Libertarian Party Likely to Merge with People's Party

[-1=e^ipi]

The libertarian party, which has been around since 1973 and is Canada's largest political party not represented in the house of commons, is considering a merger with Maxime Bernier's People's Party. The merger is likely to happen since the libertarian party's leader, Tim Moen, is completely supportive. Since Maxime Bernier lost the Conservative leadership race with 49% of the vote, Tim Moen has offered Bernier leadership of the libertarian party on multiple occasions and the libertarian party has adopted many of Bernier's policies in an effort to attract disaffected Bernier supporters.

 

The libertarian party ran in 72 ridings last election, gaining 1% of the vote in contested ridings and capturing 0.21% of the vote nationally. It has a lot of the on the ground organization that Maxime Bernier needs for the next election.

 

Thoughts? For me personally, this would make it much easier to decide who to vote for since before I was conflicted. Obviously, the implications of this for the next election are that Bernier's party will be very organized in the next election and is much more likely to have candidates in all ridings.

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bernier-libertarian-party-merger-1.4827241

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDi1upN3qI4

[turningrite]

There might well be a good fit in such a merger. I was pleasantly surprised to read when visiting its site that the Libertarian Party's policy platform on immigration is almost identical to Bernier's. We'll have to see where this goes.

[Michael Hardner]

 

 We'll have to see where this goes.

If it goes anywhere, it will lead to 4 terms of Trudeau.  

We need a new approach on politics to unite on values and move forward to improve our services and re-engage with people.  The Libertarian idea is no-go in Canada but I'll bet a hybrid with a-la-carte social insurance would work fine.

Does anybody in this damn country have any imagination or vision ?

[Machjo]

 

There might well be a good fit in such a merger. I was pleasantly surprised to read when visiting its site that the Libertarian Party's policy platform on immigration is almost identical to Bernier's. We'll have to see where this goes.

Bernier created the site, so yes, the party and Bernier's policies are identical at present.

[Machjo]

 

If it goes anywhere, it will lead to 4 terms of Trudeau.  

We need a new approach on politics to unite on values and move forward to improve our services and re-engage with people.  The Libertarian idea is no-go in Canada but I'll bet a hybrid with a-la-carte social insurance would work fine.

Does anybody in this damn country have any imagination or vision ?

I think we could learn from Hong Kong and Singapore, both of which are more open to immigration than Canada ironically yet still boast a higher per-capita GDP than Canada.

 

So how can they be more open-bordered and still end up wealthier than Canada per capita? I think Milton Friedman hit the nail on the head when he said that we can have a welfare state or immigration, but not both. Hong Kong and Singapore do have a social safety net, but it's a no-frills no gimmicks kind of bread and butter safety net. I think that combined with free trade has allowed them to integrate their immigrants much better. due to a simple safety net, they don't need to spend massive sums of money to keep people out. And due to unilateral free trade, they actually have jobs for their immigrants.

Canada has it all backwards. We spend massive sums on frills and gimmicks in our social system, so then we need to spend massive sums on border security to try to keep people out to compensate, and then we have the most protectionism of any developed country so the immigrants that we do accept can't find work.

What we need is less imagination and vision and more logic and technocracy setting policy like Hong Kong and Singapore have done.

 

There is no shame in learning from and copying the example of Asian jurisdictions.

[-1=e^ipi]

11 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

If it goes anywhere, it will lead to 4 terms of Trudeau. 

 

No it won't. 3 terms is more than enough time to win the battle of ideas. Having people in politics argue for positions like the abolition of supply management and moving towards a mixed health care system is a big game changer. The people who advocate for the abolition of supply management and a mixed health care system have the better ideas and the better arguments. But you can't win the battle of ideas if you don't have representation, and historically Canada has not had representation of these ideas. Look at how quickly public opinion has changed on issues such as gay marriage and the legalization of marijuana. Also, basically every other developed country has abolished supply management (if they had it at all) and has a mixed health care system, so I don't see why it can't happen here

 

We will win the battle of ideas and defeat those beholden to the cartels!

 

Also, as long as Canada chooses 300% dairy tariffs over free trade, the trade war will continue and the economic situation will get worse. Eventually, the population will get fed up.

