Public Sector Employees (MANAGEMENT AND BARGAINING UNIT)

[madmax]

Lets see if this has any steam

[Goat Boy©]

Anyone who votes no is either a public sector employee or somebody that shouldn't be qualified to vote in elections.

[Peter F]

Anyone who votes no is either a public sector employee or somebody that shouldn't be qualified to vote in elections.

I voted No. Suck it up.

[Smallc]

Anyone who votes no is either a public sector employee or somebody that shouldn't be qualified to vote in elections.

Maybe you should take a 25% pay cut then?

[Goat Boy©]

Maybe you should take a 25% pay cut then?

I just lost 45% of my operating budget. I'm dealing with it. I'm underpaid too. I earn $120/hr for the company, and make a fraction of it. I don't cry about it.

[Smallc]

I just lost 45% of my operating budget. I'm dealing with it. I'm underpaid too. I earn $120/hr for the company, and make a fraction of it. I don't cry about it.

If you suddenly lost 25% of your pay, pay that your family forms their budget with....if you suddenly couldn't pay for your car or your mortgage....yeah, cut people's pay by huge amounts...great idea. That will solve the credit problem.

[Goat Boy©]

If you suddenly lost 25% of your pay, pay that your family forms their budget with....if you suddenly couldn't pay for your car or your mortgage....yeah, cut people's pay by huge amounts...great idea. That will solve the credit problem.

Hang on a second here. Who said anything about solving the credit crisis? It will solve itself in time. But the government's expecting a 30 billion dollar deficit, and you're saying wages shouldn't be slashed?

[Smallc]

Hang on a second here. Who said anything about solving the credit crisis? It will solve itself in time. But the government's expecting a 30 billion dollar deficit, and you're saying wages shouldn't be slashed?

Not by 25% they shouldn't. It's not their fault that the government is facing a deficit.

[Topaz]

I say when a Fed. gov't takes us into a deficit, then all the Fed ministers should take a pay cut FIRST, to set an example, especially these members who are working less than teachers! Nothing against the teachers, but they are only in the class room, 10 months. I don't think the govt have been in session 10 months straight? How about 6? 4?

[Renegade]

This is a ridiculous poll. The choices vary between two extremes.

The public sector shouldn't take a unilateral paycut without negotiation any more than private sector should. It woudl be deemed a constructive dismissal.

[Argus]

Lets see if this has any steam

Childish poll. It smacks of sullen resentment towards people with better pay and benefits and contains no realistic choices.

[Hydraboss]

I say when a Fed. gov't takes us into a deficit, then all the Fed ministers should take a pay cut FIRST, to set an example, especially these members who are working less than teachers! Nothing against the teachers, but they are only in the class room, 10 months. I don't think the govt have been in session 10 months straight? How about 6? 4?

In most of the boards in Alberta, teachers are required to work 180.5 FDE (full day equivalents). You're dead on. There hasn't been a politician that works that many days in generations (except at election time). I agree that they should be the first to take the hit, and then go after the rest of the public sector.

I'd actually like to see it happen to select groups of Snivel Servants.

[Smallc]

In most of the boards in Alberta, teachers are required to work 180.5 FDE (full day equivalents). You're dead on. There hasn't been a politician that works that many days in generations (except at election time).

You think that politicians are only working when the house is sitting?

[Hydraboss]

I'll answer "yes" if we can agree that there is a difference between politicians and the government workers that work for them.

[madmax]

This is a ridiculous poll. The choices vary between two extremes.

The public sector shouldn't take a unilateral paycut without negotiation any more than private sector should. It woudl be deemed a constructive dismissal.

Obviously you have no idea that most of the private sector roughly 88% is not unionized in Ontario. There is no negotiation when the employer tells you your new wage, and pay cut.

I have watched entire management teams walked into a room, have their vacation weeks trimmed by 1 to 2 weeks, pay reduced by 15%, and pension plans eliminated. And those that complained, soon found themselves on the outside, looking for a better job and not finding it.

Wages have been going down in Ontario in the industrial sector since 2005.

Waterloo Record, Canada - 10 hours ago

Workers at Essar Steel Algoma .....paycheque -- by 20 per cent in a bid to prevent layoffs. ...

Edited December 19, 2008 by madmax

[madmax]

I'll answer "yes" if we can agree that there is a difference between politicians and the government workers that work for them.

There is a difference between politicians. OBviously a 25% pay cut for politicians is not nearly enough.

[madmax]

Not by 25% they shouldn't. It's not their fault that the government is facing a deficit.

No more then it is the fault that some private companies might face deficit. But it has more to do with competition. Lower wages, benefits, and Pensions is what we need to compete against in a global economy, regardless of profit or loss.

Pensions and Benefits must be provided by the employee and not the employer.

And there is no need to pay higher salaries then the market will bear in the public sector. There are many people with the skills and capabilities who can do many of these bureacratic jobs for $20,000 to $30,000 without demanding benefits, pensions and sick pay.

[Peter F]

Hmmm... the lower the wages and the fewer the benefits the better off we'll be. Sorry. Not buying.

Edited December 20, 2008 by Peter F

[McFad]

I'm a public service employee with a provincial government and my husband works for the feds. In our field, hands down the private sector is out pacing us in wages and holiday opportunities. And lower level provincial staff are being paid higher than more senior staff in the federal department in a similar field. I'd say this pole, besides providing poor and polorized options, paints an untrue picture of the current system.

As for the wages and benefits of politicians didn't they just give themselves a raise?

I also don't believe cutting wages and cutting spending is going to solve the nation's economic issues - it's much more complicated and requires greater long-term vision than that.

[Argus]

No more then it is the fault that some private companies might face deficit. But it has more to do with competition. Lower wages, benefits, and Pensions is what we need to compete against in a global economy, regardless of profit or loss.

