Keystone pipeline delayed until 2013

[mikemac]

Keystone pipeline delayed until 2013

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/11/10/keyston-pipeline-route.html?cmp=rss

The Harper administration and the Alberta Premier are crying the blues.

And they are suggesting that Canada can sell the un-refined oil to China.

Are they braindead. Canada has it's own refineries. Why would they want to pipe it to Texas to have it refined there.

It seems to me that the Harper administration and the Alberta Premier are more concerned with temporary jobs in the US building the pipeline than they are concerned about permanent jobs for Canadians. If it was refined in Canada it would supply permanent Canadian jobs in the refinery as well as permanent Canadian jobs to truck it to Texas after it was refined.

Take the vote on the side of the web site above. It's already showing 54.21% in favour of Alberta processing the bitumen here in Canada.

[cybercoma]

Harper: The only person in the world that can't sell oil to Americans.

[mentalfloss]

Harper: The only person in the world that can't sell oil to Americans.

My keyboard..

[cybercoma]

huh?

[mentalfloss]

It was soaked.

[fellowtraveller]

That means less money leaves Alberta for the benefit of everybody else in Canada.

Oh well.

[Smallc]

That means less money leaves Alberta for the benefit of everybody else in Canada.

Oh well.

Ummm, no, that isn't how it works.

[olp1fan]

this is ridiculous

Its only delayed because Obama doesn't want to lose votes ...hence delayed until 2013

[E James]

I am sorry I think that given the fact that the pipeline would pass through an aquifer that supplies over one million people with water is reason enough to have another look. We have seen the possibilities in the devastation on the environment that can occur when errors are made in the oil industry. Setting up for failure by running the pipeline over a significant source of fresh water or-- in the case of the Canadian pipeline-- ending it at the ocean just does't make much sense to me.

[dre]

They should punch it right through the earths core to china Then it wont have to go across any farm land.

[YEGmann]

I am sorry I think that given the fact that the pipeline would pass through an aquifer that supplies over one million people with water is reason enough to have another look.

You heard about some aquifier? Have you heard how many existing pipelines are already crossing Ogallala Aquifier?

I heard about 2000 miles of them. Any thoughts?

[dre]

You heard about some aquifier? Have you heard how many existing pipelines are already crossing Ogallala Aquifier?

I heard about 2000 miles of them. Any thoughts?

Doesnt matter. Maybe theres a lot of people that didnt want them either?

[blueblood]

They should punch it right through the earths core to china Then it wont have to go across any farm land.

I don't think these are the pipelines that stick up above the ground. They will be buried fairly deep so no implements will be disturbed by then. Shouldn't need to be tilling that deep anyway. Essentially the producer is getting a free cheque from the oil company.

[fellowtraveller]

Ummm, no, that isn't how it works.

that isn't how the oil export business works?

I beg to differ.

Note that the federal govt gains taxes and royalties from oil production too.

Should feel the impact in a couple of years.

The pressure to get the all-Canadian Gateway pipeline to Kitimat built ASAP is going to get ramped up plenty.

[Smallc]

I'm saying that Alberta will benefit more than any other province. Of course, you already knew that.

[Guest Derek L]

that isn't how the oil export business works?

I beg to differ.

Note that the federal govt gains taxes and royalties from oil production too.

Should feel the impact in a couple of years.

The pressure to get the all-Canadian Gateway pipeline to Kitimat built ASAP is going to get ramped up plenty.

Not if the local First nations bands have anything to say about it………

[Argus]

Not if the local First nations bands have anything to say about it………

The lack of a means of moving oil out is costing the economy, according to BNN, between $15-$20 billion a year.

So first nations have NOTHING to say about it. If they want their slops they need to let us fill the trough.

[Guest Derek L]

The lack of a means of moving oil out is costing the economy, according to BNN, between $15-$20 billion a year.

So first nations have NOTHING to say about it. If they want their slops they need to let us fill the trough.

