The Goal of Militant Islam

[M.Dancer]

I'm hung over. I can't wait till 11:30 so I can go over to the militant muslin falafel shop and get a shawarma falafel combo with a side of militant tabouli

[AngusThermopyle]

Okay I admit defeat...you don't mean muslims in general you only mean Militant muslims. Fine.

Actually I don't know what Warbike meant. The only thing I know for sure is what I meant, which would be Militant/Radical types. Don't really care if they're Muslim, Christian, Native, or whatever. My belief is that they should be dealt with in a harsh and non-compromising manner.

Ahjeez now we already find contradictions... How can 1% of Muslim population be militant and "not considered a threat" and how can Militant Muslims be considered an integral but unique segment of society" ?

What makes such Muslims militant at all? Thier unthreatening behaviour; thier integration but unique status; Thats militant?

Some good points in the above. Logically if they're militant then by definition they are a threat. I suppose you could say they are unique in that most people are not militant, however its a uniqueness I'm sure we could all live without.

Same thing for 2-3% level. Militant muslims recriut amongst disenfranchised youth, streetgangs and prisoners.

What is it that makes these muslims militant? There are Christian missions out doing the exact same thing and no one considers that 'militant' or dangerous.

In this case I'd say sure, there are Christian organizations doing similar things. The big difference being that Militant/Radical Muslims see terrorist tactics as a legitimate form of enforcing their beliefs. I don't know of any Christian groups who want world domination through violence if necessary.

Edited April 23, 2008 by AngusThermopyle

[Borg]

The goal of militant Islam is to force its will upon the rest of the world;

Source

Your opening statement is factually correct as has been expressed in media the world over - many times in fact.

They can also be read in the english version of Arab News and Aljezeera News from time to time.

Your numbers are an interesting bit of info - if correct, times will become even more interesting in certain parts of Europe over the next decade.

You will of course be called many things for reporting this.

Easy for many here to ignore the potential future by ignoring the past.

Borg

[Peter F]

In this case I'd say sure, there are Christian organizations doing similar things. The big difference being that Militant/Radical Muslims see terrorist tactics as a legitimate form of enforcing their beliefs. I don't know of any Christian groups who want world domination through violence if necessary.

We agree. The threat isn't religion, the threat is those who use violence to achieve political/religious/economic goals; who have no use for the pen and the ballot but resort to bombs and bullshit.

Those guys I'm willing to see put away (not deported) but actually put away. Deporting such folk doesn't do anyone any good.

Wether Christianity or Islam is better has been an ongoing debate for the past 1200 years and best left for another thread

[AngusThermopyle]

Wether Christianity or Islam is better has been an ongoing debate for the past 1200 years and best left for another thread

Since I don't believe in any mysterious all powerfull higher power I just avoid the subject alltogether.

[WarBicycle]

I forgot to include Nigeria, MUSLIM RIOTERS ATTACK CHRISTIANS, whose religious beliefs are Muslim 50%, Christian 40%, indigenous beliefs 10%.

Edited April 24, 2008 by WarBicycle

[M.Dancer]

I forgot to include Nigeria, MUSLIM RIOTERS ATTACK CHRISTIANS, whose religious beliefs are Muslim 50%, Christian 40%, indigenous beliefs 10%.

Yeah....you were better off forgetting it.

The strife in Nigeria is tribal, it has nothing to do per se with religion.

[WarBicycle]

KANO, Nigeria, April 23 (Compass Direct News) – Hundreds of Muslims took to the streets of this northern Nigerian city on Sunday (April 20), attacking Christians and their shops and setting vehicles on fire on claims that a Christian had blasphemed Muhammad, the prophet of Islam.

Is this you interpretation of tribal?

[M.Dancer]

Is this you interpretation of tribal?

Pretty much. Given that the two opposing sides are from two different tribes.

do you have a link?

[M.Dancer]

Never mind, I found it and I wouldn't have posted a link either. Mind you, I get my news from reputable sources.

[M.Dancer]

The other side of the coin....

Bodies pile up after Nigeria riot

Police have struggled to keep a lid on the violence

The city of Onitsha in south-eastern Nigeria is calm after two days of anti-Muslim riots left many dead.

