Online voting increases voter turnout minimum 30%

[benny]

suspicious?

I have found it; it is Intelivote with only one l:

http://www.intelivote.com/

[CAMP]

And here is their pdf information about security on the second page.

http://demo.intelivote.com/brochure/Intelivote.pdf

[Martin Chriton]

Electronic voting is too easily rigged and manipulated.

(This is coming from someone in the technology field. Graduated from Waterloo's computer engineering program and now working in Silicon Valley).

BTW - CAMP how much are these guys paying you?

[CAMP]

Electronic voting is too easily rigged and manipulated.

(This is coming from someone in the technology field. Graduated from Waterloo's computer engineering program and now working in Silicon Valley).

BTW - CAMP how much are these guys paying you?

Electronic voting is very secure. ( I also program computers for a living ) And I work in Canada.

I don't get paid anything from intelivote. I simply found them on the internet way back when I was looking into electronic voting. I'm a keep it in Canada type person so I phoned them and had a long dialogue with them as to security and how the system would work.

I also don't get paid by the Central Party of Canada, it is simply a collection of hard working Canadians who have had enough of the present political system and want a real alternative party to vote for that will stand up for them.

[punked]

Electronic voting is very secure. ( I also program computers for a living ) And I work in Canada.

I don't get paid anything from intelivote. I simply found them on the internet way back when I was looking into electronic voting. I'm a keep it in Canada type person so I phoned them and had a long dialogue with them as to security and how the system would work.

I also don't get paid by the Central Party of Canada, it is simply a collection of hard working Canadians who have had enough of the present political system and want a real alternative party to vote for that will stand up for them.

You have not addressed the fact in one of the few places it has been tried in Halifax it did not help the participation go up at all. In fact 25% less of the population participated and their were MORE spoiled ballots.

[benny]

And here is their pdf information about security on the second page.

http://demo.intelivote.com/brochure/Intelivote.pdf

It also provides an anonymous voting environment; only the voter knows how they voted – maintaining the secrecy of ballot, one of the most important security elements in voting.

How can the voter be prevented to show his pick to a vote buyer?

[CAMP]

How can the voter be prevented to show his pick to a vote buyer?

If you go to the intelivote website it says on the security pdf that it does maintain anonymity

[CAMP]

You have not addressed the fact in one of the few places it has been tried in Halifax it did not help the participation go up at all. In fact 25% less of the population participated and their were MORE spoiled ballots.

I am looking into this article. I was told by Intelivote that it increased the overall municipal elections outcome by 30% so now I must find out the truth and I will. I have sent an email to intellivote with the link you have posted to see what they say. Let you know when I get something back

[punked]

I am looking into this article. I was told by Intelivote that it increased the overall municipal elections outcome by 30% so now I must find out the truth and I will. I have sent an email to intellivote with the link you have posted to see what they say. Let you know when I get something back

Nope see this is why you can't trust these guys the voter turn out was down.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/nova-scotia/story...er-turnout.html

[benny]

If you go to the intelivote website it says on the security pdf that it does maintain anonymity

My quote comes from there.

[Martin Chriton]

Electronic voting is very secure. ( I also program computers for a living ) And I work in Canada.

You're obviously not a good developer.

I don't get paid anything from intelivote.

I don't believe you.

and had a long dialogue with them as to security and how the system would work.

Here's how it works. Anything without a paper-trail can be manipulated; regardless of what anyone says that's trying to market these type of products.

The secure e-voting model is you'd walk into a voting station and select whomever you wish to vote for and a ballot would be printed off. You'd verify the name on it is correct and hand it in like normal. This model is secure and the initial count is instantaneous and we're able to do recounts when results are suspect (as we have the paper ballots).

No there wouldn't be voting at home.

A paper trail is a requirement for (1) anyone informed on the issues and/or (2) technology savvy.

Edited June 30, 2009 by Martin Chriton

[CAMP]

You're obviously not a good developer.

I don't believe you.

Here's how it works. Anything without a paper-trail can be manipulated; regardless of what anyone says that's trying to marketing these type of products.

The secure e-voting model is you'd walk into a voting station and select whomever you wish to vote for and a ballot would be printed off. You'd verify the name on it is correct and hand it in like normal. This model is secure and the initial count is instantaneous and we're able to do recounts when results are suspect (as we have the paper ballots).

No there wouldn't be voting at home.

A paper trail is a requirement for (1) anyone informed on the issues and/or (2) technology savvy.

You can choose to believe what you want but truth is truth.

The idea of evoting would be so you don't have to walk into a polling station, and could do it from home or telephone or cell phone.

