Is it really democracy what America is planting in my country, in Ukra

[Mikkie]

Is it really democracy what America is planting in my country, in Ukraine now? Honestly, I haven’t seen any sizeable gains in economy or social life due to American help. Actually Ukraine is lying in political chaos and economical ruins. Still we are welcomed into NATO a.s.a.p. They say we should meet some special NATO criteria. But even in my nightmare I couldn’t fancy what sort of criteria it is! Friendly freelancers have recently made it clear for me. They referred to some ‘secretive sources well informed’ of the recent tour to Ukraine of the CIA chef Goss. Now dig into it. He wants sophisticated surveillance equipment possessed by my country to tap communications of the opposition leaders and even of ordinary Ukrainians!

Thus Goss and Bush are helping their friend Yuschenko to subdue his major enemy - the inner opposition forces, voicing the vision of many Ukrainians reluctant to join NATO in particular!!

Secret Service of Ukraine has already fitted bugs in the offices of the major opposition Party of the Regions and its strongman Yanukovich!

Secret agents may fit every house in the Ukraine with their spying devices.

Mind we have no relevant laws and if this is put into reality it would be gross violation of human rights in this country! And America is ready to pay for it! Our govt just can’t manage such wiretapping, which is highly costly!

I’d love international human rights advocates and their organizations to keep an eye on what Americans are doing in Ukraine. I think it looks like totalitarian pattern rather than democracy.

[Leafless]

Mikkie

You wrote- " I think it looks like totalitarian pattern rather than democracy."

It seems you have an unstable government and it might take a while to sort things out.

http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20060217/43606366.html

[America1]

Is it really democracy what America is planting in my country, in Ukraine now? Honestly, I haven’t seen any sizeable gains in economy or social life due to American help. Actually Ukraine is lying in political chaos and economical ruins. Still we are welcomed into NATO a.s.a.p. They say we should meet some special NATO criteria. But even in my nightmare I couldn’t fancy what sort of criteria it is! Friendly freelancers have recently made it clear for me. They referred to some ‘secretive sources well informed’ of the recent tour to Ukraine of the CIA chef Goss. Now dig into it. He wants sophisticated surveillance equipment possessed by my country to tap communications of the opposition leaders and even of ordinary Ukrainians!

Thus Goss and Bush are helping their friend Yuschenko to subdue his major enemy - the inner opposition forces, voicing the vision of many Ukrainians reluctant to join NATO in particular!!

Secret Service of Ukraine has already fitted bugs in the offices of the major opposition Party of the Regions and its strongman Yanukovich!

Secret agents may fit every house in the Ukraine with their spying devices.

Mind we have no relevant laws and if this is put into reality it would be gross violation of human rights in this country! And America is ready to pay for it! Our govt just can’t manage such wiretapping, which is highly costly!

I’d love international human rights advocates and their organizations to keep an eye on what Americans are doing in Ukraine. I think it looks like totalitarian pattern rather than democracy.

Are you joking with this crap? Try taking some responsibility for yourself and your country. The US isn't able to "give" you democracy and then make life great. Nobody said living in an open, capitalist, democratic society is easy and that it will solve all of life’s problems. Unfortunately your mindset of "The US is the problem we aren’t better off" is probably why things aren't working in the first place. You should instead be saying "What can “I” do to bring prosperity and democracy to my country".

[crazymf]

I would think western influence would be welcomed in Ukraine compared to communal farming and commercialized agriculture as in Stalin days. Also, perhaps the quality of industry would improve and prevent another Chernobyl type scenario.

Seems like you're worried about KGB stuff. That isn't America.

[margrace]

I would think western influence would be welcomed in Ukraine compared to communal farming and commercialized agriculture as in Stalin days. Also, perhaps the quality of industry would improve and prevent another Chernobyl type scenario.

Seems like you're worried about KGB stuff. That isn't America.

You'er kidding aren't you??

[scribblet]

I would think western influence would be welcomed in Ukraine compared to communal farming and commercialized agriculture as in Stalin days. Also, perhaps the quality of industry would improve and prevent another Chernobyl type scenario.

Seems like you're worried about KGB stuff. That isn't America.

