Muslim father chokes daughter to near death

[cybercoma]

Oh, so you're just advocating racial profiling?

[guyser]

That's bullshit. That's not what I'm after.

Seems to be.

I'm pointing out two glaring obvious observations:

1. Honour Killing is a distinctly muslim phenomenon

Nope, wrong. In fact glaringly wrong.

Every December 6 women and men march with lighted candles in memory of the women killed during the montreal massacre. This march is meant to direct attention to the violence against women perpetrated by one group of people: men.

At least they march under the guise of violence against women, which is how it should be.

If we can single out an entire gender as aggressive toward women, why can't we single out a religion?

Probably because in the one case it is violence against women, and in the second, it is still violence against women. It truly isnt so hard....well maybe.

2. In some western societies, we are already seeing not only aqcuiescance - ie. "hey it's just anothermurder", but in fact a change in legal policy on the grounds of "sensitivity" as per the australian police force's willingness to look the other way when it comes to muslim domestic violence.

Is there anything to back up your link? Because it is dated 2005 and it would be nice to see if in fact they have carried out the directive (not a law as you want to believe) and not just abadoned it as stupid.

I searched, no info on it still being in play.

[jbg]

This is the first home grown hit in Australia

I can undertand it fine

That's a great song and his most well known. I prefer other works of his though.

[jbg]

So in Canada we speak Canadian because we have a different accent and slang. That is absurd. They speak English, go to the world fact site.

You can't take a little humour, or humor?

[M.Dancer]

Little being the operative word.

[bluegreen]

Real Canada was Canada before 1965 when the racial quotas were removed and they changed the flag. Since hen the border has been wide open and as a society we have suffered at the hands of foreign invaders who are rotting this country from the inside out. I'm not a second class citizen and don't like being treated like one. We need a reversal of the current trend.

So yeah immigrants that come here and give nothing but their burden and take everything from the rest of us aren't real Canadians, sorry. When my ancestors came here they had to work hard for everything and set up businesses. They didn't live in ghettos like Jane and Finch, deal drugs and kill people. Animals behave that way not humans and certainly not Canadians. Even if they have a citizenship they should be labeled as guests not citizens until they fully integrate into society.

I also don't like it when we say immigrants nowadays it means people of colour. Why did we stop or slow down admitting Europeans to Canada? Or did they stop wanting to come here cause they see Canada turning into a third world toilet?

EDIT- I'm strongly considering a move to somewhere where my people are appreciated and not be made to feel guilty for who and what I am.

Are you seriously promising to leave the country? My only fear is that there may be no place where you are appreciated, and you won't feel guilty. Will that mean we are stuck with you? Perhaps you are not irredeemable if you are still capable of feeling guilt. That guilt you feel is your conscience telling you that you have been casting the first stone, and if you're not careful YOU ARE GOING TO HELL!

[jbg]

There wouldn't be any difference if every male, white or otherwise, was killing his family randomly.

However, the difference arises when a pattern emerges - ie. muslim men killing women in their family based upon their MUSLIM religious ideals.

They are called "honour killings" in the muslim faith. And pretending they don't exist, or ignoring their significance within the muslim religion is more culturally ignorant than those "bigots" who paint all muslims with the same brush.

It's a problem in the faith and to say otherwise is ignorant and willfully blind in the name of "sensitivity", and frankly, sick.

The problem is that these immigrants want the social welfare that comes from living in an advanced society and want to keep the primitive traditional values they are used to. Someone who immigrates should be faced with a choice; assimilate or clear out.

[JerrySeinfeld]

The problem is that these immigrants want the social welfare that comes from living in an advanced society and want to keep the primitive traditional values they are used to. Someone who immigrates should be faced with a choice; assimilate or clear out.

Precisely.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Oh, so you're just advocating racial profiling?

All you lefties are so hot for the multi culti you don't even see that it's YOU that I'm targeting here - not muslims per se.

A major problem here isn't simlpy the behavior - ie. honour killings.

It's your reaction to them.

We have a choice as a society to talk about this and condemn this. Or to turn our back and pretend it's not happening - as per... ahem... YOU.

[Oleg Bach]

The problem is that these immigrants want the social welfare that comes from living in an advanced society and want to keep the primitive traditional values they are used to. Someone who immigrates should be faced with a choice; assimilate or clear out.

Don't insult the primatives. Primatives are wise and blend in with the environ and survive. The values you are talking about are based in hate and violence. For the most part they are not religious...I am sure that if Mohamid was alive today he would NOT say - stone that girl who insulted your familiar pride by being raped..get rid of the embarrassment and evidence... that you failed to protect your own daughter form evil... Islamics like Christians and Jews lost their real religion once it became a selfish human construct that became dependant on human rage and hate - to keep a few perverse leaders in power.

[guyser]

All you lefties are so hot for the multi culti you don't even see that it's YOU that I'm targeting here - not muslims per se.

Lefties?

You want to address muslims not violence against anyone else, so it is clear you have an agenda. Admit it and move on.You dont like them, we know.

A major problem here isn't simlpy the behavior - ie. honour killings.

It's your reaction to them.

Whgat reaction? That we understand that there is an isolated problem in Canada with respect to honour killings (although extremely rare) or that people understand there is a larger problem to address, and thats violence against women? (you know, the part you dont want to understand)

We have a choice as a society to talk about this and condemn this. Or to turn our back and pretend it's not happening - as per... ahem... YOU.

Such piousness.

Ignore the greater problem.

