Protests, police provocateurs, masks, etc

[jacee]

And how does he criminalize dissident? By telling rioters to remove show their face? If you are proud of your participation in a protest why hide it? And if you need to hide your face what does that say about the activities you are participating in or planning to participate in?

It says I have a cold and don't want to infect others.

Edited May 20, 2012 by jacee

[Signals.Cpl]

It says I have a cold and don't want to infect others.

Yeah and how many people can claim that excuse? Yeah and a police officer just happened to lose his badge that day.

[jacee]

Yeah and how many people can claim that excuse? Yeah and a police officer just happened to lose his badge that day.

Then he's a criminal. Does he want to be a criminal with a cold (cough cough)?

Edited May 20, 2012 by jacee

[Signals.Cpl]

Criminalizing dissent is on the road to totalitarian, and it seems to be Harper's only strategy, a definite lack of resourcefulness ... or will ... to really do the job of democratic leadership, imo.

It seems to me that your objection to this law is not due to fear that it will infringe on people's rights, or that it is a step towards a dystopian Canada. Your opposition to this law seems to stem from the fact that if this law is properly enforced then you would lose your reason to complain. If protestors don't wear disguises then rioters will be easy to spot and thus help police prevent them from carrying out their destructive agenda or prosecute them if they do carry out any violent acts. With a way to control rioters then the likelihood of violent confrontation between police and protestors gets much smaller. No confrontation between police and protestors, means that you have no reason to complain. One law could solve a lot of problems, punish those who go to protests with the intent of causing destruction or even prevent them, giving protestors a clear platform to present their issues without rioters hijacking the protest, and finally giving police a way to enforce the laws that they are duty bound to enforce.

[Rick]

It seems to me that your objection to this law is not due to fear that it will infringe on people's rights, or that it is a step towards a dystopian Canada. Your opposition to this law seems to stem from the fact that if this law is properly enforced then you would lose your reason to complain. If protestors don't wear disguises then rioters will be easy to spot and thus help police prevent them from carrying out their destructive agenda or prosecute them if they do carry out any violent acts. With a way to control rioters then the likelihood of violent confrontation between police and protestors gets much smaller. No confrontation between police and protestors, means that you have no reason to complain. One law could solve a lot of problems, punish those who go to protests with the intent of causing destruction or even prevent them, giving protestors a clear platform to present their issues without rioters hijacking the protest, and finally giving police a way to enforce the laws that they are duty bound to enforce.

Kind of ironic isn't it how you're advocating the enforcement of this law where people who might not want to be identified as protesters by say.....their employers or fellow workers...cannot have some veil of secrecy but you oppose open votes...

Seems rather hypocritical....

This law is just another step on the road to the fascist tyrannical governments we used to fight wars to defeat...

[Signals.Cpl]

Kind of ironic isn't it how you're advocating the enforcement of this law where people who might not want to be identified as protesters by say.....their employers or fellow workers...cannot have some veil of secrecy but you oppose open votes...

Seems rather hypocritical....

This law is just another step on the road to the fascist tyrannical governments we used to fight wars to defeat...

Please do tell me how am I hypocritical? I support ideas that make sense, non-secret ballots can only be supported by people who do not want democracy, who do not have the mental capacity to see that secret ballots will destroy the democracy you want. When your vote is open to the public especially in the age of the internet what follows is never good. You local MP is conservative, you make a complaint/request about something and he does nothing because you voted NDP, no big deal, its not like he will lose your vote. Why do you think so many dictatorships have 98% or 99% of voters casting their votes for the dictators even though they don't like him? Because there are armed men threatening them that if you vote the other way we will put a bullet in you.

Well I wanna go in to a bank with a mask on but you can see how that might be a little tricky. People who go to protests and put on masks are doing nothing but protecting violent anarchists from prosecution. You want the right to protest, but you don't want to give up on the rioters either and again it comes down to your irrational fear that it will leave you with nothing to complain about. When the police are given the means to enforce the law and protestors are peaceful then likelihood of anything realistic to complain about will diminish dramatically.