Your right, unfortunately some people seem to think America is always the bad guy because the hatred of Bush seems to colour their perception of anything else. When the U.S. suspends elections, the president declares himself - President for Life, the democrats and other parties quit campaigning I'll believe the U.S. has become totalitarian. Nothing the U.S. ever does is right in their eyes, I'd almost call it intolerance from the left.

Democacy takes a long time to take hold and people have to want it, maybe they really prefer the nanny state idea and don't want to take responsibility, who knows.

[GostHacked]

Is it really democracy what America is planting in my country, in Ukraine now? Honestly, I haven’t seen any sizeable gains in economy or social life due to American help. Actually Ukraine is lying in political chaos and economical ruins. Still we are welcomed into NATO a.s.a.p. They say we should meet some special NATO criteria. But even in my nightmare I couldn’t fancy what sort of criteria it is! Friendly freelancers have recently made it clear for me. They referred to some ‘secretive sources well informed’ of the recent tour to Ukraine of the CIA chef Goss. Now dig into it. He wants sophisticated surveillance equipment possessed by my country to tap communications of the opposition leaders and even of ordinary Ukrainians!

Thus Goss and Bush are helping their friend Yuschenko to subdue his major enemy - the inner opposition forces, voicing the vision of many Ukrainians reluctant to join NATO in particular!!

Secret Service of Ukraine has already fitted bugs in the offices of the major opposition Party of the Regions and its strongman Yanukovich!

Secret agents may fit every house in the Ukraine with their spying devices.

Mind we have no relevant laws and if this is put into reality it would be gross violation of human rights in this country! And America is ready to pay for it! Our govt just can’t manage such wiretapping, which is highly costly!

I’d love international human rights advocates and their organizations to keep an eye on what Americans are doing in Ukraine. I think it looks like totalitarian pattern rather than democracy.

Are you joking with this crap? Try taking some responsibility for yourself and your country. The US isn't able to "give" you democracy and then make life great. Nobody said living in an open, capitalist, democratic society is easy and that it will solve all of life’s problems. Unfortunately your mindset of "The US is the problem we aren’t better off" is probably why things aren't working in the first place. You should instead be saying "What can “I” do to bring prosperity and democracy to my country".

So bringing Democracy to Iraq was the wrong thing to do then?

[geoffrey]

Is it really democracy what America is planting in my country, in Ukraine now? Honestly, I haven’t seen any sizeable gains in economy or social life due to American help. Actually Ukraine is lying in political chaos and economical ruins. Still we are welcomed into NATO a.s.a.p. They say we should meet some special NATO criteria. But even in my nightmare I couldn’t fancy what sort of criteria it is! Friendly freelancers have recently made it clear for me. They referred to some ‘secretive sources well informed’ of the recent tour to Ukraine of the CIA chef Goss. Now dig into it. He wants sophisticated surveillance equipment possessed by my country to tap communications of the opposition leaders and even of ordinary Ukrainians!

Thus Goss and Bush are helping their friend Yuschenko to subdue his major enemy - the inner opposition forces, voicing the vision of many Ukrainians reluctant to join NATO in particular!!

Secret Service of Ukraine has already fitted bugs in the offices of the major opposition Party of the Regions and its strongman Yanukovich!

Secret agents may fit every house in the Ukraine with their spying devices.

Mind we have no relevant laws and if this is put into reality it would be gross violation of human rights in this country! And America is ready to pay for it! Our govt just can’t manage such wiretapping, which is highly costly!

I’d love international human rights advocates and their organizations to keep an eye on what Americans are doing in Ukraine. I think it looks like totalitarian pattern rather than democracy.

Are you joking with this crap? Try taking some responsibility for yourself and your country. The US isn't able to "give" you democracy and then make life great. Nobody said living in an open, capitalist, democratic society is easy and that it will solve all of life’s problems. Unfortunately your mindset of "The US is the problem we aren’t better off" is probably why things aren't working in the first place. You should instead be saying "What can “I” do to bring prosperity and democracy to my country".

So bringing Democracy to Iraq was the wrong thing to do then?

This thread is about the Ukraine, discuss Iraq in the million other threads on the topic.

Our support and interference in the Ukrainian elections (Canada's too!) was disgusting. Let the Ukrainians decide for themselves, I believe them capable.