Nigerian human rights workers say they have counted 80 bodies following two days of reprisal attacks by crowds of Christians armed with machetes.

The sectarian clashes have already become the worst experienced in Nigeria in two years.

Nigeria's 120 million people are roughly equally divided between Muslims from the north and Christians and animists in the south.

Relations between the two groups - and the country's many ethnic groups - are often tense. More than 10,000 people have been killed in communal clashes since 1999.

Tribal

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/4743672.stm

[WarBicycle]

BBC News is no longer deemed reliable, it has too much of a Leftish slant. The mob in my above post had nothing to do with tribalism, a Christian insulted Mohammed, and the idiots went nuts.

[Wild Bill]

BBC News is no longer deemed reliable, it has too much of a Leftish slant. The mob in my above post had nothing to do with tribalism, a Christian insulted Mohammed, and the idiots went nuts.

This leads to another question: Most average citizens can appreciate the irony of how militant Islamists, reacting to a perceived slight that accused their religion of being violent, can then protest by committing violence and even murder!

Yet our media talking heads rarely make a comment. To me, this is more than a question of morality. It's a comment on a group's level of intelligence!

I'm just not certain if it's a comment against Islamists or against US!

[Wild Bill]

BBC News is no longer deemed reliable, it has too much of a Leftish slant. The mob in my above post had nothing to do with tribalism, a Christian insulted Mohammed, and the idiots went nuts.

This leads to another question: Most average citizens can appreciate the irony of how militant Islamists, reacting to a perceived slight that accused their religion of being violent, can then protest by committing violence and even murder!

Yet our media talking heads rarely make a comment. To me, this is more than a question of morality. It's a comment on a group's level of intelligence!

I'm just not certain if it's a comment against Islamists or against US!

[Wild Bill]

BBC News is no longer deemed reliable, it has too much of a Leftish slant. The mob in my above post had nothing to do with tribalism, a Christian insulted Mohammed, and the idiots went nuts.

This leads to another question: Most average citizens can appreciate the irony of how militant Islamists, reacting to a perceived slight that accused their religion of being violent, can then protest by committing violence and even murder!

Yet our media talking heads rarely make a comment. To me, this is more than a question of morality. It's a comment on a group's level of intelligence!

I'm just not certain if it's a comment against Islamists or against US!

[Rue]

I'm hung over. I can't wait till 11:30 so I can go over to the militant muslin falafel shop and get a shawarma falafel combo with a side of militant tabouli

I am a Zionist swine and I love falafel not just bagels and lox. I am multi-functional.

I fear fundamentalists of any religion for the reasons stated above and which was AmerWoman's point.

How we are going to resolve these essentially cultural clashes between the West and The East remains to be seen. I believe an understimated factor is what I call the Big mac syndrome. I do not doubt it appears in the East there are more radical fundamentalist Muslims who appear threatening to the West and appear to be multiplying and are going to "take over" the West through floods of migratory movement where they will become the majority in once Christian states and try turn the tide in their favour.

That is a wide spread fear and to me it is necessarily a phenomena that has resulted from the world shrinking and movement of peoples becoming more possible.

However in addition to the above phenomena is the Big Mac syndrome. Satellite t.v. and the web has brought as much if not more persuasive Western cultural values to the East as Muslim immigrants might be bringing to the West.

Part of the rise of Eastern fundamentalism in the Muslim world is of course a direct reaction to and an attempt to block out the Big Macs and Cokes and hip hop music, etc. The same alleged Muslim terrorists wear adidas and are into hip hop and love big macs. They may be imitating their elders for now, but they are showing the signs of turning to and becoming Western and the Taliban and Osama and all the mullahs know this.

In the end what will prevail in my opinion is the Big Mac and Coke it provides immediate gratification something a Muslim society built on repressing this primal instinct ins unable to counter no matter how many bombs and missles it sends or how many times it blames Israel or the US military-its failures are its own inability to adapt and become more humane, less judging, less rigid, and more compassionate let alone creative. Its precisely what defeated the Soviet Communist system and has permanently corupted the once mighty Maoist vision of socialism and rendered that country the biggest exploiter of human beings the world has ever known-its called material coruption. Its a disease no one is immune to and can not be stopped unless you plan to shut down the International Monetary Fund and all the multi-nationals behind it.

