Banning of pesticides for lawns

[Topaz]

www.canadian press or www.yahoo.ca A coalition of environmental activists and health professionals are calling for the provincial to ban pesticides for home use or lawns. I understand the problem with cancer with these products but how does one stop the chinch bug from killing off one's lawn? On the news today, I also heard they want to stop the sell of fertilizers to homeowners. Is there a way to make both sides happy??

[guyser]

A coalition of environmental activists and health professionals are calling for the provincial to ban pesticides for home use or lawns.

This has been the law in TO since last winter. The parks were over run with dandelions but it was to be "safer" for all of us. Being one who really doesnt care that my lawn looks A one, I didnt give a moments thought.

People put pesticide on their lawns......at night under cover of darkness.

The city banned pesticide from being sold in city limits. Hardware stores outside of the city did booming business, including my frined at the cottage who owned the local Home Hardware store. I asked him in the spring if he had noticed better sales, sure did was his reply.He was quite happy since pesticide use was falling in cottage country since people were not using it on the lawns due to lake water contamination, but the City gave his business a boost , 200K away.

But to answer your question? Why a shop vac of course, suck 'em up. Or soap and water the area, or put 6 inches of loam and soil under your lawn and dont cut it short.

Lots of organic and home remedies out there.

[Borg]

www.canadian press or www.yahoo.ca A coalition of environmental activists and health professionals are calling for the provincial to ban pesticides for home use or lawns. I understand the problem with cancer with these products but how does one stop the chinch bug from killing off one's lawn? On the news today, I also heard they want to stop the sell of fertilizers to homeowners. Is there a way to make both sides happy??

Nanny state stuff.

Pave it or use Astro Turf!

Borg

[Topaz]

Now that being said about the non-farming group, how much poisons do you keep the farming community uses. This the is place were we get our food and then eat it and bring all those poisons into our bodies. I really don't think you can ban one sector and NOT the other.

[Borg]

Now that being said about the non-farming group, how much poisons do you keep the farming community uses. This the is place were we get our food and then eat it and bring all those poisons into our bodies. I really don't think you can ban one sector and NOT the other.

Poisons and farming......

When you spend more than a hundred K on chemical aplications or as some I know - literally millions of dollars, you darned well use them as they are intended and at the appropriate rates. You simply cannot afford to waste anything - the margins are far too small to consider it.

You also are required to have applicator licencing in many, most or perhaps even all provinces.

In fact it is so expensive now-a-days that it is often cheaper to hire the work done by specialist companies than it is to buy a machine and hold it in the shop - unused - for 10 months of the year.

A new sprayer can go for as much as $400K - smaller new farm sprayers usually average at least $30K for somethng that will do 500 acres or so. It HAS to pay for itself!

The city slicker goes out, buys chemical and dumps it on the ground - hoping for a better lawn and garden. Literally millions of home owners certainly equals and possibly exceeds the chemical useage of the ag sector in north America.

I would bet you a drink in the bar of your choice there is far less mishandling in the country as a whole as compared to the city. Livilihoods depend upon it - unlike the slicker who works at a day job and just wants a green lawn and red roses.

You have a complaint about herbicides, fungicides and insecticides, take it up with your government - be advised it is those chemicals that allow production of food and those chemical are closely monitored.

Unlike some of those imported foods from countries still using chemicals that have been outlawed in Canada. Stuff like as DDT, Toxaphene, Chlordane and Aldrin and so on.

Be advised you better stop eating bananas and oranges and kiwi and some of those wonder full rice products. Because there will be none for export - the crop numbers will certainly dwindle. Will you eat apples, potatoes or other root crops with scab on them? Not frigging likely.

Better be prepared to feed even more people in the world - when the locusts eat - the people do not.

I guarantee you that the so called organic folks could not produce on a whole - the food consumed the world over. The development, the skills, the ground fertility, the ground carrying ability, the bug control and the disease control simply is NOT there. ANything esle - at this time is a simple lie - told to make the feel good crowd believe it is better.

Trust me - if there was a way to produce food like we do and do it better and cheaper - we WOULD do it.

I am prepared to go organic - are you prepared to pay me triple or more for my crop? Buy bread at 7 bucks a loaf? Maybe you - how about your neighbour? Forced organic - YOU WILL EAT BETTER? What a joke.

If someone thinks for a minute that your organic and legislation loving, idealistic greenie can actually feed the world of today without fertilizers and chemicals - well, they have another think coming.