[Rick]

Why do you think so many dictatorships have 98% or 99% of voters casting their votes for the dictators even though they don't like him?

Rigged elections...you know, like the Harper Conservative's illegal Robo-calls...voter intimidation by members of the Conservative party in Guelph...

We've seen more police on the streets since Harper came to power and acting in a fascist manner than at any time in Canada's history.

Glad to see you're finally admitting that we're living under a dictatorship.

[Signals.Cpl]

Rigged elections...you know, like the Harper Conservative's illegal Robo-calls...voter intimidation by members of the Conservative party in Guelph...

We've seen more police on the streets since Harper came to power and acting in a fascist manner than at any time in Canada's history.

Glad to see you're finally admitting that we're living under a dictatorship.

You know what, talking to you is like talking to a wall. Actually a lot less fun and not as informative. Where oh where did I say we lived in a dictatorship? Did Harper get 98% or 99% of the vote? Because if thats your claim I can help you buddy, I am busy but I can tutor you in basic math.

[Tilter]

Actually the practice of kettling can be in contradiction of section 9 of the Canadian constitution.So therefore it may be in fact illegal!

But this is for the courts to decide.

WWWTT

WRONG:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/editorials/the-charter-guarantees-peaceful-assembly/article2437751/

[Rick]

You know what, talking to you is like talking to a wall.

You're not talking to me.. you can't see past your 'blue' wall....

Actually a lot less fun and not as informative.

Why...because I refuse to buy into your neo-con right wing propaganda?

Where oh where did I say we lived in a dictatorship?

Your description of one fits the bill of what this country has turned into.

Did Harper get 98% or 99% of the vote?

No, his minions fraudulently and through the use of illegal means, got enough of the vote that they needed.

Because if thats your claim I can help you buddy, I am busy but I can tutor you in basic math.

No thanks, we've all seen how poorly neo-cons are in basic math.

F-35's...Gazebos, Fake Lakes, true costs of Libyian mission....407 selloffs...

[Signals.Cpl]

You're not talking to me.. you can't see past your 'blue' wall....

The blue wall you speak of, thats called reality.

Why...because I refuse to buy into your neo-con right wing propaganda?

Well, seems to me that 5.8million people agree with the PM and gave him a majority. Thats about 1.3million more then the NDP received... I guess the loudmouths do not like that democracy works.

Your description of one fits the bill of what this country has turned into. No, his minions fraudulently and through the use of illegal means, got enough of the vote that they needed. No thanks, we've all seen how poorly neo-cons are in basic math.

F-35's...Gazebos, Fake Lakes, true costs of Libyian mission....407 selloffs...

Please be detailed on what I said that fits to Canada? Or is this one of those accusations that you make without basis? Im still waiting on your reasons as to why you called me a fascist.

[jacee]

WRONG:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/editorials/the-charter-guarantees-peaceful-assembly/article2437751/

From your link ...

There have been serious outbreaks of vandalism and violence, and student leaders have made no attempts to do anything about them.

Ridiculous!

What on earth do people expect "student leaders" to do about vandals?

Arrest them?

I think that's the job of police.

The statement has the mentality of 'bosses' who can give orders to their minions .

It comes from the mentality of autocrats who comprehend nothing about democratic leadership like that of the student unions.

Student leaders have no power to give orders!

That's utterly ridiculous.

And yet much of the expressed opposition to the student strike, and the law that heavily penalizes "leaders" hinge on this myth that the "leaders" somehow have the power to stop the vandalism.

The police with their masks, armour, weapons and shields can't seem to stop it, so the student leaders are supposed to?

GMAB!

Edited May 20, 2012 by jacee

[Rick]

The blue wall you speak of, thats called reality.

Yes, sadly that is the reality of fascism.

