Lax sentencing for criminals

[Scotty]

What struck me about the following story, was the apparent lack of concern on the part of the Ontario Crown, and the lax request for a sentence of no more than 3 1/2 - 4 years - for a man who, completely unprovoked, beat and kicked an innocent man to the point of permanent brain damage. Given our matching lax parole laws, this means this particular criminal, presuming the judge sides completely with the Crown and gives out 4 years, will most likely serve no more than 2 years in prison for destroying another man's life.

An undercurrent here is that the second man was an illegal drug user, though that was not related to the crime, who lived in a rooming house. If the criminal in question, Brandon Stewart, had instead beaten a 'respectable' middle-class professional, would the Crown be calling for somewhat more of a punishment?

Citizen

My own handy justice meter says ten to fifteen years would be more appropriate. This was not a first offense, nor even a first violent offense, and this person seems a danger to society.

Edited June 14, 2011 by Scotty

[guyser]

What struck me about the following story, was the apparent lack of concern on the part of the Ontario Crown,

Is that why the headline reads

Prosecutor seeks lengthy sentence for man convicted of aggravated assault

Seems there is a ton of conjecture in your post

and the lax request for a sentence of no more than 3 1/2 - 4 years - for a man who, completely unprovoked, beat and kicked an innocent man to the point of permanent brain damage. Given our matching lax parole laws, this means this particular criminal, presuming the judge sides completely with the Crown and gives out 4 years, will most likely serve no more than 2 years in prison for destroying another man's life.

[cybercoma]

Write the judge, crown, and your MP, tell them all you think sentencing needs to be harsher.

[RNG]

Write the judge, crown, and your MP, tell them all you think sentencing needs to be harsher.

By and large, as a nose holding CPC voter, the worst thing of the CPC schtick is their tough on crime stance. As I have said, I used to be a hang-em-high type and then facts sort of slapped me in the face. But when I see stories like this, I too wonder. There is a way great separation between violent crime and other crimes. For violent crimes, with some judicial discretion, I still think the death penalty is viable.

[Battletoads]

We've seen that the American 'lock em up and throw away the key' system has failed utterly. Why do you Scotty, and other Cons keep preaching on about how we ought to emulate their system here in Canada?

Seriously, outside of a few exceptional cases I'd say the justice system is working much better that some 1st world nations.

Edited June 15, 2011 by Battletoads

[Scotty]

Is that why the headline reads

And do you think 3 1/2 years constitutes a lengthy sentence for what he did?

[Scotty]

We've seen that the American 'lock em up and throw away the key' system has failed utterly.

I'm not sure what planet you saw that on, but in fact, US crime rates have fallen enormously.

However, the US is a very poor comparison. You can't look at what's done there and say that since it didn't work there it won't work here. Their socioeconomic situation is not comparable to ours.

[dre]

I'm not sure what planet you saw that on, but in fact, US crime rates have fallen enormously.

However, the US is a very poor comparison. You can't look at what's done there and say that since it didn't work there it won't work here. Their socioeconomic situation is not comparable to ours.

Yeah but you shouldnt use one anecdote to support the claim that we need to increase prison sentences.

You need to look at what our violent crime rates are, which way they are trending, and how they compare to other similar nations.

My feeling is that while theres going to be horror stories in any system, Canada is a pretty safe place to live, and the level of crime is acceptable. I dont want to pay any more money.

Lets say that the average person pays 15k per year in taxes... For every single person you put behind bars, 8 people have to work and pay taxes. The very last thing this country needs to do is increase the prison population chasing some utopian dream of a place where crime has been irradicated.

[charter.rights]

And do you think 3 1/2 years constitutes a lengthy sentence for what he did?

It is an appropriate sentence....according to the court.

You can't begin to re-try court cases either in the media or in some discussion forum and then expect to eke out your own punishment. You don't have the facts.

[Keepitsimple]

Perhaps we don't have all the answers but there's no doubt, a fix of some sort is required. Chances are that his original arrest and charges will end up in a "concurrent" sentence if they haven't already been combined with his current sentence. We need TRuth in Sentencing.

Stewart, who was out on bail at the time after an unrelated assault, returned to his room and was arrested by police a short time later.

[Molly]

And do you think 3 1/2 years constitutes a lengthy sentence for what he did?

