some of them are historians as well. History is not really entirely relevant. There has never been a situation quite like America. Even in germany you have to remember that democracy was very very new and largely untrusted during the time of Hitler. Germany was a constitutional monarchy till shortly after world war I and a lot of people thought that was a better system. There was a small amount of democracy in the legislature but that had no control over the government or the military. In contrast America is built on the idea of democracy and most Americans, even those on the left, believe the democracy is fundamental. I don't think anybody at all in the states would willingly give it up at this point 4 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said: There is tons of evidence. Just look at Trump's new cabinet, and read about Project 2025. Trump's new cabinet is definitely designed to be disruptive. I've even heard a couple of people refer to them as "The Disruptors!" LOL. But there's no evidence that they're going to be able to end democracy I think they're going to wreak havoc in some of the democrats built departments of the government. But they won't have the power to actually tear the government down or to eliminate democracy. Like the democrats before them they can stretch it a bit but at the end of 4 years there will be an election. Quote Nobody will be able to stop Trump from doing what he wants, including either cancelling elections, delaying them, or rigging the elections so he will win. This is typical of autocratic leaders. Trump will listen to Putin on how to achieve these goals, as he idolises him, and wants to emulate his style. Literally everybody will be able to stop trump from doing what he wants if he tries to step outside the law and end elections. As far as rigging elections go the democrats are already as far down that road as you care to see a government go. Even as we speak they are trying to illegally count votes that they have been told by a judge not to. It is demonstrable that they are a far more serious threat to democracy than trump if you want to go that route. They've also been the most resistant to reforms such as requiring voter ID. We'll see what laws trump comes up with. I suspect at some point he's going to bring in laws to make it harder to cheat in an election and that will be good. I know that it will upset the democrats because they kind of rely on cheating during elections. But in 4 years there will be an election and if the people don't like where trump went they can throw him out. In fact in 2 years there will be the midterms and they can completely kneecap trump if they don't like where he's going by then as well by taking the house and the senate away . Democracy is alive and mostly well in the US and will remain so. It does have some glaring problems but they are not caused by trump and they have been there for quite some time. Quote There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
NAME REMOVED Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: In contrast America is built on the idea of democracy and most Americans, even those on the left, believe the democracy is fundamental. I don't think anybody at all in the states would willingly give it up at this point A vote for Trump, essentially was a vote to eradicate American democracy, as we know it. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: Trump's new cabinet is definitely designed to be disruptive. I've even heard a couple of people refer to them as "The Disruptors!" LOL. But there's no evidence that they're going to be able to end democracy. We should bookmark this thread, and visit it again in the fall of 2026. That is when our democratic institutions will be failing, to the point that America will cease to be a democracy. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: I think they're going to wreak havoc in some of the democrats built departments of the government. But they won't have the power to actually tear the government down or to eliminate democracy. Like the democrats before them they can stretch it a bit but at the end of 4 years there will be an election. They certainly do have this power. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: Literally everybody will be able to stop trump from doing what he wants if he tries to step outside the law and end elections. Trump has already taken several steps outside the law. he is a convicted felon, who tried to overthrow democratic election results in January of 2021. He was not jailed or prevented from running again. It can be argued that the fact that Trump is not even in jail, should be a sign that the safeguards of democracy are broken. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: As far as rigging elections go the democrats are already as far down that road as you care to see a government go. Even as we speak they are trying to illegally count votes that they have been told by a judge not to. It is demonstrable that they are a far more serious threat to democracy than trump if you want to go that route. They've also been the most resistant to reforms such as requiring voter ID. Complete rubbish. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: We'll see what laws trump comes up with. I suspect at some point he's going to bring in laws to make it harder to cheat in an election and that will be good. I know that it will upset the democrats because they kind of rely on cheating during elections. I really doubt that, considering Trump has been the one to attempt to cheat at elections, or at the very least, prevent voters in predominantly Democratic areas from voting. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: But in 4 years there will be an election and if the people don't like where trump went they can throw him out. In fact in 2 years there will be the midterms and they can completely kneecap trump if they don't like where he's going by then as well by taking the house and the senate away Hopefully there will, but I am not holding my breath. 1 minute ago, CdnFox said: . Democracy is alive and mostly well in the US and will remain so. It does have some glaring problems but they are not caused by trump and they have been there for quite some time. Democracy is in great danger. Quote
CdnFox Posted November 21, 2024 Report Posted November 21, 2024 4 minutes ago, DUI_Offender said: A vote for Trump, essentially was a vote to eradicate American democracy, as we know it. There is absolutely no evidence of that in the slightest. That is just the worst kind of political fear mongering Quote We should bookmark this thread, and visit it again in the fall of 2026. That is when our democratic institutions will be failing, to the point that America will cease to be a democracy. I absolutely guarantee you I will remember. I'll put you down for end of democracy, 2026 Quote They certainly do have this power. How. Quote Trump has already taken several steps outside the law. he is a convicted felon, who tried to overthrow democratic election results in January of 2021. He tried to exercise illegal loophole. That was wrong and scummy of him but not necessarily outside the law. That is yet to be determined meanwhile the democrats are as we speak attempting to count balance they have been ordered not to indirect Defiance of the law. So I don't see trump as any more of a threat than the democrats Quote He was not jailed or prevented from running again. It can be argued that the fact that Trump is not even in jail, should be a sign that the safeguards of democracy are broken. You got it backwards. It was tried and charged for a crime that has never ever ever been applied anywhere in the united states in the past. The prosecution admits that they faked it up just to go after him. One of the lead prosecutors work directly for the democrat party before moving to the Prosecutor's office specifically to work on this case. And they tried to sentencing, but they couldn't get through the trial fast enough. Trump was able to cause a number of delays and they were forced to wait for sentencing till the election was already well underway. Technically he could still be sent to jail although now that he's one and that's unlikely. The entire process shows that the safeguards have failed Quote Complete rubbish. Complete truth. Pennsylvania Democrats openly admit to counting illegal ballots in McCormick-Casey race | Fox News Pa. Supreme Court orders counties not to count undated mail ballots as Senate recount set to begin • Pennsylvania Capital-Star Maybe they finally stopped by now (it's unclear) but they sure as hell didn't stop and they were told the first time Quote I really doubt that, considering Trump has been the one to attempt to cheat at elections, or at the very least, prevent voters in predominantly Democratic areas from voting. There is actually far more evidence of voter fraud on the democrats part. Quote Hopefully there will, but I am not holding my breath. Democracy is in great danger. It is not in danger. And that is so obvious to the average person that this is why the democrats lost the election. It's utter nonsense. Everybody knows it's completely ridiculous. You still can't tell me how he could do it you can't even lay out a hypothetical past that he might be able to take. And it makes the democrats and their supporters look mentally unhinged. And that's why people turned against them virtually across the board. I mean this election was a very strong complete rejection of the democrats, their candidate, their message and their methods. Time to take the hint. Unless you want 8 years of Vance to go on top of your 4 years of trump Quote There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
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