Do not understimate the power of coca cola and big macs.

Edited April 24, 2008 by Rue

[JB Globe]

Hey everybody, who wants to make a post about how evil Jews are?

We can cut n paste from Stomfront, then our case will be airtight!

[Borg]

Hey everybody, who wants to make a post about how evil Jews are?

We can cut n paste from Stomfront, then our case will be airtight!

Too late - it has been done many times

Got any other bright ideas?

Borg

[WIP]

I am a Zionist swine and I love falafel not just bagels and lox. I am multi-functional.

I fear fundamentalists of any religion for the reasons stated above and which was AmerWoman's point.

How we are going to resolve these essentially cultural clashes between the West and The East remains to be seen. I believe an understimated factor is what I call the Big mac syndrome. I do not doubt it appears in the East there are more radical fundamentalist Muslims who appear threatening to the West and appear to be multiplying and are going to "take over" the West through floods of migratory movement where they will become the majority in once Christian states and try turn the tide in their favour.

That is a wide spread fear and to me it is necessarily a phenomena that has resulted from the world shrinking and movement of peoples becoming more possible.

However in addition to the above phenomena is the Big Mac syndrome. Satellite t.v. and the web has brought as much if not more persuasive Western cultural values to the East as Muslim immigrants might be bringing to the West.

Part of the rise of Eastern fundamentalism in the Muslim world is of course a direct reaction to and an attempt to block out the Big Macs and Cokes and hip hop music, etc. The same alleged Muslim terrorists wear adidas and are into hip hop and love big macs. They may be imitating their elders for now, but they are showing the signs of turning to and becoming Western and the Taliban and Osama and all the mullahs know this.

In the end what will prevail in my opinion is the Big Mac and Coke it provides immediate gratification something a Muslim society built on repressing this primal instinct ins unable to counter no matter how many bombs and missles it sends or how many times it blames Israel or the US military-its failures are its own inability to adapt and become more humane, less judging, less rigid, and more compassionate let alone creative. Its precisely what defeated the Soviet Communist system and has permanently corupted the once mighty Maoist vision of socialism and rendered that country the biggest exploiter of human beings the world has ever known-its called material coruption. Its a disease no one is immune to and can not be stopped unless you plan to shut down the International Monetary Fund and all the multi-nationals behind it.

Do not understimate the power of coca cola and big macs.

The problem is that the religion meme has a powerful self-defence mechanism against the challenge of new ideas and attitudes. Challenging religious beliefs is considered taboo by polite society, and in the Muslim World, it can mean death from crazed mobs even in countries that don't make apostasy a capital crime. My guess is that as long as the heart of the beast (Saudi Arabia) is swimming in billions from oil revenues, there will be no successful movement to separate religion from law and government in Muslim nations, and there will be continuous pressure from fundamentalists who have been educated in the madrassahs that are funded by the Saudis.

But, let's not forget that militant Christianity is also a problem; especially the Rapture-ready crowd that sees war in the Middle East as the inevitable ingredient to fulfilling Bible prophecies. If the warhawks are serious about the threat of Islamism, then they will channel their war-making desires into the effort to start switching over to a post-oil economy now! If America wasn't in a desperate struggle with China, Russia and Europe for control of remaining oil reserves in Iraq, West Africa and the Caspian Sea, then we could leave the Middle East and let them choose for themselves whether or not to join the modern world!

[WIP]

BBC News is no longer deemed reliable, it has too much of a Leftish slant. The mob in my above post had nothing to do with tribalism, a Christian insulted Mohammed, and the idiots went nuts.

And would America care about rioting Muslims in Northern Nigeria if it weren't for the oil deals they're working on with the present government? If Chevron and Shell's Niger Delta developments are threatened by civil strife, what are the odds that this will be the next destination for American troops? So far, insurgent attacks have cut oil production by 20%; since Nigeria is the eighth largest oil producer in the world, this is already a factor in the increasing price of oil. If it was cut off completely, Nigeria will be the next U.S. protectorate.

http://www.alternet.org/story/33282/

[bush_cheney2004]

And would America care about rioting Muslims in Northern Nigeria if it weren't for the oil deals they're working on with the present government? ...

