Trudeau 'revenue neutral' tax changes - not even close

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

Not sure that much is even true across the board....depends on the state and head-of-household tax filing status.

I'm sure there is a give and take, Canada's "better social programs" would be offset by a lower cost of living........do you pay $8 for a cauliflower?

Smallc · January 23, 2016

do you pay $8 for a cauliflower?

Adjusted for exchange? Probably pretty close at the moment, as it's problems in the US (drought) that have contributed to that. All non root vegetables are experiencing an increase around the globe.

That is of course, not to say that you'll always pay $8. A quick search through the flyer today proves that to be an atypical price at the counter.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

Nothing is true across the board. On average, lower to middle class people are better off in Canada.

Not for cost of living....that's why Trudeau wants to tweak taxes.

Smallc · January 23, 2016

And of course, if things were actually so much worse in Canada, we'd be experiencing an actual brain drain, rather than just the perception of one:

http://globalnews.ca/news/2309635/does-canada-face-a-high-tech-brain-drain-poll-says-yes-experts-not-so-sure/

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2015/11/22/the-great-gets.html

And even during the worst of the brain drain:

Emigrants to the United States are more than twice as likely to hold a university degree than are immigrants to Canada. However, because of the overall greater number of immigrants, there are four times as many university graduates entering Canada from the rest of the world as there are university degree holders of all levels leaving Canada for the United States.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/studies-etudes/81-003/feature-caracteristique/5001808-eng.htm

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

I'm sure there is a give and take, Canada's "better social programs" would be offset by a lower cost of living........do you pay $8 for a cauliflower?

No...cauliflower is much cheaper than that. Canada's social programs pay less in lower value CADs.

Smallc · January 23, 2016

Not for cost of living....that's why Trudeau wants to tweak taxes.

And if the cost of living were not balanced with a host of factors, you may have a point.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

Emigrants to the United States are more than twice as likely to hold a university degree than are immigrants to Canada. However, because of the overall greater number of immigrants, there are four times as many university graduates entering Canada from the rest of the world as there are university degree holders of all levels leaving Canada for the United States.

Good for Canada....stop the bleeding south by importing more immigrants and refugees. Some just consider Canada to be a stepping stone to the USA anyway. Maybe Trudeau's tax scheme can help fix that.

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

No...cauliflower is much cheaper than that. Canada's social programs pay less in lower value CADs.

I know, in Seattle, about ~$2.25 lbs, or about a 60% less.

Argus · January 23, 2016

However, because of the overall greater number of immigrants, there are four times as many university graduates entering Canada from the rest of the world as there are university degree holders of all levels leaving Canada for the United States.

How many of those university degree holders entering Canada wind up pushing brooms, wearing polyester security guard uniforms, or driving taxis because their degrees aren't and should not be recognized, and/or because of their poor communication skills?

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

And if the cost of living were not balanced with a host of factors, you may have a point.

The cost of living versus taxes is only balanced if you don't pay taxes in Canada, and even then, how many of Canada's poor can afford fresh produce?

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

Maybe Trudeau's tax scheme can help fix that.

I doubt it........a fresh, non-farmed salmon at Costco (here) the other day cost $60 CDN, or about $40 USD......that is insane.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

I doubt it........a fresh, non-farmed salmon at Costco (here) the other day cost $60 CDN, or about $40 USD......that is insane.

The funny part is that even with CAD/USD parity, that salmon would still cost more in Canada.

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

The funny part is that even with CAD/USD parity, that salmon would still cost more in Canada.

Or stewing beef.......$12 per kg (2.2 lbs) CDN........there is no argument between cost of living here versus the United States.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

The cost of living versus taxes is only balanced if you don't pay taxes in Canada, and even then, how many of Canada's poor can afford fresh produce?

Agreed...paying taxes in Canada just increases the disparity, particularly for regressive consumption taxes. No wonder many Canadians have bank accounts (e.g. CIBC) and credit cards in U.S. dollars. Add a U.S. mailing address or post office box, and it is obvious what some Canadians are trying to avoid.

Smallc · January 23, 2016

How many of those university degree holders entering Canada wind up pushing brooms, wearing polyester security guard uniforms, or driving taxis because their degrees aren't and should not be recognized, and/or because of their poor communication skills?

I don't know. I'm sure you have the answer.

Smallc · January 23, 2016

The cost of living versus taxes is only balanced if you don't pay taxes in Canada, and even then, how many of Canada's poor can afford fresh produce?

That really depends on where you live. Most Canadians aren't moving to Cheyenne.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

Or stewing beef.......$12 per kg (2.2 lbs) CDN........there is no argument between cost of living here versus the United States.

But you have a higher "Human Development Index"....isn't it worth it ?

Smallc · January 23, 2016

I doubt it........a fresh, non-farmed salmon at Costco (here) the other day cost $60 CDN, or about $40 USD......that is insane.

And that's a function of having a better paid lower class in Canada and a less favourable logistics realities. In Mexico, you can buy rib-eye for about $5 Canadian. Of course, you also have to live in Mexico.

Edited January 23, 2016 by Smallc

Smallc · January 23, 2016

But you have a higher "Human Development Index"....isn't it worth it ?

We have an identical HDI (as I said, the US is .002 higher as of last year). If you're poor though, or even the bottom half of the middle class, you've always been better off in Canada. It's also likely, at all but the highest income levels, that you've seen your income rise at a much faster rate.

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

That really depends on where you live. Most Canadians aren't moving to Cheyenne.

One doesn't need to, I own property outside of Seattle and live on Vancouver Island........there is a stark difference between the two.

Smallc · January 23, 2016

One doesn't need to, I own property outside of Seattle and live on Vancouver Island........there is a stark difference between the two.

And yet, people are moving to Vancouver at more than double the rate that they're moving to Seattle. Cost of living is not the only factor in the decisions people make.

Derek 2.0 · January 23, 2016

And that's a function of having a better paid lower class in Canada and a less favourable logistics realities. In Mexico, you can buy rib-eye for about $5 Canadian. Of course, you also have to live in Mexico.

Who's talking about moving to Mexico? Translation, in Canada, we get to pay more taxes and a greater cost of living, for the benefit of helping out those that pay little to no tax......interesting selling point.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

We have an identical HDI (as I said, the US is .002 higher as of last year). If you're poor though, or even the bottom half of the middle class, you've always been better off in Canada. It's also likely, at all but the highest income levels, that you've seen your income rise at a much faster rate.

Prove it....with dollars and cents...not SJW doubletalk. Include regressive taxes, lower value CAD, lower welfare payments, lower old age benefits, lower pharma benefits, higher fuel prices, higher housing costs, etc., etc.

Smallc · January 23, 2016

Who's talking about moving to Mexico? Translation, in Canada, we get to pay more taxes and a greater cost of living, for the benefit of helping out those that pay little to no tax......interesting selling point.

In Canada, we are more likely to pay the people working at Costco, Walmart, etc, a living wage. In Canada, we have higher transportation costs (especially if you live on an island) because of geography, but also because of higher fuel taxes. Of course, as a result, we now invest about 50% more (and rising) in infrastructure than the US. Those are major contributors to the cost of living, and are selling points, I'd say.

bush_cheney2004 · January 23, 2016

.... Of course, as a result, we now invest about 50% more (and rising) in infrastructure than the US. Those are major contributors to the cost of living, and are selling points, I'd say.

Will the new bridges be open when you need to use them ? Costco and Walmart are Canadian corps...right ?