Pensions and Benefits must be provided by the employee and not the employer.

And there is no need to pay higher salaries then the market will bear in the public sector. There are many people with the skills and capabilities who can do many of these bureacratic jobs for $20,000 to $30,000 without demanding benefits, pensions and sick pay.

Yeah okay, guy. You want to pay people who operate multi-billion dollar national programs for taxation, human resources, international trade, border security, law, information technology, and pension benefits less than a Costco cashier?

Of course, Costco cashier's get benefits which you don't think government employees ought to get.

Hmmm, here's Joe Smith, who operates out of HQ in Ottawa, running a team who administer a national program involving GST tax rebates. He has people in tax centres across the nation and a budget of 3 million dollars. Pay - $30,000. Benefits. None.

Here's Alice Smith. She's a cashier at Costco. Pay, $44,000, plus sick leave, pension, stock options, dental, vision and pharmacare, as well as added health benefits.

Yeah, seems logical to me.

Edited December 20, 2008 by Argus

[Goat Boy©]

Yeah okay, guy. You want to pay people who operate multi-billion dollar national programs for taxation, human resources, international trade, border security, law, information technology, and pension benefits less than a Costco cashier?

Of course, Costco cashier's get benefits which you don't think government employees ought to get.

Hmmm, here's Joe Smith, who operates out of HQ in Ottawa, running a team who administer a national program involving GST tax rebates. He has people in tax centres across the nation and a budget of 3 million dollars. Pay - $30,000. Benefits. None.

Here's Alice Smith. She's a cashier at Costco. Pay, $44,000, plus sick leave, pension, stock options, dental, vision and pharmacare, as well as added health benefits.

Yeah, seems logical to me.

And the guy mopping the bathrooms at ICBC or Canada post for $28/hr? That is justified?

[scribblet]

I didn't vote because there needs to be a middle ground, maybe a 10% pay cut, or simply a hold on any increases, including COLA

[madmax]

I'm a public service employee with a provincial government and my husband works for the feds. In our field, hands down the private sector is out pacing us in wages and holiday opportunities.

Sure, I believe you.

Please put up some job postings for your field and for the private sector.

I also don't believe cutting wages and cutting spending is going to solve the nation's economic issues - it's much more complicated and requires greater long-term vision than that.

The polling numbers here, are reflective on the ground. And this is a hack site, which means that in the coffee shop sphere these numbers are going to support cuts to the public sector.

As the wages for people decline, it is very difficult to justify continuing to overpay public sector employees.

[madmax]

Yeah okay, guy.

You can call me madmax

You want to pay people who operate multi-billion dollar national programs for taxation, human resources, international trade, border security, law, information technology, and pension benefits less than a Costco cashier?

Overinflating your worth and what you do is typical of a public sector employee such as yourself. You are not productive. A 25% pay cut is necessary. But not just that, you can purchase your own pension plan, and benefit plan and not ride on the backs of the taxpayers.

Now here is a Border enforcement "ASSISTANT" Not bad for an entry level job.

Enforcement AssistantDepartment Name: Canada Border Services Agency

Location: London

Classification: CR - 05

Salary: $43,826 to $47,447 (annual salary range)

Closing Date: December 23, 2008 - 23:59, Pacific Time Useful Information

Reference Number: BSF08J-000021-001065

Selection Process Number: 08-BSF-EA-WSC-ED-CR-066

hmmm... quite the statement.

Of course, Costco cashier's get benefits which you don't think government employees ought to get.

Hmmm, here's Joe Smith, who operates out of HQ in Ottawa, running a team who administer a national program involving GST tax rebates. He has people in tax centres across the nation and a budget of 3 million dollars. Pay - $30,000. Benefits. None.

ROTFLMAO.

Sure Argus, I believe you.

Here is a position that answers the phone at the tax office. Not a bad starting wage. Most people in call centres make minimum wage.

Taxpayer Services Agent, Inbound Call Centre,Toronto North Tax Services Office, North York, Bilingual imperative, CBC/CBC

Term / Anticipatory

Salary range:

$ 45,730 to $ 51,470 annually

Now Argus, to be fair and honest with the readers, here is a comparable job to your hypothetical.

Position: Senior Supervisor, RE-5

Salary Range: $71,500 - $91,000

Location: Toronto

Appointment: Indeterminate, Anticipatory

Number of positions to be staffed with this advertised process: Anticipatory

Area of Selection: Persons residing in Canada and Canadian citizens living abroad

Closing date: N/A

Here's Alice Smith. She's a cashier at Costco. Pay, $44,000, plus sick leave, pension, stock options, dental, vision and pharmacare, as well as added health benefits.

Yeah, seems logical to me.

Argus you seem to have an honest Public Sector opinion of the Private Sector....... Here are Costco Wages.

Costco Offers

High wages

- Starting wages $10.00 to $10.50

- Scheduled pay raises up to $16.17

Flexible scheduling

Part-time and full-time hours

Career opportunities - we promote from within

A chance to learn merchandising and warehouse operations

Entry-level positions include:

- Cashier

- Stocker

- Fork-lift driver

- Greeter

- Membership

- Administrative personnel

Since you care so much about a Costco employee

Edited December 22, 2008 by madmax

[madmax]

I didn't vote because there needs to be a middle ground, maybe a 10% pay cut, or simply a hold on any increases, including COLA

COLA, cola is a leftover from the 80s. Cola is virtually been eradicated from the Private Sector.

25% reduction in pay.

Elimination of taxpayer paid benefits.

Elimination of taxpayer paid pensions.

Elimination of paid sickdays.

This isn't alot to ask. Cuts could go alot deeper.