Tories to turn off taps on political loans

[Argus]

So if he wants to simply stop loans, like the ones he still won't disclose; as a Canadian taxpayer, I want absolutely no money coming from wealthy Canadians to any party, except the minimum $ 1,000, with no tax receipt ot credit of any kind. Parties get the $ 1.95 per vote, that all voting taxpayers contribute, and that's it. Then we'd have a real democracy. All of us on equal footing. Politicians will have to get out and meet with the people.

Just like the Chinese guy in that other thread, you really don't have much of a concept of what democracy is all about. Real democracy would be no money for anyone. If they want to buy TV advertising or pay for road signs, they raise the money from their membership. This is pretty much what the Tories do. The Liberals and BQ, meanwhile, believe it's proper to force Canadians who don't support them to contribute money to them. There's just something about the Left, which believes everything they want has a moral imperative. That means anyone who opposes it is somehow immoral.

[Alta4ever]

Actually, if you read almost every stop in Harper's 'bubble campaign', it was at a $500 a plate luncheon or dinner. There were several in Quebec, many in Calgary. I read one where seniors protested and after promising to speak with them, he instead ran out the back door and into a speeding car. He never once went out to meet ordinary Canadians, so assumes we all eat like that.

At Val-Val-d'Or, Quebec

The MLPC hails the proud workers and people of Abitibi-Temiscamingue who vigorously demonstrated on September 29 against the presence of Prime Minister Stephen Harper in the region. For about an hour, nearly 500 workers, teachers, environmentalists, First Nations people, artists and others blocked the highway used to get in or out of the region. They then held a rally close to where Harper was speaking at a $500-a-plate dinner.

In Calgary

"Stephen Harper snuck into Calgary on September 26 to hold what amounted to a private meeting with Calgary’s elite. The details of his visit were kept a closely guarded secret until just before he spoke at the Calgary Winter Club, a private club on the edge of Nose Hill Park in Northwest Calgary. As in Edmonton the day before, Harper only spoke to an "invitation-only" meeting. He made a brief stop at his Calgary Southwest campaign office where he arrogantly refused to speak to seniors who were demanding an increase to the old age security pension and improvements to benefits."

Harper told the CBC the same day that the Conservative Party "remains the only party that shares any connection with Alberta." That was a pretty frank admission that for him "Albertans" means the wealthy elite who are selling out Canada for their private gain. Any Albertans who have not declared their loyalty to Harper are considered persona not grata. The reception which the workers and seniors received shows the power and privilege of the Conservatives and that the business-parties in the Parliament are a power wielded against the people.

So you ignor the ones in the Liberal party as well, its part of politics all parties have these fundraising dinners what do you not understand about that, another poster even posted some liberal examples of it , but for you ignorance is bliss right? Just keep worshiping at the feet of Ignatieff, you seem to be pretty good at licking his boots.

[Progressive Tory]

Most of the Tories' money has always come in small amounts from a great deal of people.

There's a name for that. It escape me now, but we saw it in Mike Moore's documentary with the Bush campaign. Corporations hand out large amounts of cash, turn it into smaller contributions with phoney names. If they keep it below a certain amount it's not investigated. There are many ways to accept cash and make it look like lots of small donations.

He also uses passport applications to make up mailing lists, that don't always sit well with people who have been targetted.

Just one example of this.

My sister has a passport, I don't. She has never voted Conservative, but NDP. She has never contributed to a political party, yet she gets regular fundraising letters from the Tories. I've never got any. She wonders how they got her name.

As to the Liberals they now accept donations as low as $ 5.00 They are reaching out to the grassroots that Harper has been running from. I think we're going to see a different approach to fundraising now.

[KeyStone]

Steven Fletcher, minister of state for democratic reform, intends to reintroduce a bill that would make it impossible for politicians to rely on hefty loans from wealthy individuals to finance their campaigns. Sounds like a plan !!

http://www.commandnews.com/fpweb/fp.dll/&a...6LNRVK1O3yaSdwN

Tories to turn off taps on political loans (Political-Loans-Refor)

The Canadian Press Mar 11 16:10

In principal, this makes sense.

Let's say that Leonard Asper lends Ignatieff 5 million dollars for his campaign.

If he gets elected, do we really think that Asper won't hold some influence over Ignatieff?