I would love to see them raise food in Botswana for export - or perhaps try the Russian steppes - or better - parts of South America - without some type of chemical assistance. And we import that food - far better to insist it is inspected and tested - which by the way - the CFIA admits in the vast majority of cases - it is NOT!

Time to look outside that local shell that blinds people to anything beyond self interest due to false gods of green and look at reality - then come to grips with it. Bans do nothing but create a false underground economy and law breakers trying to make a living.

You got more money you want to give to the farmer when he cannot make quota or cannot make volume and grade due to lack of fertilizer and chemical protection? Tell you what - I will be happy to allow someone to farm all of our operations - just buy me out and go organic. Cut me a check today and I will happily walk away.

You are already and have been for years eating round-up ready corn, beans, wheat and cattle fed round-up ready products (including hay) and pigs eating reound-up ready products and chickens eating round-up ready products. There is NO such thing as organic. Wind drift takes care of that. Bees take care of that. Simple machinery and animal and vehicular movement take care of that. Pollens from non certified fields hit the fields that are "certified" organic all the time and in huge numbers.

Organic. Such a joke and so many believe it. If my field of round-up ready rape is beside a field of certified organic rape - do you honestly think Mother Nature respects that legal boundary - she crosses it every day and all day.

It is not as simple as it seems and those who would vote for a total ban are simply fooling themselves - showing their ignorance to the world and imposing their will - after all why should you NOT do as you are told?

Borg

Edited January 16, 2008 by Borg

[M.Dancer]

This has been the law in TO since last winter. The parks were over run with dandelions but it was to be "safer" for all of us.

we don't need pesticides for that, just more mediterranean immigrants. I remember in my youth in Montreal seeing dozens of women in black garb on thier hand s and knees harvesting fletcher's field on the east side of Mount Royal.

[Argus]

www.canadian press or www.yahoo.ca A coalition of environmental activists and health professionals are calling for the provincial to ban pesticides for home use or lawns. I understand the problem with cancer with these products but how does one stop the chinch bug from killing off one's lawn? On the news today, I also heard they want to stop the sell of fertilizers to homeowners. Is there a way to make both sides happy??

They brought this up in Ottawa and I tried to find literature on it on the internet. I found no credible scientific evidence which supports the notion that lawn pesticides are a danger to the public at large. Environment Canada and Health Canada have no problems with lawn chemicals when used as directed. The only studies I was able to find which linked health care problems with the use of the chemicals were on those who worked with them on a daily basis, as a career, you could say, and often misused them.

Nevertheless, it's one of those issues which the left embraces, and the NDP is the only party which organizes on the municipal level, so they have a disproportionate power there. Which means we have a lot of really lousy municipal councils which like to interfere in how people run their lives while simultaneously hiking taxes and spending and screwing up services.

The motion failed in Ottawa by a narrow margin, but the Left never gives up. No issue is ever closed until they win a vote - then the issue is closed and no further discussion is allowed. They will try again this spring, and next spring, until they get it banned. Then they'll move on their next "issue", something else which is pointless, time-consuming and costly, no doubt.

[M.Dancer]

I know someone who puts a pesticide sign on his lawn from time to time. He never uses pesticide but it does keep the major lawn killing pests away.

And that would be dogs and dog owners.

Edited January 16, 2008 by M.Dancer

[blueblood]

Poisons and farming......

When you spend more than a hundred K on chemical aplications or as some I know - literally millions of dollars, you darned well use them as they are intended and at the appropriate rates. You simply cannot afford to waste anything - the margins are far too small to consider it.

You also are required to have applicator licencing in many, most or perhaps even all provinces.

In fact it is so expensive now-a-days that it is often cheaper to hire the work done by specialist companies than it is to buy a machine and hold it in the shop - unused - for 10 months of the year.

A new sprayer can go for as much as $400K - smaller new farm sprayers usually average at least $30K for somethng that will do 500 acres or so. It HAS to pay for itself!

The city slicker goes out, buys chemical and dumps it on the ground - hoping for a better lawn and garden. Literally millions of home owners certainly equals and possibly exceeds the chemical useage of the ag sector in north America.

I would bet you a drink in the bar of your choice there is far less mishandling in the country as a whole as compared to the city. Livilihoods depend upon it - unlike the slicker who works at a day job and just wants a green lawn and red roses.