[Wilber]

Is it really democracy what America is planting in my country, in Ukraine now? Honestly, I haven’t seen any sizeable gains in economy or social life due to American help. Actually Ukraine is lying in political chaos and economical ruins. Still we are welcomed into NATO a.s.a.p. They say we should meet some special NATO criteria. But even in my nightmare I couldn’t fancy what sort of criteria it is! Friendly freelancers have recently made it clear for me. They referred to some ‘secretive sources well informed’ of the recent tour to Ukraine of the CIA chef Goss. Now dig into it. He wants sophisticated surveillance equipment possessed by my country to tap communications of the opposition leaders and even of ordinary Ukrainians!

Thus Goss and Bush are helping their friend Yuschenko to subdue his major enemy - the inner opposition forces, voicing the vision of many Ukrainians reluctant to join NATO in particular!!

Secret Service of Ukraine has already fitted bugs in the offices of the major opposition Party of the Regions and its strongman Yanukovich!

Secret agents may fit every house in the Ukraine with their spying devices.

Mind we have no relevant laws and if this is put into reality it would be gross violation of human rights in this country! And America is ready to pay for it! Our govt just can’t manage such wiretapping, which is highly costly!

I’d love international human rights advocates and their organizations to keep an eye on what Americans are doing in Ukraine. I think it looks like totalitarian pattern rather than democracy.

Are you joking with this crap? Try taking some responsibility for yourself and your country. The US isn't able to "give" you democracy and then make life great. Nobody said living in an open, capitalist, democratic society is easy and that it will solve all of life’s problems. Unfortunately your mindset of "The US is the problem we aren’t better off" is probably why things aren't working in the first place. You should instead be saying "What can “I” do to bring prosperity and democracy to my country".

So bringing Democracy to Iraq was the wrong thing to do then?

This thread is about the Ukraine, discuss Iraq in the million other threads on the topic.

Our support and interference in the Ukrainian elections (Canada's too!) was disgusting. Let the Ukrainians decide for themselves, I believe them capable.

Wasn't it the Russian backed President who tried to rig the election and poison his opponent who is now the President and wasn't it American pressure that had a lot to do with stopping it?

[geoffrey]

This thread is about the Ukraine, discuss Iraq in the million other threads on the topic.

Our support and interference in the Ukrainian elections (Canada's too!) was disgusting. Let the Ukrainians decide for themselves, I believe them capable.

Wasn't it the Russian backed President who tried to rig the election and poison his opponent who is now the President and wasn't it American pressure that had a lot to do with stopping it?

Oh boy Wilber ol' buddy, you have half the story absolutely correct. Putin definitely influenced the election, using violence. So then we just influenced it in the other direction. This orange revolution wasn't as wide spread you might think, the election was still close even after the other man was painted a Russian sell-out.

And now afterwards, many Ukrainians are concerned about the democratic policies of their newly elected leader.

There is way way more to this story then you heard on CBC, Global or CTV. Reading European papers and some translations of Ukrainian publications have painted a completely different picture. Apparently, the Russians domestically argue that they were trying to curb American influence in the election by their actions.

We are all equally guilty in this mishap.

[Wilber]

This thread is about the Ukraine, discuss Iraq in the million other threads on the topic.

Our support and interference in the Ukrainian elections (Canada's too!) was disgusting. Let the Ukrainians decide for themselves, I believe them capable.

Wasn't it the Russian backed President who tried to rig the election and poison his opponent who is now the President and wasn't it American pressure that had a lot to do with stopping it?

Oh boy Wilber ol' buddy, you have half the story absolutely correct. Putin definitely influenced the election, using violence. So then we just influenced it in the other direction. This orange revolution wasn't as wide spread you might think, the election was still close even after the other man was painted a Russian sell-out.

And now afterwards, many Ukrainians are concerned about the democratic policies of their newly elected leader.

There is way way more to this story then you heard on CBC, Global or CTV. Reading European papers and some translations of Ukrainian publications have painted a completely different picture. Apparently, the Russians domestically argue that they were trying to curb American influence in the election by their actions.

We are all equally guilty in this mishap.

Ya just can't keep all those old Cold Warriors down.