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/news/photos/2012/05/20/300-montreal-riot-police-cp.jpg

Well, seems to me that 5.8million people agree with the PM and gave him a majority. Thats about 1.3million more then the NDP received...

So you're pretty proud of that fraud... congrats on bragging how crime pays I guess...

I guess the loudmouths do not like that democracy works.

No, the "loudmouths" are standing up for democracy in this Harper run banana republic. Conservatives despise us.

Please be detailed on what I said that fits to Canada? Or is this one of those accusations that you make without basis? Im still waiting on your reasons as to why you called me a fascist.

If you can't figure it out, I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you. It's clearly obvious...quit being obtuse.

[capricorn]

Conservatives despise us.

I remember a time when I felt unloved. It really sucks doesn't it?

[Signals.Cpl]

Yes, sadly that is the reality of fascism.

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/news/photos/2012/05/20/300-montreal-riot-police-cp.jpg

So in your expert opinion, who do you think started that fire?

Your reasoning is that this is a fascist state because the thugs that go and protest use weapons that are intended to cause serious injury or death? Im sorry what are the police supposed to do? Wait for the animals to burn down the city?

So you're pretty proud of that fraud... congrats on bragging how crime pays I guess... No, the "loudmouths" are standing up for democracy in this Harper run banana republic. Conservatives despise us.

Fraud? How so? Are you suggesting that the Conservatives stole 1.3million votes? Any proof of that? Do you have evidence that 1.3million votes were stolen?

If you can't figure it out, I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you. It's clearly obvious...quit being obtuse.

You are officially my favourite, I am going to assume you don't think before you post, because you post things and then can't back them up. Its a good strategy if you were in kindergarden.

if you cannot back up your "arguments" and ridiculous claims maybe you shouldn't be making them don't you think?

Edited May 20, 2012 by Signals.Cpl

[jacee]

Rick, on 20 May 2012 - 12:55 PM, said: Conservatives despise us

I remember a time when I felt unloved. It really sucks doesn't it?

In this case it's an indication that we're doing something right!

Now if we could only figure out ways to get them to despise us and attack us even more ... Watching Cons foam at the mouth is such fun ...

Edited May 20, 2012 by jacee

[Signals.Cpl]

In this case it's an indication that we're doing something right!

Now if we could only figure out ways to get them to despise us and attack us even more ... Watching Cons foam at the mouth is such fun ...

So you don't disagree with the issues they present, you just want to antagonize the government? Wow makes me feel all warm inside knowing there are people like you who do not care about Canada, just about pissing off the government... Takes the last shred of legitimacy out of your posts...

[jacee]

So you don't disagree with the issues they present, you just want to antagonize the government? Wow makes me feel all warm inside knowing there are people like you who do not care about Canada, just about pissing off the government... Takes the last shred of legitimacy out of your posts...

Clarification:

I care about Canadians, but regardless of who's in power, CorporationCanada is organized crime.

[Signals.Cpl]

Clarification:

I care about Canadians, but regardless of who's in power, CorporationCanada is organized crime.

From your post it seems that you care about pissing people off regardless if its for a valid reason or not. That right there diminishes even further anything that comes from you because now it will be just a good old attempt to piss of the right, instead of being something constructive. I am on the right for a variety of issues but I am on the left for others, unlike you I stand behind my beliefs not to piss people off but because I believe they are the right choices. You seem to stand behind your arguments in order to piss people off with wild accusations just for the sake of pissing people off according to your post.

[Rick]

In this case it's an indication that we're doing something right!

Now if we could only figure out ways to get them to despise us and attack us even more ... Watching Cons foam at the mouth is such fun ...

That it is..

The sad part is, they can't see how far this country has fallen with their corrupt right wing fascist government.

Ah well, one day we'll get rid of those bloody conterrorists and this country can restore itself.

[jacee]

It's all part of the struggle Cpl. Sometimes ya just gotta laugh at the self-righteous goons ... speaking of which ...