You have a complaint about herbicides, fungicides and insecticides, take it up with your government - be advised it is those chemicals that allow production of food and those chemical are closely monitored.

Unlike some of those imported foods from countries still using chemicals that have been outlawed in Canada. Stuff like as DDT, Toxaphene, Chlordane and Aldrin and so on.

Be advised you better stop eating bananas and oranges and kiwi and some of those wonder full rice products. Because there will be none for export - the crop numbers will certainly dwindle. Will you eat apples, potatoes or other root crops with scab on them? Not frigging likely.

Better be prepared to feed even more people in the world - when the locusts eat - the people do not.

I guarantee you that the so called organic folks could not produce on a whole - the food consumed the world over. The development, the skills, the ground fertility, the ground carrying ability, the bug control and the disease control simply is NOT there. ANything esle - at this time is a simple lie - told to make the feel good crowd believe it is better.

Trust me - if there was a way to produce food like we do and do it better and cheaper - we WOULD do it.

I am prepared to go organic - are you prepared to pay me triple or more for my crop? Buy bread at 7 bucks a loaf? Maybe you - how about your neighbour? Forced organic - YOU WILL EAT BETTER? What a joke.

If someone thinks for a minute that your organic and legislation loving, idealistic greenie can actually feed the world of today without fertilizers and chemicals - well, they have another think coming.

I would love to see them raise food in Botswana for export - or perhaps try the Russian steppes - or better - parts of South America - without some type of chemical assistance. And we import that food - far better to insist it is inspected and tested - which by the way - the CFIA admits in the vast majority of cases - it is NOT!

Time to look outside that local shell that blinds people to anything beyond self interest due to false gods of green and look at reality - then come to grips with it. Bans do nothing but create a false underground economy and law breakers trying to make a living.

You got more money you want to give to the farmer when he cannot make quota or cannot make volume and grade due to lack of fertilizer and chemical protection? Tell you what - I will be happy to allow someone to farm all of our operations - just buy me out and go organic. Cut me a check today and I will happily walk away.

You are already and have been for years eating round-up ready corn, beans, wheat and cattle fed round-up ready products (including hay) and pigs eating reound-up ready products and chickens eating round-up ready products. There is NO such thing as organic. Wind drift takes care of that. Bees take care of that. Simple machinery and animal and vehicular movement take care of that. Pollens from non certified fields hit the fields that are "certified" organic all the time and in huge numbers.

Organic. Such a joke and so many believe it. If my field of round-up ready rape is beside a field of certified organic rape - do you honestly think Mother Nature respects that legal boundary - she crosses it every day and all day.

It is not as simple as it seems and those who would vote for a total ban are simply fooling themselves - showing their ignorance to the world and imposing their will - after all why should you NOT do as you are told?

Borg

Your wrong about the sprayer, a good used one runs around 60-70K, 30K gets you ancient junk. No roundup ready wheat availible yet.

Also the city slicker does not buy a case of roundup that has to be mixed with water like we do. They go to the hardware store and buy a spray bottle of pre-mixed roundup which is pretty weak in itself.

DDT was responsible for almost eradicating malaria, with it banned we have a malaria problem again, damn murderous hippies.

Other than that well said.

Edited January 18, 2008 by blueblood

[Borg]

Your wrong about the sprayer, a good used one runs around 60-70K, 30K gets you ancient junk. No roundup ready wheat availible yet.

Also the city slicker does not buy a case of roundup that has to be mixed with water like we do. They go to the hardware store and buy a spray bottle of pre-mixed roundup which is pretty weak in itself.

DDT was responsible for almost eradicating malaria, with it banned we have a malaria problem again, damn murderous hippies.

Other than that well said.

Actually you are right about sprayers - I have not bought a sprayer in a lot of years - we hire out - so I ran through a couple of machinery site - prices are sure up.

I used RR wheat as a mistake - neighbour sprays it for broadleaf and other pre and post emergent weeds. I guess it could now be considered non-organic. :-]

Unfortunately everyone jumps on the "green" bandwagon because it simply sounds good. The other unfortunate is those same folks never think it through. And the even worst unfortunate is the unsuspecting public takes it up the backside.

(Not a hijack but an example) No different than banning horse slaughter in the U.S. of A. It has created a huge and very disturbing mess.

Simply another sigh of how doo-gooders can create serious problems - all in the name of correctness.

Never underestimate the power of a bunch of idiots with organization and financial backing. And finally, where DO they get their money?

Borg