Oleg Bach Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 Don't you just want to slap the advocates of the death with dignity movement? There is absolutely no dignity in death..no matter how it occurs...those that say they want to remove the suffering contained in dying are dreamers who really have no understanding that there is no way to escape prolonged or shortened suffering. They believe if you jack someone up on morphine that they are "resting quietly" and "he died peacefully in his sleep". What a crock! When a person is given large dozes of morphine - they may appear to be passed out and unaware of everything - but they are not. I know from experience that after I injured my knee by getting a huge nail driven into it while gardening - that when I woke up after they cleaned out the wound...I was in horrific pain and already on morphine - so I asked for more...what took place after the injection was that I feel asleep - I could hear everything and was aware that I was on morphine - but I could not speak..what I did notice was the muscles in my diaphram were barely working - and I felt as if there was a huge weight on my chest --- I felt and I was to some degree suffocating. BUT as I lay there - aware that I was suffocating - I could not speak or cry out.....so - when you see old grandpa who is in the hospital dying and on morphine..and the doctors reassure you that "Gramps is resting comforably" Remeber that those attempting to grant you the wish of giving death with dignity are full of shit...Grandpa is aware as he sleeps and knows one thing - You may as well hold a damned pillow over his face. There is a poor little guy that I know - a fine person and he is rapidly dying of cancer - he paces about moaning and doing a death chant - He refuses to go to the hospital because he knows they will over doze him and he would be dead in two days...This fighter is maintaining his dignity - and every minute that he lives he is grateful for - eventually Jimmy the Greek will simply fall down and die - that is as close to dying with dignity as you can get! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 I never had any discomfort with morphine, just quiet dreamland, larger doses do affect breathing and I expect a lethal dose will knock you out and stop breathing altogether...I had two grandparents euthanized by request it was preferable to the agony they were going through... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted August 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 I never had any discomfort with morphine, just quiet dreamland, larger doses do affect breathing and I expect a lethal dose will knock you out and stop breathing altogether...I had two grandparents euthanized by request it was preferable to the agony they were going through... No - the agony YOU were going through having to watch. My dad held on to the bitter end - we set up a bed for him in the dinning room so he could view the whole house and the activity..When the pain was to much he requested that he go to the hospital for what would be the letah soffocating doze...it was his call - not ours - not the doctors - His call when.... I have put down a few dogs in my time - I never rushed them along out of convenience _ if the animal was fighting for a few more days of life - I would pump water through a straw to give it some more life. I had a husky who was run over by a skidoo..both hips were broken - I could not take it to a vet - I questioned a vet on what the dogs chances were for healing - he said 50 50 - so I nursed the dog ----------people would come in and insist I kill it - I refused because the dog was fighting for it's life.....NOW the old mutt is about to turn 16 - and he is in happy retirement.. No person has the right to kill in any form....the only dignity that there is - is in life...death is a dirty shit your pants process - and NEVER dignified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest American Woman Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 No - the agony YOU were going through having to watch. My dad held on to the bitter end - we set up a bed for him in the dinning room so he could view the whole house and the activity..When the pain was to much he requested that he go to the hospital for what would be the letah soffocating doze...it was his call - not ours - not the doctors - His call when.... You got that right. It was his call. Just as it was Wyly's grandparents' call. Yet your post makes it sound as if it should be your call - that no one should be euthanized. That no one should have that choice. Because you don't believe in it. I totally agree with the idea of "may you live as long as you want to, and want to as long as you live." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 No person has the right to kill in any form....the only dignity that there is - is in life...death is a dirty shit your pants process - and NEVER dignified. sorry I'm going out on my terms on my choosen time with my dignity intact, craping my pants after I die isn't going to bother me any... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted August 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 sorry I'm going out on my terms on my choosen time with my dignity intact, craping my pants after I die isn't going to bother me any... The crapping comes before death and sometimes after death - we should all go out on our terms - death to me is totally a private affair between me and my percieved maker _ If I could dig my own grave and fall into it the moment I expired - deep in the woods some where that would be nice - I really hate people who want to get involved with death - especially mine - go get your own death and leave mine alone - Now if only I could have someone on hand to do the shoveling after I fall in - covering yourself is the part that I have not worked out yet..lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyly Posted August 6, 2011 Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 The crapping comes before death and sometimes after death - we should all go out on our terms - death to me is totally a private affair between me and my percieved maker _ If I could dig my own grave and fall into it the moment I expired - deep in the woods some where that would be nice - I really hate people who want to get involved with death - especially mine - go get your own death and leave mine alone - Now if only I could have someone on hand to do the shoveling after I fall in - covering yourself is the part that I have not worked out yet..lol geez oleg I had similar thoughts only mine was dying on a warm hilltop in southern France after seeing one more sunrise...no one is advocating forcing anyone submit to euthanasia but letting those wish that option to do so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonam Posted August 6, 2011 Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 Why bother with death? Humans will likely attain functional immortality by the 2040s at the current pace of technological progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Weber Posted August 6, 2011 Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 Why bother with death? Humans will likely attain functional immortality by the 2040s at the current pace of technological progress. "Ground control to Major Tom... Your circuits dead...There's something wrong" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted August 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 Why bother with death? Humans will likely attain functional immortality by the 2040s at the current pace of technological progress. Just rich people - human growth hormone for instance that is squeezed out of the forhead of a corpse - keeps your muscle mass in tack as you age - but it cost a fortune...In time the poor will be used for body parts...as is the trend in India and China...Life extension will not be technological - it will consist of a type of cannibalism...to gain extra life you have to take it from other life - we might develope into a culture of rich vampires preying on the poor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted August 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 "Ground control to Major Tom... Your circuits dead...There's something wrong" Bowie was and is a great writer....getting back to dignity - It's a very Orwellian term in regards to using it as a discriptive for rot. Just don't like the dweebs who use the word...why not be realistic and say that we will kill those that are bothersome - who supposedly wish to die...and we won't have to be frightened during the action of watching a loved one suffer - The only persons that will gain dignity are those that are spared the weeping and the gnashing of teeth and the terror of being reminded they might be next --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CitizenX Posted August 6, 2011 Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 What about the Medical Uses of Heroin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oleg Bach Posted August 6, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 What about the Medical Uses of Heroin? Don't have a problem with that - it can be used as a healing substance . I have seen situations where they will not perscribe opiates to a 70 year old man in pain - because - they are worried about "addiction" - when you are at the end of your life - addiction is the last of your worries. Saw something in the last weak - behind the Catholic mission up the street is a facility - a small building with four floors - the frist three floors are apartments for pirates and other aging undesirables that the "bothers" have shown mercy for. It's kind of a santuary for aging evil people - Funny how the church takes care of the good as well as the bad... On the top floor there is a nice common area for people with health issues - it is almost a hospice but not quite..There is this little man - a Greek fellow - very kind - very bright and gentle - a good man....He has been stricken with cancer - He refuses to go to the hospital and refuses to take any medication for pain - He spends the whole day circling the building chanting - it is a groan - This poor fellow is fighting for his life and for every breath - I have never seen such a thing..such sheer will to stay alive....for someone like him - Herione might be useful... The problem with medical opiates - synthetic and natural is that they are controlled by doctors and nurses - Poor Jimmy the Greek reminds me of a walking cruxifiction victim...He wants total control over his own death or possible healing - but he is being denied that right - They offer to take him to the hospital - but he knows that it will be certain death at that hands of medical practitioners..that he will just be another number and a bag of bones that will come in the door and end up in the hospital morgue in a routine manner - I hope that this poor guy continues and has death or healing on his own terms - It is about freedom...about real dignity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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