Hey, conveyance law keeps my lights on, but like the Nebraskan farmers, the Northern BC First nations communities, have the ultimate say…..if anything, they have 2-3 times the clout as the farmers, with Enbridge having to deal with land clams, Crown land, municipal, provincial and federal government……..Don’t get me wrong, the Northern Gateway would be a boom for northern BC communities that have felt the pinch with the recent contraction of the forestry industry, but if it’s going to be years of negotiations and court battles, it quickly becomes more viable to upgrade and expand existing pipelines………I can’t say it enough, Enbridge’s proposal for the Wrangler pipeline extension and Kinder Morgan’s TransMountain pipeline expansion are becoming the way forward……The negotiations process for work done on land already leased/owned by the oil companies is many magnitudes simpler than acquiring new land.

[Tilter]

Maybe this delay in the pipeline (yes "DELAY") will give Alberta business the spur to build a refinery in Alberta to keep the profit & jobs in Canada. It doesn't make a lot of sense to pipeline a huge volume of very hard to manage sludge when the line could be far more efficient sending out a close to finished product.

Has anyone else seen any program showing the abrasive effect the unrefined oil sands (key word SANDS) has on any material they use to handle it with. I can see why the people living along the pipeline would be apprehensive about the consequences of running it thru their back yards.

[fellowtraveller]

Maybe this delay in the pipeline (yes "DELAY") will give Alberta business the spur to build a refinery in Alberta to keep the profit & jobs in Canada.

Unlikely, since the companies that own the product at the wellhead also own unused refining capacity eleswhere, and the markets for the refined product are elsewhere too.

Kinder Morgan’s TransMountain pipeline expansion are becoming the way forward…

Yep, and it means that because the enviro crew are going to block and/or delay both the Keystone and Gateway routes there will be a big surge in the amount of oil moving through Burrard Inlet and the Lower Mainland. What will not happen is that oil companies with mega-billuions invested in the oil sands will not find a way to market.

I think we need another way to market that has nothing to do with the USA. Gateway or Trans-Canada, either will do.

[fellowtraveller]

Not if the local First nations bands have anything to say about it……

I suggest that First Nations have learned something from their participation in the MacKenzie Valley debacle.

After dicking around for a couple opf decades, when the approvals for the project came about a few years ago the people with the money- which surprisingly to some was not the govt or First Nations- said 'no thanks, we have moved on'.

It is quite likely something similar will happen in BC, and soon.

There are options using existing rights-of-way.

[fellowtraveller]

I'm saying that Alberta will benefit more than any other province. Of course, you already knew that.

?? I'm saying that when the oil does not move, Alberta suffers.

When Alberta suffers, you suffer.

Of course, you had not considered that.

Perhaps you should assume less money in equalization gravy round about 2015-2016.

[mentalfloss]

?? I'm saying that when the oil does not move, Alberta suffers.

When Alberta suffers, you suffer.

Of course, you had not considered that.

Perhaps you should assume less money in equalization gravy round about 2015-2016.

This is a natural repercussion of Canada's economy becoming dependent on resource extraction (petrol) and sacrificing the manufacturing sector in the process.

Edited November 15, 2011 by mentalfloss

[fellowtraveller]

This is a natural repercussion of Canada's economy becoming dependent on resource extraction (petrol) and sacrificing the manufacturing sector in the process.

That is a much broader subject than that at hand. I also challege the implcation that the manufacturing sector was somehow sacrificed as some sort of plan to bring resource extraction to the fore. Ontario lost its factories because they were not competitive with a few other sources.

The US decision Keystone decision will affect the fortunes of the whole country, not just Alberta.

That is not all bad, as the federal govt will now be obliged to review export priorities.

It is puzzling why Obama went this route, it will mean the loss of thousands of US jobs and ongoing dependence on suppliers like Venezuela, Saudi, Iran Iraq, Libya.

Oh well, let us move on then.

[mentalfloss]

That is a much broader subject than that at hand. I also challege the implcation that the manufacturing sector was somehow sacrificed as some sort of plan to bring resource extraction to the fore. Ontario lost its factories because they were not competitive with a few other sources.

That's what Albertans want to believe. The reality is dutch disease.