However, given the previous bill that the Conservatives tried to pass,. when they mistakenly thought they had a majority, we know that the Conservatives ambitions is not to eliminate influence peddling. Rather - their goal is to exploit the fact that they have a well-oiled fund raising machine capable of generating far more than the other parties. Therefore, by removing all other sources of funding, they can ensure a substantial advantage over the other parties.

Allowing only banks to make these loans, essentially means that only the wealthy will have the money to launch a campaign, since even putting the fundraising machine in place takes substantial capital. Banks will lend to the rich, but not the poor. Convenient for Conservatives, to be sure.

I have to agree with the previous posters who suggested that all the taps be turned off. The Conservatives are cherry picking the funding which benefits the other parties in greater proportion.

If you want to get rid of taxpayers subsidies to political parties, then get rid of all of it, not just the $1.95

If you want to get rid of influence-peddling, get rid of all of it, not just the loans to leadership candidates.

[Argus]

There's a name for that. It escape me now, but we saw it in Mike Moore's documentary with the Bush campaign. Corporations hand out large amounts of cash, turn it into smaller contributions with phoney names. If they keep it below a certain amount it's not investigated. There are many ways to accept cash and make it look like lots of small donations.

You're one of those people who believes in all kinds of conspiracies, aren't you.

[Alta4ever]

There's a name for that. It escape me now, but we saw it in Mike Moore's documentary with the Bush campaign. Corporations hand out large amounts of cash, turn it into smaller contributions with phoney names. If they keep it below a certain amount it's not investigated. There are many ways to accept cash and make it look like lots of small donations.

He also uses passport applications to make up mailing lists, that don't always sit well with people who have been targetted.

Just one example of this.

My sister has a passport, I don't. She has never voted Conservative, but NDP. She has never contributed to a political party, yet she gets regular fundraising letters from the Tories. I've never got any. She wonders how they got her name.

As to the Liberals they now accept donations as low as $ 5.00 They are reaching out to the grassroots that Harper has been running from. I think we're going to see a different approach to fundraising now.

What proof do you have of this in Canada?

[Progressive Tory]

Still hungry?

That's pretty reasonable. I guess they know there's a recession. I'd love to go.

[Progressive Tory]

Sounds like political interference to me.

And again, this helps our economy how? Shouldn't that be the government's focus?

[Topaz]

Well, first this bill has to pass and I'm not sure but don't the 3 opposition parties have more votes than the Tories? I think the Tories have around 145??

[Alta4ever]

And again, this helps our economy how? Shouldn't that be the government's focus?

So now that your beat you tring to change the subject?

[Progressive Tory]

This isn't likely to affect the Liberals who aren't having a leadership race. Think the Conservatives will see it affect their own future leadership race? Maybe the wave of the future is to simply appoint someone.

Was it just for leadership races or campaigns in general? Many politicians get loans. Conservative MP Brad Trost borrowed $ 25,000.00 from his dad, who I think is a business man or wealthy farmer (same thing).

There are too many loopholes to make this thing viable, besides the fact that it might be the stupidest legislation I've ever heard of.

I joked about it before, but maybe the Conservative caucus really is all on crack. Do they need an intervention? If they get any dumber, they'll have to change their name to Republicans.

[Progressive Tory]

If you want to get rid of taxpayers subsidies to political parties, then get rid of all of it, not just the $1.95

If you want to get rid of influence-peddling, get rid of all of it, not just the loans to leadership candidates.

Exactly.

[Progressive Tory]

Well, first this bill has to pass and I'm not sure but don't the 3 opposition parties have more votes than the Tories? I think the Tories have around 145??

The Tories have 143, but the Bloc don't have to fundraise, so may have to abstain. They are funded by the province of Quebec.

[CAMP]

Just like the Chinese guy in that other thread, you really don't have much of a concept of what democracy is all about. Real democracy would be no money for anyone. If they want to buy TV advertising or pay for road signs, they raise the money from their membership. This is pretty much what the Tories do. The Liberals and BQ, meanwhile, believe it's proper to force Canadians who don't support them to contribute money to them. There's just something about the Left, which believes everything they want has a moral imperative. That means anyone who opposes it is somehow immoral.

I think everyone in this thread needs to study the Elections Canada act for federal parties if they truly want to understand what amount of democracy you have and how the partie we now have have skewed our elections.