[-1=e^ipi]

I love this motion!

 

[Michael Hardner]

3 hours ago, -1=e^ipi said:

We will win the battle of ideas and defeat those beholden to the cartels!

Wow.  That strikes me as glowingly naive.  Reform had a lot of ideas, like the Triple E Senate, and giving up the MP pension.  Those great ideas... where'd they go ?

Why they all died when Peter McKay broke a promise, and absorbed Reform into Conservative, leaving all the ideas behind... 

If Conservatives want to win, they need to build on the pragmatism, and level-headedness of their brand.  Don't try to Americanize Canada, we like our programs too much.  Instead of the Libertarian paradise, provide good management and give us more programs for less...

 

 

[-1=e^ipi]

12 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Wow.  That strikes me as glowingly naive.  Reform had a lot of ideas, like the Triple E Senate, and giving up the MP pension.  Those great ideas... where'd they go ?

 

I disagree with the premise that had great ideas to begin with.

 

12 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

If Conservatives want to win, they need to build on the pragmatism, and level-headedness of their brand.  Don't try to Americanize Canada, we like our programs too much.  Instead of the Libertarian paradise, provide good management and give us more programs for less...

 

Why would I want conservatives to win? They dislike gay marriage, marijuana legalization, freedom, and want to conserve bad policies like the dairy cartel.

 

With respect to 'Americanizing' Canada, this highlights a problem. Many policies in Canada are not justified based on what is the best policy, but on what fills people with the most nationalistic feelings. Most people have a natural tendency towards tribalism, and in modern society, this takes the form of nationalism. As Canada has no good reason for existing as a separate country from the US in the first place (the monarchy is immoral), people have to tie their nationalism to love of the state and state intervention in the economy in order to satisfy their nationalism and justify the existence of Canada. Unfortunately, this has many terrible consequences for society, such as causing people to support a worse healthcare system (i.e. a rank 30th healthcare system compared to a rank 1 mixed healthcare system in France according to WHO rankings), which causes people to die unnecessarily.

 

Canadian nationalism causes Canadians to die unnecessarily. What an awful thing.

[Michael Hardner]

2 hours ago, -1=e^ipi said:

1. Why would I want conservatives to win? They dislike gay marriage, marijuana legalization, freedom, and want to conserve bad policies like the dairy cartel.

 

2. With respect to 'Americanizing' Canada, this highlights a problem. Many policies in Canada are not justified based on what is the best policy, but on what fills people with the most nationalistic feelings.

3.people have to tie their nationalism to love of the state and state intervention in the economy in order to satisfy their nationalism and justify the existence of Canada. 

1. Maybe you don't.  My advice to you is to not respond to my advice to Conservatives.

2. Unfortunately for rationalists voters are human beings with beating hearts and warm blood.

3. Imagine there's no countries... Was Lennon a Libertarian?

Edited September 21, 2018 by Michael Hardner

[turningrite]

On 9/20/2018 at 11:04 AM, Machjo said:

Bernier created the site, so yes, the party and Bernier's policies are identical at present.

Huh? Bernier created the Libertarian Party's website before the his party merged with the LP? I believe Bernier's party doesn't formally exist at this point but perhaps the LP copied and pasted the platform outlined on his website, which I believed was set up for purpose of the CPC leadership race. There seems to be a 'chicken and egg' conundrum in play here, so I'm confused.

[Machjo]

16 minutes ago, turningrite said:

Huh? Bernier created the Libertarian Party's website before the his party merged with the LP? I believe Bernier's party doesn't formally exist at this point but perhaps the LP copied and pasted the platform outlined on his website, which I believed was set up for purpose of the CPC leadership race. There seems to be a 'chicken and egg' conundrum in play here, so I'm confused.

I was referring to the PPC site, not the LP site.

[turningrite]

Just now, Machjo said:

I was referring to the PPC site, not the LP site.

Okay. I was referring the LP site, where the description of that party's immigration platform seems remarkably similar to Bernier's platform as outlined during the CPC leadership contest. I haven't gone to the PPC website at this point but will do so soon. I was waiting for the party to be officially formed as I will likely contribute to it once it can issue tax receipts.