Occupy Toronto Protestors

[Shwa]

How about the Mohawk Warriors starting a huge bondfire in the middle of this park. Is that cool?

The city of Toronto is so litigious about requiring permits for everything but not requiring one for this.

I also like how no one cares about those 99%er businesses around the area, that are no doubt losing business because no one in their right mind would go to this park for a nice leisurely walk.

It's a sacred fire and thus exempt from the usual petty by-laws and such. Brush up on your Constitution son.

No one would go to Jane and Finch for a nice leisurely walk either. Maybe the City should get their priorities in order.

[Boges]

It's a sacred fire and thus exempt from the usual petty by-laws and such. Brush up on your Constitution son.

No one would go to Jane and Finch for a nice leisurely walk either. Maybe the City should get their priorities in order.

Sacred Fire.

I hear they also tried to get people not to film their fire.

So you support forcibly removing gang bangers in Jane and Finch?

Edited November 4, 2011 by Boges

[Rick]

Not only Yurts but there's a large support network behind the movement that will drive the right wing nuts.

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1081148--there-are-people-in-the-park-then-there-are-people-behind-them

[Boges]

Not only Yurts but there's a large support network behind the movement that will drive the right wing nuts.

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1081148--there-are-people-in-the-park-then-there-are-people-behind-them

So Rich one percenters are backing you?

[cybercoma]

Not only Yurts but there's a large support network behind the movement that will drive the right wing nuts.

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1081148--there-are-people-in-the-park-then-there-are-people-behind-them

I think this is the most important point that many people are missing.

“The park creates a space for a different type of political discourse that our society doesn’t cater to,” says Vasilios Cranis, the 32-year-old former manager of the Lula Lounge who persuaded the restaurant owners to open their kitchen to the Occupiers. “Even if nothing comes of it, that alone has value.”

[cybercoma]

If it's not conflict of interest than nothing is.

[charter.rights]

Sacred Fire.

I hear they also tried to get people not to film their fire.

So you support forcibly removing gang bangers in Jane and Finch?

I guess you think it is appropriate for Church goers not to complain if you brought cameras into church during communion?

However, that is beside the point.

Six Nations (which the Mohawk are a founding nation) still holds a plenum dominum Aboriginal title to Southern Ontario they have never surrendered. So not only can they have a sacred fire, smoke where ever they want (including banned restaurants)but they can hunt in the city and sell bags smokes if they wanted in High Park. These are all guaranteed Aboriginal rights under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and no by-law or provincial law can stop them. And while they may get arrested under criminal laws (if they were broken)chances are if they are practicing a tradition, they will be released.

That is the nature of Supreme Law in this country. We respect rights above all else.

[Boges]

I guess you think it is appropriate for Church goers not to complain if you brought cameras into church during communion?

However, that is beside the point.

Six Nations (which the Mohawk are a founding nation) still holds a plenum dominum Aboriginal title to Southern Ontario they have never surrendered. So not only can they have a sacred fire, smoke where ever they want (including banned restaurants)but they can hunt in the city and sell bags smokes if they wanted in High Park. These are all guaranteed Aboriginal rights under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and no by-law or provincial law can stop them. And while they may get arrested under criminal laws (if they were broken)chances are if they are practicing a tradition, they will be released.

That is the nature of Supreme Law in this country. We respect rights above all else.

That's all very silly.

A church is private property BTW.

[charter.rights]

That's all very silly.

A church is private property BTW.

So is a sacred fire and any land it is on, BTW.

[Boges]

So is a sacred fire and any land it is on, BTW.

So a "Mohwak Warrior" can walk into my kitchen, light a fire and a call it Sacred. They now own it?

Edited November 4, 2011 by Boges

[charter.rights]

So a "Mohwak Warrior" can walk into my kitchen, light a fire and a call it Sacred. They now own it?

They could but they won't because they respect boundaries. Unlike the Canadian government, us and it subsidiaries the Mohawks hold property rights under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. And a simple gesture like placing a tall stick across your door will keep traditionalists (like Mohawk warriors) out of your house.

However, your backyard may be fair game if it is convenient to them. In Ontario we are all just tenants of the land. The landlords are Six Nations.

Edited November 4, 2011 by charter.rights

[cybercoma]

So a "Mohwak Warrior" can walk into my kitchen, light a fire and a call it Sacred. They now own it?

Non sequitor... they are on public property, not in your private kitchen.

[charter.rights]

Non sequitor... they are on public property, not in your private kitchen.

And it really isn't "public property". It belongs to the Mohawks. It is their land.

[Boges]

However, your backyard may be fair game if it is convenient to them. In Ontario we are all just tenants of the land. The landlords are Six Nations.

I guess the poor people of Caledonia have seen that first hand.

[charter.rights]

I guess the poor people of Caledonia have seen that first hand.

Now you are getting it. Sure wish Caledonians and and Brant County residents would get it that easy. If they had there wouldn't have been any need to reclaim an illegally constructed subdivision.

[cybercoma]

And it really isn't "public property". It belongs to the Mohawks. It is their land.

Right, but the Mohawk's property is for all intents and purposes public property. Even private property is the Mohawk's property, but let's not go there for this conversation.

[cybercoma]

Actually, that too is not altogether accurate since the First Nations don't believe anyone can "own" property. It belongs to nature and it's for everyone to use. The problem with Native relations is that we colonized this country under the notion that land could belong to people.

[Guest Peeves]

It's a sacred fire and thus exempt from the usual petty by-laws and such. Brush up on your Constitution son.

No one would go to Jane and Finch for a nice leisurely walk either. Maybe the City should get their priorities in order.

Sacred fire! :lol: :lol: that's a flaming joke. I'd put it out with my sacred urine. Of course that might get me arrested if I survived.

