American, Cuban Relations

[dre]

Yes, that must be true. That's why Cubans still risk their lives to float on rafts to get to American soil. It's why Cuban athletes still defect to play Major League Baseball. Seriously, do you swallow everything every repessive regime wants people to believe? Btw, got an eta of when the Red Cross will be allowed back into the country? Good lord.

So you just completely refuse to do a bit of basic research, and stick to your utterly bogus claim? You ignore the fact that since laws placing restrictions on travel were lifted countries like Mexico, the US, and Spain have reported a massive increase in cuban travellers? Ignore the fact that nearly 400 thousand cubans have entered countries around the world with Cuban passports without the need for the now abolished exit visa?

Whats next? Holocaust denial? Can you read at an elementary school level?

[Shady]

Sure, why not! Land of the free to be deported at gunpoint.

Police get involved in custody disputes all the time, even in Canada!

[Shady]

So you just completely refuse to do a bit of basic research, and stick to your utterly bogus claim? You ignore the fact that since laws placing restrictions on travel were lifted countries like Mexico, the US, and Spain have reported a massive increase in cuban travellers? Ignore the fact that nearly 400 thousand cubans have entered countries around the world with Cuban passports without the need for the now abolished exit visa?

Whats next? Holocaust denial? Can you read at an elementary school level?

Because much of what you're saying just isn't reality.

[Shady]

Cubans float to the US because the US will not just grant them the visa outright. But, if they arrive unannounced, Cubans (and no other nationality) are granted immediate residency. Once they have that, they then can go back and forth between the two countries at will.

Cubans join MLB for the same reasons other pro athletes from all over the world leave home to go to the major leagues -- that's where the big money is.

You mean the Red Cross that has a permanent Cuban office?

https://www.ifrc.org/en/what-we-do/where-we-work/americas/cuban-red-cross/

Or the international affiliates that they welcome when they need help after things like hurricanes?

http://www.redcross.ca/donate/your-donation-in-action/past-appeals/international/2008/hurricanes-2008/cuba-hurricanes-2008

How nice, Cuba says it will consider UN and Red Cross visits. Maybe they can finally use that office! Lol,!

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/05/03/us-cuba-rights-idUSBRE9420X120130503

[Shady]

The gap in access was only 25 years. Probably just a clerical oversight.

[dre]

Because much of what you're saying just isn't reality.

Actually every single thing I posted is true, its just that reality doesnt exist in whimsical, magical, shady land. The fact that you are still clinging to your idiotic "Cuba is a prison" statement is a perfect example of that.

[GostHacked]

Police get involved in custody disputes all the time, even in Canada!

But now Elian is back in the prison that is Cuba. Cuba is a prison right? According to you?

[Shady]

But now Elian is back in the prison that is Cuba. Cuba is a prison right? According to you?

Yes it is. It's one reason why people risk their lives to float to Florida.

[GostHacked]

Yes it is. It's one reason why people risk their lives to float to Florida.

But then you are ok with deporting people back to Cuba at gunpoint because of parental rights? What about Elian's rights?

[Shady]

But then you are ok with deporting people back to Cuba at gunpoint because of parental rights? What about Elian's rights?

I don't know about Ellians rights. Family lawyers fought for the family members in Florida. Ultimately the law sides with a living parent.

[GostHacked]

I don't know about Ellians rights. Family lawyers fought for the family members in Florida. Ultimately the law sides with a living parent.

What law? Cuban or American?

[dre]

Yes it is. It's one reason why people risk their lives to float to Florida.

I suppose you have evidence that government imposed travel restrictions are still a reason for people floating to florida? Yeah... good luck with that.

[Shady]

I suppose you have evidence that government imposed travel restrictions are still a reason for people floating to florida? Yeah... good luck with that.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2015/02/04/cubans-playing-in-caribbean-series-defect-dainer-moreira-vladimir-gutierrez/22836253/

[Shady]

What law? Cuban or American?

I believe it was American law, but international law may have played a role as well. If a Canadian child was being held in another country, that child would most likely be returned to Canada, especially if a biological parent was asking for its return.

[guyser]

Cuba is a prison, in which its government forbids it's citizens to leave.

You're actually arguing this? Ridiculous

[Shady]

You're actually arguing this? Ridiculous

It's weird that players still have to defect huh? Oh and then there's the 25 year access restriction of the UN and Red Cross. I don't get it though. Why do you types come out in full force to defend these kinds of regimes?

[GostHacked]

It's weird that players still have to defect huh? Oh and then there's the 25 year access restriction of the UN and Red Cross. I don't get it though. Why do you types come out in full force to defend these kinds of regimes?

Canada has had better relations to Cuba than the US. But then again some defend sending kids back to prison.

[Bryan]

It's weird that players still have to defect huh? Oh and then there's the 25 year access restriction of the UN and Red Cross. I don't get it though. Why do you types come out in full force to defend these kinds of regimes?

Yes, it is weird that the US still requires them to do that. Cuba is perfectly fine with them living in Cuba, and playing in MLB. It's what they would prefer, because then the Cuban government could collect taxes on salaries. The US strictly forbids this.

[Bryan]

How nice, Cuba says it will consider UN and Red Cross visits. Maybe they can finally use that office! Lol,!

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/05/03/us-cuba-rights-idUSBRE9420X120130503

It would be very interesting to know what part of that story Reuters is either taking out of context, or mistranslating, because the Red Cross themselves say they have over 4000 people working in Cuba right now. You'll note my links were not to someone else's story, but to the Red Cross' own sites.

[dre]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/2015/02/04/cubans-playing-in-caribbean-series-defect-dainer-moreira-vladimir-gutierrez/22836253/

So I guess thats a no? You dont have any evidence?

[guyser]

It's weird that players still have to defect huh?

Not really. Plenty of shady characters who coerce, hold ransom,sign as 'agents' to ballplayers with promise.

By defecting they avoid that.

Oh and then there's the 25 year access restriction of the UN and Red Cross. I don't get it though. Why do you types come out in full force to defend these kinds of regimes?

Who is defending?

Just telling it like it is, not posting up nonsensical garbage like you are.

You're actually arguing this? Ridiculous....times 2

[Bryan]

I have to wonder how much time Shady has spent in Cuba, and how many Cubans he personally knows.

I used to think the same things he does before I ever went. The place is a real eye opener, it's nothing like the stories you read in western media. It bears no resemblance whatsoever to what I was told. It's actually quite comical now to read even seemingly neutral stories in the NP or G&M about "changes in Cuba" and to just run down the list of things that the reporter gets spectacularly wrong.

[On Guard for Thee]

ICRC has been present in Cuba for numerous disaster relief projects. I think what Shady is confused about is the recent request to allow them and the UN to visit prisons regarding human rights concerns.

[Bryan]

We're actually getting some progress here:

http://news.yahoo.com/obama-removes-cuba-state-sponsor-terror-list-190658891--politics.html

Only two more to go.

[Je suis Omar]

The economic blockade against Cuba is a crime against humanity, defined by the Nuremberg Principles as "murder, extermination, enslavement, deportation, and other inhumane acts committed against any civilian population, before or during the war, or persecutions on political, racial or religious grounds . . ." For 48 years, the US government has punished the Cuban people because it dislikes their political system.

http://www.iadllaw.org/files/Marjorie%20Cohn%20The%20Cuban%20Fives%20campaign%20against%20terrorism.pdf