People who are out of country (our soldiers, students, retired people ... for that matter you) would be able to vote as long as they are registered to vote in the usual manner and have their electronic ID pin that they would get ahead of time.

[Martin Chriton]

You can choose to believe what you want but truth is truth.

The idea of evoting would be so you don't have to walk into a polling station, and could do it from home or telephone or cell phone.

People who are out of country (our soldiers, students, retired people ... for that matter you) would be able to vote as long as they are registered to vote in the usual manner and have their electronic ID pin that they would get ahead of time.

Nice argument. I could trivially manipulate the outcome of an election under the model you propose. You need a paper trail. Period.

[CAMP]

Nice argument. I could trivially manipulate the outcome of an election under the model you propose. You need a paper trail. Period.

I don't believe you.

[CAMP]

I don't believe you.

If you could do that then why don't you just change all my posts on here... go ahead try if you're so good. You should be able to steal my account here too.... go ahead try if you're the man.

Really, you are hiding behind a veil trying to put fear into people about electronic voting.

Ok people if you never see me post here again I guess this guy is right....lol!

[noahbody]

If you could do that then why don't you just change all my posts on here... go ahead try if you're so good. You should be able to steal my account here too. I like little boys.... go ahead try if you're the man.

Perv

[CAMP]

Perv

lol..no you just edited a phrase, anyone can do that... I'm still posting...lol!

[benny]

lol..no you just edited a phrase, anyone can do that... I'm still posting...lol!

My concern is that, to put it in the context of this forum, you can post not your own messages but the messages of other persons (who pay you to be on their side).

[CAMP]

My concern is that, to put it in the context of this forum, you can post not your own messages but the messages of other persons (who pay you to be on their side).

What this whole thread really amounts to is that online voting creates more voter turn out along with providing a lot of other advantages. Any voting system even the present one can be compromised. In fact ballot boxes have been known to disappear. No paper trail there other than ooops it's lost.

Online voting will happen, the sooner the better for regular Canadians.

[punked]

What this whole thread really amounts to is that online voting creates more voter turn out along with providing a lot of other advantages. Any voting system even the present one can be compromised. In fact ballot boxes have been known to disappear. No paper trail there other than ooops it's lost.

Online voting will happen, the sooner the better for regular Canadians.

But it doesn't.

[benny]

What this whole thread really amounts to is that online voting creates more voter turn out along with providing a lot of other advantages. Any voting system even the present one can be compromised. In fact ballot boxes have been known to disappear. No paper trail there other than ooops it's lost.

Online voting will happen, the sooner the better for regular Canadians.

Saying any voting system even the present one can be compromised is not very comforting to me.

[CAMP]

But it doesn't.

Punked I posted a response I received from Intelivote on the other thread that is similar to this one that you also are involved in. Rather than post it here again I'll let you look there.

There is a definate increased when online voting is used. That is not to say you will always get an increase but thus far it generally follows that route.

[CAMP]

Saying any voting system even the present one can be compromised is not very comforting to me.

Please read this article it is very informative on security with the internet.

http://www.canadian-alternative.com/Intern...urity_scare.pdf

[Riverwind]

http://www.canadian-alternative.com/Intern...urity_scare.pdf

My comments on the white wash:

Seven states volunteered to take part in the experiment. They are Arkansas, Florida,

Hawaii, North Carolina, South Carolina, Utah, and Washington. Military personnel from

these states could sign up for the program using their military ID. Then they could

register to vote in the state of their last residence. After that, they were ready to vote on

SERVE in their state’s primaries and the 2004 general election.

A system is only as secure as the sign up process. Typing a military id into a web form would not be secure - some other form of authentication is required. In the case of banking this requires that a singed check be mailed to the bank. An e-voting system would require at least that level of authentication.

The voting process would begin with the voter using his or her PC, or any other

computer, from any place in the world, at any time of day or night. First, the voter would

log on to the secure SERVE web site, enter the PIN that was issued at sign up, and

request a ballot.

So what happens if they lose their PIN or never receive it? A secure system needs a secure way to recover lost PINs. A bank relies on phone operators which ask a series of questions. This would not be practical in an e-voting system that is only used once per year and when it is used everyone uses it at once.

SERVE would periodically send the voting data to the appropriate local election official, and

those officials would also be able to download the data at will, after passing a security check.

Again. What happens if the lists are out of sync and people vote online and at the ballot box? In Canada we have a paper system to keep track of who votes at the polls (you sign beside your name on the voter list). Entering this data manually into a computer so it could be cross checked against a list of e-voters would be a massive task and expense.

[Topaz]

Camp. just watch this video and I think most Canadians will feel the same way as the last guy on the video. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3875476549496397083