Topaz Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 The top government lawyer, says that anyone called before the committees has to appear except the MP's, Senator's or GG. So this means Soudas and other who refused to appear could be in comtempt, which could lead to fine or jail time. It also says that he PM is in the wrong if he is telling Soudas not to appear. http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Politics/20100615/tory-aides-100615/ Quote
ToadBrother Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 The top government lawyer, says that anyone called before the committees has to appear except the MP's, Senator's or GG. So this means Soudas and other who refused to appear could be in comtempt, which could lead to fine or jail time. It also says that he PM is in the wrong if he is telling Soudas not to appear. http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Politics/20100615/tory-aides-100615/ I'm sure Harper knew this. The Tories and the Opposition are locked in permanent battle mode now. Quote
dre Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 They shouldnt put up with this kind of thing from any party. Throw the fucking guy in jail until until he complies. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
margrace Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 They shouldnt put up with this kind of thing from any party. Throw the fucking guy in jail until until he complies. I agree dre, everytime Harper breaks Canadian law and get away with it it makes him closer to a dictator. Next thing he will be trying to shut down the news media. Quote
Jack Weber Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 They shouldnt put up with this kind of thing from any party. Throw the fucking guy in jail until until he complies. I tend to agree... Until some harsh consequences for actions are introduced,folks are going to continue to play fast and loose with the rules... Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
ToadBrother Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 I tend to agree... Until some harsh consequences for actions are introduced,folks are going to continue to play fast and loose with the rules... Since this is an issue of Parliamentary privilege, only Parliament can decide to the nature and extent of such punishments, filtered of course through the Speaker whose constitutional role in these matters is far-reaching. We know that the Tories will play their little game, and we also know that they are aware that they do not have the constitution on their side, but it's part of the push-and-pull of this Parliament, all parties to nervous to dare going to the polls, but trying to carve out pathetic victories where they can. They're like starving cannibals trying to throw each other in the pot. Quote
Topaz Posted June 16, 2010 Author Report Posted June 16, 2010 No, there's a power in Canada that overides everything.....the ballot box. If people are really angry with the Tories for the way, the conduct themselves in government, the way they spent OUR money, then make sure you vote. Quote
Molly Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 That's right. The only stick to keep them honest that ultimately exists is a vote of non-confidence. I'm deeply disappointed in the opposition parties- all three of them- that they have allowed this gaming, this nose-thumbing to continue this long. It has become tantamount to seconding the misbehaviour, and approving the shift in priority from parliament to PMO. A pox on all their houses for that. They should all be deeply ashamed. Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
Keepitsimple Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 That's right. The only stick to keep them honest that ultimately exists is a vote of non-confidence. I'm deeply disappointed in the opposition parties- all three of them- that they have allowed this gaming, this nose-thumbing to continue this long. It has become tantamount to seconding the misbehaviour, and approving the shift in priority from parliament to PMO. A pox on all their houses for that. They should all be deeply ashamed. And why do you think they are doing it? Quote Back to Basics
Topaz Posted June 16, 2010 Author Report Posted June 16, 2010 Iggy has said that the Canadians he had talk to said they didn't want an election but every time Harper wants an election, we go to an election and the polls have shown that people didn't want another election too. I would bet we have one this October. The money for the stimlus runs out in March, so Harper would want one before all the unemployment starts to happening again. Quote
fellowtraveller Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) and approving the shift in priority from parliament to PMO. This misconception keeps coming up here tme and again, and utterly ignores the reality of our system, which is demonstrated all the time. There has been no shift from Parliament to PMO under Harper, the exact opposite is true. During a majority govt, the PMO is in complete charge. They present the legislation, they whip their own party, they pass it when they choose. Period. There is nothing the Opposition can do other than a few trifling delays, or howl in the Commons a few hours per week, or whine to the media. But in practical terms- they can do nothing. And nothing is what they do. During minority govts, which we have had with Martin and now Harper, the govt is at least nominally obliged to maneuver so as to prevent non-confidence votes. This Harper has done for 4 years. The The PMO still puts out the legislation, but in a minority they have to drag along at least somebody from other parties, and this too has happened. The power of the PMO is greatly diminished in this situation, as it would be in a coalition. The notion that Harper or any minority leader has more unilateral avoidance or capability to run it his way than Chretien had is wrong. Edited June 16, 2010 by fellowtraveller Quote The government should do something.
ToadBrother Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 The notion that Harper or any minority leader has more unilateral avoidance or capability to run it his way than Chretien had is wrong. When you see a Prime Minister making an unconstitutional declaration that Ministerial staff can't be questioned by Committees, it makes something of a lie of your point. Yes the Opposition has a bigger stick right now, but should it have to come down to having enforcing 300 year old constitutional restraints on the Executive at every turn? Quote
eyeball Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) No, there's a power in Canada that overides everything.....the ballot box. If people are really angry with the Tories for the way, the conduct themselves in government, the way they spent OUR money, then make sure you vote. Why? Voting only seems to encourage them. It's like rubber-stamping the system they screw us with. Edited June 16, 2010 by eyeball Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Jack Weber Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) No, there's a power in Canada that overides everything.....the ballot box. If people are really angry with the Tories for the way, the conduct themselves in government, the way they spent OUR money, then make sure you vote. What's to stop the next party in power to do the same thing if a harsh precedent is not set to make sure this behaviour does'nt happen again? An election might change the faces but it won't change the culture... Edited June 16, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
Jack Weber Posted June 16, 2010 Report Posted June 16, 2010 (edited) That's right. The only stick to keep them honest that ultimately exists is a vote of non-confidence. I'm deeply disappointed in the opposition parties- all three of them- that they have allowed this gaming, this nose-thumbing to continue this long. It has become tantamount to seconding the misbehaviour, and approving the shift in priority from parliament to PMO. A pox on all their houses for that. They should all be deeply ashamed. I agree... It's a complete abdication of parliamentary responsibility.But this is borne out of the opposition(the Liberals,in particular) not being prepared to go all the way.This is why the current government feels,and acts,as if it can govern with impunity...Because it knows it basically can. Edited June 16, 2010 by Jack Weber Quote The beatings will continue until morale improves!!!
msdogfood Posted June 17, 2010 Report Posted June 17, 2010 The top government lawyer, says that anyone called before the committees has to appear except the MP's, Senator's or GG. So this means Soudas and other who refused to appear could be in comtempt, which could lead to fine or jail time. It also says that he PM is in the wrong if he is telling Soudas not to appear. http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Politics/20100615/tory-aides-100615/ we all know this The PMO knows this!!! Quote
ToadBrother Posted June 17, 2010 Report Posted June 17, 2010 Why? Voting only seems to encourage them. It's like rubber-stamping the system they screw us with. And of course, standing outside making rude noises is so much more effective. Quote
eyeball Posted June 17, 2010 Report Posted June 17, 2010 And of course, standing outside making rude noises is so much more effective. If you say so. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
Molly Posted June 17, 2010 Report Posted June 17, 2010 This misconception keeps coming up here tme and again, and utterly ignores the reality of our system, which is demonstrated all the time. Toadbrother already answered you very well... but I object to 'misconception'. In majority situations, the PM has the clear approved of the majority of the house, so such power as is granted is legitimately granted by the true authourity, which is the house. This PMO does not have the approval of the house... but through the cowardice of the opposition and the glacial pace of parliamentary discipline, still has its 'confidence'. Quote "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!" — L. Frank Baum "For Conservatives, ministerial responsibility seems to be a temporary and constantly shifting phenomenon," -- Goodale
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