I think it sounds like there's a lot more wrong with this guy than can be cured with more punishment. Prison is an expensive and ineffective delivery system for psychiatric care.

[mentalfloss]

OP is such hyperbole.

Edited June 15, 2011 by mentalfloss

[Keepitsimple]

I think it sounds like there's a lot more wrong with this guy than can be cured with more punishment. Prison is an expensive and ineffective delivery system for psychiatric care.

The Charter says that you cannot force someone to help themselves. That's why the Psychiactric wards were emptied out in the 70's and 80's and is a major factor in why such a substantial portion of the prison population should be receiving a secure form of mental treatment/rehab. Our prisons are no substitute for proper care.......but it has to be secure care to protect society.

[noahbody]

I think it sounds like there's a lot more wrong with this guy than can be cured with more punishment.

What's wrong is that he wasn't deterred from kicking an unconscious man in the face until his face collapsed.

Prison is an expensive and ineffective delivery system for psychiatric care.

There's no indication the man needs psychiatric care.

[guyser]

And do you think 3 1/2 years constitutes a lengthy sentence for what he did?

I was adressing your words as "lack of concern" and me showing you the Crown had no such inclination.

I would like a bit longer sentence, but I dont have all the facts of the case. So, I am ok with it.

[Sir Bandelot]

I'm all for getting much tougher on crimes such as what this person did. Three or four years is not enough, no way!

But to be clear, I am categorically against the CPC's omnibus crime bills that seek to criminalize and incarcerate people for soft offences, victimless crimes such as drug possession. I am against the strategy of a "war on drugs". Likewise goes for prostitution, it too should be decriminalized.

It's better to have these things in the open, where they can be somewhat better controlled, diseases checked and harm minimized, rather than in the hands of organized crime where they are now, reaping huge money. They are the ones who want to let the bad boys get away with murder, while incarcerating Joe Nobody for growing his own plants.

Sadly, it's those same forces who use their wealth and influence to affect government policy. And this is true for the CPC, who have ties to organized crime.

Edited June 15, 2011 by Sir Bandelot

[Keepitsimple]

I'm all for getting much tougher on crimes such as what this person did. Three or four years is not enough, no way!

But to be clear, I am categorically against the CPC's omnibus crime bills that seek to criminalize and incarcerate people for soft offences, victimless crimes such as drug possession. I am against the strategy of a "war on drugs". Likewise goes for prostitution, it too should be decriminalized.

It's better to have these things in the open, where they can be somewhat better controlled, diseases checked and harm minimized, rather than in the hands of organized crime where they are now, reaping huge money. They are the ones who want to let the bad boys get away with murder, while incarcerating Joe Nobody for growing his own plants.

Sadly, it's those same forces who use their wealth and influence to affect government policy. And this is true for the CPC, who have ties to organized crime.

Just for the record, other than the drug traficking law, which of the other omnibus crime bills are you categorically against?

[Remiel]

The problem is that crime prevention is a square peg and criminal punishment is a round hole.

[cybercoma]

there's no doubt, a fix of some sort is required.

There absolutely is a doubt. The criminal justice system works in such a way that sentences are as fair and consistent as possible, while judges have just enough discretion to make decisions as they pertain to particulars of any given case. It's not broken.

[RNG]

I'm not sure what planet you saw that on, but in fact, US crime rates have fallen enormously

Link please. A US forum I visit often gives way different data.

[Sir Bandelot]

Just for the record, other than the drug traficking law, which of the other omnibus crime bills are you categorically against?

They have tried to put them through in various forms, several times.

[cybercoma]

I'll tell you what I'm absolutely against: mandatory minimums. Taking judicial discretion away is probably the single most dangerous element of the omnibus crime bill.

[RNG]

I'll tell you what I'm absolutely against: mandatory minimums. Taking judicial discretion away is probably the single most dangerous element of the omnibus crime bill.

This.

But we still need more violent vs. non-violent distinction.

[Sir Bandelot]

I'll tell you what I'm absolutely against: mandatory minimums. Taking judicial discretion away is probably the single most dangerous element of the omnibus crime bill.

Yeah that's what I'm talking about.

But in regards to the OP, I'm not sure if this offence comes under the federal or provincial jurisdiction.

[cybercoma]

The problem is that crime prevention is a square peg and criminal punishment is a round hole.

This is great! I'm sorry I missed it the first time.