That anyone can set up a bonfire and get away with it shows clearly (again) that there are degrees of law and classes of exceptions, and law enforcement with no testicular determination to treat us all (taxpayers), with equality. I think we should be able to sue for our rights too.

http://www.sacredfire.net/

[Shwa]

Sacred fire! that's a flaming joke. I'd put it out with my sacred urine. Of course that might get me arrested if I survived.

That anyone can set up a bonfire and get away with it shows clearly (again) that there are degrees of law and classes of exceptions, and law enforcement with no testicular determination to treat us all (taxpayers), with equality. I think we should be able to sue for our rights too.

Brush up on your Constitution and make the complaint to the Supreme Court. When you do, let us know so we can follow your story. Or better yet,

Go urinate on their sacred fire and see how they react. I bet you get punched out before the police arrive. But I am betting it will only take one punch. From a grandmother.

As for your Celtic roots, you are free to leave if you don't like it here.

[charter.rights]

Actually, that too is not altogether accurate since the First Nations don't believe anyone can "own" property. It belongs to nature and it's for everyone to use. The problem with Native relations is that we colonized this country under the notion that land could belong to people.

Don't be silly. The Mohawks knew very well about land ownership and boundaries. They sold (or brokered on behalf of other nations) half of the continent to the British. The ownership of land is entrenched in their 1000 year old constitution.

The Great Law of Peace:

"Wampum 44. The lineal descent of the people of the Five Nations shall run in the female line. Women shall be considered the progenitors of the Nation. They shall own the land and the soil. Men and women shall follow the status of the mother."

Six Nations retained Southern Ontario and never surrender it. They still hold a superior Aboriginal title to all lands contained therein.

[charter.rights]

Sacred fire! :lol: :lol: that's a flaming joke. I'd put it out with my sacred urine. Of course that might get me arrested if I survived.

That anyone can set up a bonfire and get away with it shows clearly (again) that there are degrees of law and classes of exceptions, and law enforcement with no testicular determination to treat us all (taxpayers), with equality. I think we should be able to sue for our rights too.

http://www.sacredfire.net/

I'm betting you might not have a penis left if you tried something like that. They take the protection of their sacred fire very seriously.

I remember at one Pow Wow a guy tried to put a piece of paper in and before he even had his arm outstretched two big guys had him by the arms and escorted him out of the sacred circle.

[jacee]

Not only Yurts but there's a large support network behind the movement that will drive the right wing nuts.

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1081148--there-are-people-in-the-park-then-there-are-people-behind-them

Thanks for this Rick.

The support in Toronto is awesome!

I just have to quote some ... but there's lots more in the article.

Stand by the food tent for a morning. Watch the woman in a grey, haut-couture skirt charge into the kitchen, rolling up her sleeves.

Watch Mike Myers pull up in his wife’s black SUV, loaded down with 250 compostable bags of water. He runs a waste-water technology company in Burlington. He might be part of the 1 per cent, he says. But he supports the protest– both philosophically and financially.

“There needs to be a correction of how global financial businesses work. Something is wrong,” he says. “Hopefully, this helps them buy more time to keep pressure up until something more concrete comes out of it.”

...

The unions are the biggest benefactors. A group of seven — lead by the Ontario Public Service Employees Union and the Canadian Labour Congress — paid for and installed the line of porta-potties, the humming generators, the three elegant Mongolian tents that went up last weekend, and more. Their biggest a gleaming 28-foot mobile kitchen equipped with gas stoves, deep fryers, a chrome fridge and gaping freezer (not that they’ll need that). It’s the permanent solution to the occupiers’ perennia cooking quandary, and it comes at a price of $8,500 a month, parking included.“

...

My point: Mayor Rob Ford has announced he is “working on a plan” for St. James Park. I suspect it does not entail delivering sleeping bags and solar panels. If he cues the police to empty the park, he will incite a real revolution in this city.

Five hundred bodies occupy the park.

Thousands are holding them there.

I think Toronto is setting a great standard for accommodating peaceful protesters.

And right in Rob Ford and Bill Blair's territory!

I think what we have here is a coup of sorts,

A fait accompli already ...

Occupy Toronto is fully installed for the winter.

Awesome!

I do wonder whether Harper's RCMP and CSIS are giving the orders again like at the G20,

With outstanding business like a 700+ people class action lawsuit for compensation of violated charter rights (damages and costs), criminal charges against police officers, public inquiry into the 'spontaneous' (by order/authorization of whom?) illegal removal of ID#'s by 100+ police officers ...

I'm thinking Rob Ford's "plan" will be to continue to avoid talking about it as much as possible.

[cybercoma]

anyone can set up a bonfire

You seem to have a very loose understanding of the situation or you're intentionally using a strawman.

[cybercoma]

Don't be silly. The Mohawks knew very well about land ownership and boundaries. They sold (or brokered on behalf of other nations) half of the continent to the British. The ownership of land is entrenched in their 1000 year old constitution.

The Great Law of Peace:

"Wampum 44. The lineal descent of the people of the Five Nations shall run in the female line. Women shall be considered the progenitors of the Nation. They shall own the land and the soil. Men and women shall follow the status of the mother."

Six Nations retained Southern Ontario and never surrender it. They still hold a superior Aboriginal title to all lands contained therein.

I stand corrected.

[Boges]

I don't see too many people jumping on Ford for saying the protests should end soon. Which might be positive.

Apparently the main reason is the site has to be cleared for winter preparation.

Also local businesses have reported a drastic drop in business. You know those 99%ers that are trying to make a living in this tough world.

I hear the protesters aren't going to riot like Rick wants but instead will just find another place to Squat ERRRRRR Occupy.