Video shows Montreal police pepper spraying bar patrons

Surveillance footage ... shows several people sprayed by riot police at close range.

The footage shows customers scrambling to get inside the bar as a police officer knocks over tables and chairs.

This is becoming a real slapstick routine ...

In this and other contexts relating to criminalization of dissent in Canada, a thought has been bubbling at the back of my mind ...

Throwing a lot of dissidents in jail might seem like a solution to some people ... Harper and Charest and their supporters.

But to dissidents ... political prisoners ... perhaps it's just another opportunity to organize ...

Certainly, it's not an 'end' to anything.

In fact it's more like a beginning of real resistance.

Resistance to the G20 "austerity" agenda is at the heart of this and all protests.

[Rick]

It's all part of the struggle Cpl. Sometimes ya just gotta laugh at the self-righteous goons ... speaking of which ...

Video shows Montreal police pepper spraying bar patrons

Surveillance footage ... shows several people sprayed by riot police at close range.

The footage shows customers scrambling to get inside the bar as a police officer knocks over tables and chairs.

This is becoming a real slapstick routine ...

In this and other contexts relating to criminalization of dissent in Canada, a thought has been bubbling at the back of my mind ...

Throwing a lot of dissidents in jail might seem like a solution to some people ... Harper and Charest and their supporters.

But to dissidents ... political prisoners ... perhaps it's just another opportunity to organize ...

Certainly, it's not an 'end' to anything.

In fact it's more like a beginning of real resistance.

Resistance to the G20 "austerity" agenda is at the heart of this and all protests.

Yup, there's the fascist reality Signals.Cpl is so proud of..

Cops needlessly pepper spraying innocent civilians. Again.....

[jacee]

The sad part is, they can't see how far this country has fallen with their corrupt right wing fascist government.

And they never will.

Fortunately there's more of us.

[jacee]

Chicago NATO Summit protests ...

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5ik1DjYUgB3rxRhz4sCz6kNl4Ao6Q?docId=338850e2964745469e68a64b1f52e040

Police Supt. Garry McCarthy said officers would be ready with quick but targeted arrests of any demonstrators who turn violent.

"If anything else happens, the plan is to go in and get the people who create the violent acts, take them out of the crowd and arrest them," warned McCarthy. "We're not going to charge the crowd wholesale — that's the bottom line."

It appears the Chicago police are learning a lesson about leaving peaceful protesters alone.

Three activists who traveled to Chicago for the summit were accused Saturday of manufacturing Molotov cocktails in a plot to attack Obama's campaign headquarters, Emanuel's home and other targets.

Defense lawyers argued that the police had trumped up the charges to frighten away peaceful protesters. They told a judge it was undercover officers who brought the firebombs to an apartment in Chicago's South Side where the men were arrested.

Kris Hermes of the National Lawyers Guild said the charges seem to be part of a wider effort to scare people and diminish the size of the demonstrations.

But apparently they haven't yet learned this lesson.

And it doesn't appear to be working ...

She said she had been involved n antiwar marches before the war in Iraq in Chicago, but had never seen one this big.

And to be clear ...

"Basically NATO is used to keep the poor poor and the rich rich," said John Schraufnagel, who traveled from Minneapolis to Chicago for the march.

Since the end of the Cold War, he said, the alliance has become "the enforcement arm of the ruling 1 percent, of the capitalist 1 percent." Peace activists joined with war veterans and people more focused on the economy. Marchers assembled at Grant Park with signs denouncing NATO, including ones that read "War = Debt" and "NATO, Go Home."

[Signals.Cpl]

That it is..

The sad part is, they can't see how far this country has fallen with their corrupt right wing fascist government.

Ah well, one day we'll get rid of those bloody conterrorists and this country can restore itself.

You really like the word fascist, yet you can't even begin to understand the meaning...its kind of amusing watching you try to present an "argument", a little sad as well though.