ONTARIO

[Bro]

At one time,one of the most well run and profitable provinces.

Then,4 years of ndp rule and 4 years of liberal rule,it took another 8 years of sound conservative rule to get us back to some sense of profability,despite the federal liberals healthcare cuts.

We are now in for 4 years of liberal rule,can we survive this awkward step back into unsound governing?

[The Terrible Sweal]

it took another 8 years of sound conservative rule to get us back to some sense of profability,

That statement is absolutely ridiculous given the multibillion dollar deficit left by the Harris/Eves spending machine. (To say nothing of the destruction of social wealth their regime entailed!)

[Bro]

That statement is absolutely ridiculous given the multibillion dollar deficit left by the Harris/Eves spending machine.

They were voted out because they were blamed for making too many tax cuts.How much did the federal liberals take away in transfers to health care costs?

And now,you have dilton recouping those losses by increasing

healthcare taxes.Do you ever wonder where the original cuts made by the federal liberals are being spent?It sure is hell is not on healthcare for Ontario.But,keep voting liberal,oh wise one.

[The Terrible Sweal]

Interesting change of subject, but not interesting enough. Cheers.

[Argus]

it took another 8 years of sound conservative rule to get us back to some sense of profability,

That statement is absolutely ridiculous given the multibillion dollar deficit left by the Harris/Eves spending machine. (To say nothing of the destruction of social wealth their regime entailed!)

To be more accurate, the Eves tories ran a deficit in the last year of the tories rein, primarly because of SARS, the Blackout, Mad Cow, and an exploding Canadian dollar. Oh, and election year spending on teachers and health workers in hopes of buying labour peace.

However, the deficit wasn't as bad as the Liberals are pretending, and would have most likely been gone within a year.

[daniel]

To be more accurate, the Eves tories ran a deficit in the last year of the tories rein, primarly because of SARS, the Blackout, Mad Cow, and an exploding Canadian dollar. Oh, and election year spending on teachers and health workers in hopes of buying labour peace.

However, the deficit wasn't as bad as the Liberals are pretending, and would have most likely been gone within a year.

Just goes to show you how little provision was left after the Tory dissemination of the infrastructure.

And the Common Sense Revolution was supposed to fix everything that was wrong with Ontario? Surprise, surprise things got worse. And I don't even have to talk about SARS, Mad Cow, Education, or the Blackout (it's always someone else's fault isn't it?)

[Big Blue Machine]

SARS and Madcow and the Blackout weren't the government's fault.

[Guest eureka]

Those items were not a cause (except in the slowdown that resulted) of the deficits. The government also did not "buy" peace with teachers and healthcare workers. You indicated that you might be in Grade 11 but that is not an excuse for such ignorance.

The deficit was entirely the result of the Harris/Eves policies. The tax cut obsession was the cause. Harris inherited an economy that was recovering from a recession and in which the austerity moves to bring spending under control had been made.

He took advantage of the new growth to reward his friends while devastating the health, education and social infrastructures of the province.

[daniel]

SARS and Madcow and the Blackout weren't the government's fault.

But Aylmer and Walkerton was. Just goes to show you how little provision was left after the Tory dissemination of the infrastructure.

[Big Blue Machine]

The same Tory government offered full compensation for HIV blood victims, no matter what the year.

[daniel]

The same Tory government offered full compensation for HIV blood victims, no matter what the year.

That was a no-brainer even for no-brainer Harris to score easy political points.

But you think Harris would have had the talent to save the jobs at Algoma and de Havilland or would he not have given a damn.

[Big Blue Machine]

Mike also fought for more provincal rights, and was a helper in the Calgary Health Accord.

[takeanumber]

8 years of sound conservative rule to get us back to some sense of profability

Walkerton.

Ipperwash.

Hydro Ontario.

407

SARS

Fudgit Budgit

Yes, stand in awe and be proud.

[Big Blue Machine]

Walkerton was an accident. SARS was an accident. The government helped get the economy back on track, with its tax cuts.

[takeanumber]

The contamination of the well was an accident.

The institutional supervision by the DoE that was hacked away by the Harris government allowed a simple case of contamination to result in the deaths of many people.

Institutions are there for a reason. When people who don't understand institutional capacity hack away without considering the consequences, people die.

Ditto SARS.

When you weaken institutions -- and exogenous factors occur that that instiution is supposed to respond to, then the cutter bears quite a bit of responsiblity for the outcome.

What is it with Conservative-Supporters and accountability?

Fess up what the policies you support cause.

[daniel]

....The government helped get the economy back on track....

The NDP government, that is.

[Big Blue Machine]

Right......... That government spent it's way into a huge deficit in the great recession of the early 90s. It's easier to stay out of a hole, than digging youselves out of one.

[takeanumber]

See, the Ontario conservatives got it all wrong.

First you get out of the hole, and then you cut taxes as a reward.

Cutting taxes and spending at the same time is just plain irresponsible.

And people died as a result.

Enjoy your tax cut. That money most certainly does smell.

[daniel]

That government spent it's way into a huge deficit in the great recession of the early 90s....

No surprise there, as we were all expecting them to do that when we elected them.

But - surprise, surprise - the Harris Tories left a big mess when they were supposed to fix everything.

By the way, that great recession of the early '90s was the result of Federal - wait for it - Tory policies.

[ticker]

The debt was 11 billion before PET raised it 10 fold the left always complains about Mulroney doubling it but conveniently ignores who started the mess.

Mulroney was faced with high interest rates and debt payment obligations growing at an exponential rate that were the after effects of Trudeau's spend thrift times.

[Big Blue Machine]

Daniel, if you weren't so self centred, you would have noticed that the whole world was in a big recession, not just Canada.

If the Tory government left Ontario it such a mess, the NDP did worse. The NDP fired alot of people from nuclear plants in Ontario Hydro, and put inexperienced people working at the nuclear plants. The NDP would in a law that banned companies to get replacement workers during a strike. The company can't do what ever it wants during a strike, the government shouldn't tell them what to do.

Plus, the NDP sent money it didn't have. They were already going into deficit in 89. But the deficit was small (about 2 billion I think) before Rae took over. SO maybe a deficit would have been unavoidable, but it doesn't have to be 11 BILLION dollars. And besides, people don't want their money forcefully taken away from them. With tax cuts the money gets recycled.

[daniel]

Daniel, if you weren't so self centred...

Careful with personal attack. You might get a note from Greg.

If the Tory government left Ontario it such a mess, the NDP did worse.

Like I said before, the NDP turned the Tory created recession into a booming economy which Harris took credit for.

That recession did what the FTA critics predicted: Canadian companies got bought out by US companies and then turned into warehouses.

[Big Blue Machine]

FTA didn't cause the recession, the whole world was going into recession. It wouldn't have mattered if we signed that deal or not. Canada would have gone into recession anyway.

[takeanumber]

When the Liberals are in power, and there's a global recession, it's the Liberal's fault.

When the Cons are in power, and there's a global recession, it's the global economies fault.

Typical double standards.

Anyway.

Harris cut taxes before he got the deficit under control.

That was stupid, and undisciplined.

[Big Blue Machine]

He cut taxes, to kick start the economy. Without the tax cuts, the economy wouldn't have done so well.

In 1994, the economy was growing at 5% before the high taxes, high interest rates and bg defeicit, slowed it to 2%.

In 1996, the economy was increasng at more than 5% per year.