The main stream parties in Canada hijack your democratic system on a regular basis. The only true politicians are the ones that do what their riding desires. No towing the party line or having to listen to a small group of people (the elite bosses) that run the party. No matter Liberal or Conservative, NDP, Green or otherwise at the moment are different. They all reek of partisan politics. Canada will suffer year after year until the people finally get fed up enough to do something about it. When we had two main parties Canada did relatively well because democracy more or less prevailed in 4 year increments. Our system is no longer working in this nature because of the number of parties gathering up votes. Presently we are stuck with the first past the post voting system which causes a large sector of the population living with a government they did not elect, and in fact we may see a majority Conservative government or Liberal with as little as 30% of the popular vote.

Proportional representation addresses this issue at least.

I will say your true politician is an Independent who isn't off the wall and who could be conservative, liberal or otherwise.

At least they represent their riding instead of being a pawn of a party and democracy prevails with them.

[normanchateau]

Conrad Black also brought in truckloads of cash when the Reform Party was getting started. I think something like $ 120,000 alone from Hollinger within a year or two. He gave Peter McKay the 500,000 as purchase price for the PCs and so he wouldn't run against Stephen Harper for leadership of the new Party.

I wonder how much of that money was Conrad Black's versus money stolen from Hollinger shareholders. Given his MO, I suspect little of it was Black's. Depending on the statute of limitations, Hollinger shareholders might want to see if Peter MacKay would repay them.

I imagine Joe Biden would not be touting MacKay to NATO if he knew that MacKay received a small fortune from conservative jailbird Conrad Black.

[Progressive Tory]

I imagine Joe Biden would not be touting MacKay to NATO if he knew that MacKay received a small fortune from conservative jailbird Conrad Black.

I think Biden may want someone other than a European this time, though he hasn't confirmed that he even favoured McKay.

I think that was just a rumour.

But anything that'll get that boob out of the country, is fine with me. That whole Russian plane fiasco was so embarassing.

[M.Dancer]

I wonder how much of that money was Conrad Black's versus money stolen from Hollinger shareholders. Given his MO, I suspect little of it was Black's. Depending on the statute of limitations, Hollinger shareholders might want to see if Peter MacKay would repay them.

Do you have a cite for any of these claims?

[Progressive Tory]

You want lower, see a Mazda dealer....but they will only give you 60 months...

Shouldn't we pass legislation stopping the banks from loaning money to buy Ladas? Why should we buy Russian cars when they sort of kinda' came within a few miles of our airspace and only informed NORAD and the Canadian Government well in advance of this one of 20 routine exercises? I want a billboard next time. One we can read because clearly Peter Mckay did not get that far in reading comprehension. Hell, he didn't get that far in history, or he'd know the cold war was over and we want Russia to be our new BFF.

So that's it. New bill. No loans for Russian cars. Another bill. Peter Mckay is no longer allowed to speak for Canadians.

[Alta4ever]

Shouldn't we pass legislation stopping the banks from loaning money to buy Ladas? Why should we buy Russian cars when they sort of kinda' came within a few miles of our airspace and only informed NORAD and the Canadian Government well in advance of this one of 20 routine exercises? I want a billboard next time. One we can read because clearly Peter Mckay did not get that far in reading comprehension. Hell, he didn't get that far in history, or he'd know the cold war was over and we want Russia to be our new BFF.

So that's it. New bill. No loans for Russian cars. Another bill. Peter Mckay is no longer allowed to speak for Canadians.

How many times do you have to be told that a Russian flight plan was not filed with Norad, are you stupid, ignorant, willfully ignorant, or just unable to understand how or what a Rusian test of Airspace is?

[M.Dancer]

Shouldn't we pass legislation stopping the banks from loaning money to buy Ladas? Why should we buy Russian cars when they sort of kinda' came within a few miles of our airspace and only informed NORAD and the Canadian Government well in advance of this one of 20 routine exercises? I want a billboard next time. One we can read because clearly Peter Mckay did not get that far in reading comprehension. Hell, he didn't get that far in history, or he'd know the cold war was over and we want Russia to be our new BFF.

So that's it. New bill. No loans for Russian cars. Another bill. Peter Mckay is no longer allowed to speak for Canadians.

I fail to see how your screed is in any way relevant to private individuals loaning money to politicians or to political parties. I can only assume that your post was out of frustration after finding so many Liberal fund raising dinners..which of course was alos irrelevant to the topic....

Attend one soon so that the hypoglycemic ramblings stay in cheque..