No more than Canadian oil services companies working deals in Iraq.

[WIP]

No more than Canadian oil services companies working deals in Iraq.

Well since your tax dollars are being devoted to the enormous military costs of securing new oil supplies from unstable regions in Africa and the Middle East, finding a way to move pass oil-dependence would save you a lot of money.

[bush_cheney2004]

Well since your tax dollars are being devoted to the enormous military costs of securing new oil supplies from unstable regions in Africa and the Middle East, finding a way to move pass oil-dependence would save you a lot of money.

Not really....the cost to "move past" may well be more than the present costs, most of which would still exist anyway as minimum military budgets. The USA has diversified its foreign oil suppliers, and actually receives less from the Middle East.

Sweet crude oil is second only to enriched uranium for energy density.....it won't be abandoned until the economics make sense.

[WIP]

Not really....the cost to "move past" may well be more than the present costs, most of which would still exist anyway as minimum military budgets. The USA has diversified its foreign oil suppliers, and actually receives less from the Middle East.

Sweet crude oil is second only to enriched uranium for energy density.....it won't be abandoned until the economics make sense.

Well, there's nothing like high prices to provide an incentive to reduce consumption: http://www.oilvoice.com/n/US_Oil_Consumpti...s/ff895835.aspx

Looks like the economics for moving past reliance on oil are starting to kick in again!

But besides economic sense, what about environmental sense and national security sense? If you look at conflicts in the Middle East and Africa, everyone's fighting over who's going to control the oil. Complacency might be excusable if oil was an unlimited resource; but what sense does it make to go to war to fight for something that's going to run out in 20 or 30 years? Right now would be a good time to start cutting back!

The following are exact quotes.

Notable highlights are in Bold. Results in Brief (Pages 4 - 6)

Most studies estimate that oil production will peak sometime between now and 2040, although many of these projections cover a wide range of time, including two studies for which the range extends into the next century. The timing of the peak depends on multiple, uncertain factors that will influence how quickly the remaining oil is used, including the amount of oil still in the ground, how much of the remaining oil can be ultimately produced, and future oil demand. The amount of oil remaining in the ground is highly uncertain, in part because the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries (OPEC) controls most of the estimated world oil reserves, but its estimates of reserves are not verified by independent auditors. In addition, many parts of the world have not yet been fully explored for oil. There is also great uncertainty about the amount of oil that will ultimately be produced, given the technological, cost, and environmental challenges. For example, some of the oil remaining in the ground can be accessed only by using complex and costly technologies that present greater environmental challenges than the technologies used for most of the oil produced to date. Other important sources of uncertainty about future oil production are potentially unfavorable political and investment conditions in countries where oil is located. For example, more than 60 percent of world oil reserves, on the basis of Oil and Gas Journal estimates, are in countries where relatively unstable political conditions could constrain oil exploration and production. Finally, future world demand for oil also is uncertain because it depends on economic growth and government policies throughout the world. For example, continued rapid economic growth in China and India could significantly increase world demand for oil, while environmental concerns, including oil’s contribution to global warming, may spur conservation or adoption of alternative fuels that would reduce future demand for oil.

http://www.oilcrisis.com/us/GAO/GAOPeakOil...tHighlights.pdf

[bush_cheney2004]

Well, there's nothing like high prices to provide an incentive to reduce consumption: http://www.oilvoice.com/n/US_Oil_Consumpti...s/ff895835.aspx

Looks like the economics for moving past reliance on oil are starting to kick in again!

But besides economic sense, what about environmental sense and national security sense? If you look at conflicts in the Middle East and Africa, everyone's fighting over who's going to control the oil. Complacency might be excusable if oil was an unlimited resource; but what sense does it make to go to war to fight for something that's going to run out in 20 or 30 years? Right now would be a good time to start cutting back!

Nope....we won't be cutting back anytime soon. Peak Oil Panic made the rounds back in the early 1970's too....it was supposed to "run out" in 20 or 30 years. It doesn't really ever run out....but the the cost of exploration and production goes way up.

However, we do agree that oil is not renewable...but blood is.

The USA was self reliant for oil for many years....but there were still wars.