[Oleg Bach]

That is a misnomer - "honour killings" - they kill because they have no real honour and don't have a clue about how to attain respect and honour. Respect is the transphere of power and a mutual transpherence back again - a contract with your fellows. Fools who will kill their own offspring and call it an honour generating act are nuts. Christ the corporate socialist once said..."the poor will always be with us" - stange saying - maybe he meant that the stupid will always be with us. Not much you can do about bad breeding...Islam may guide to a degree but it is not God and can not instill intelligence. To kill your own daughter or wife is blind crazed pride that is actually a horrific shame. And that is the truth - Christianity at one time was based on truth - no longer...nor is Islam and the rest of those duping human godless constructs that we foolishly endear with the title of religion. It's barbarism at it's worst.

[JerrySeinfeld]

You want to address muslims not violence against anyone else, so it is clear you have an agenda. Admit it and move on.You dont like them, we know.

That's so obtuse. When someone says something that might not be part of the accepted rhetoric just paint them with the "racist" brush. How predictable and lacking in complexity.

I don't like any aspect of religion which causes people to kill their daighters or wives.

That's a problem for you? That's pretty screwed up. You're so obsessed with "accepted policially correct language", you can't even see the absurdity of your argument.

...there is a larger problem to address, and thats violence against women? (you know, the part you dont want to understand)

This is another common problem with your ilk: you like to speak in empty, large platitudes (kind of like Obama) and use words like "hope", "diversity" etc.... or in this case, the "larger problem of violence against women" - without actually addressing specific REAL WORLD components of the problem.

If you were truly in favour of solving a "larger problem of violence against women" - you'd be willing to, without prejudice or a blind eye, look directly at a very clear and direct relationship between certain harder aspects of the muslim religion and the opression and violence against women.

[cybercoma]

All you lefties are so hot for the multi culti you don't even see that it's YOU that I'm targeting here - not muslims per se.

A major problem here isn't simlpy the behavior - ie. honour killings.

It's your reaction to them.

We have a choice as a society to talk about this and condemn this. Or to turn our back and pretend it's not happening - as per... ahem... YOU.

It's funny you should call me a lefty because all my lefty friends call me a CON.

We do have a choice to talk about this, but in your mind that's only if people are saying what you want them to say. I have condemned this killing and I condemn all violence towards women.

What I won't do is incorrectly broad-brush millions of people by saying it is because of Islam that this is happening. Some people, that incorrectly interpret Islam, may be using that as an excuse for the violence; however, that doesn't mean Islam is any more the reason for it than Christianity is the reason for an uberconservative father beating his wife or daughter for acting like a "slut".

The problem is the subjugation of women by men. That issue spans religions and cultural boundaries because until the last hundred years the entire history of western thought has held the belief that women are inferior. Women have been blamed for causing the fall of mankind since the book of Genesis was written. The word itself shows their status in society. Woman: The woe of man.

So, don't come on this forum, being a pedantic little twit saying that my reaction to violence against women is inappropriate. I have the same reaction to the violence as you. My only "fault", which is only considered so in your eyes, is that I understand it crosses cultural and religious lines and spans the entire course of history. I understand that women being beaten and abused is not exclusive to Muslim families. So, when I condemn the killings, I don't conveniently turn to bigotry and anti-immigration rhetoric to push an agenda. The source of this abuse comes from the very foundation of western society and the position that women have been put in by male dominated tradition.

Edited November 26, 2008 by cybercoma

[Oleg Bach]

It's none of your buisness what takes place in other cultures or other nations in regards to men - children and woman - Maybe the spoiled western feminist saviour of female kind should actually have a relationship with a man - and build a family...and have some real wealth and peace. BUT --------you are to busy minding other peoples buisness to have buisness of your own... The streets are full of YOU types who have given up on men and live with dogs as surrogate husbands...fix your own culture first. If you have not noticed - your culture will be extinct soon..because you failed to breed - and were to busy trying to inflict your de-breeding policy on others elsewhere.

[Oleg Bach]

That was offensive..nothing personal ...it just reminds me of my old aunt Martha that was so busy interfering with other families that she lost hers.

[cybercoma]

Who are you talking to and what the heck are you talking about?

Edited November 26, 2008 by cybercoma

[Oleg Bach]

Excuse awkward and unsophisticated overly enegetic me----I was just leaving....was talking to myself and enjoying it...self endulgent I guess..... BUT if you carefully followed the thread you might find a useful comment from the rustic one. Enjoy the rest of your day.

[guyser]

When someone says something that might not be part of the accepted rhetoric just paint them with the "racist" brush. How predictable and lacking in complexity.

Oh jerry,silly boy, where did I call you racist?

I don't like any aspect of religion which causes people to kill their daighters or wives.

Really? The why the (non) fact that you said it was only a muslim problem, and it is clear it isnt. Not to mention no correction by you .

That's a problem for you? That's pretty screwed up. You're so obsessed with "accepted policially correct language", you can't even see the absurdity of your argument.

Is violence against woman a problem for me? No, not really. I am a guy and dont abuse women in any way. It is however a problem for society.

Absurd is continuing down a path whereby you have been shown to be wrong, but I see it doesnt stop you. Go on, or....go back and edit your mistakes.

This is another common problem with your ilk: you like to speak in empty, large platitudes (kind of like Obama) and use words like "hope", "diversity" etc.... or in this case, the "larger problem of violence against women" - without actually addressing specific REAL WORLD components of the problem.

I suppose I could lie like you, but I dont. Not to mention I havent used the words hope and diversity.

Anymore things to tell me I didnt actually say or imply?

If you were truly in favour of solving a "larger problem of violence against women" - you'd be willing to, without prejudice or a blind eye, look directly at a very clear and direct relationship between certain harder aspects of the muslim religion and the opression and violence against women.

But I have jerry.

You are the one who wants it to be only a muslim fact, not a universal problem for women.

[GostHacked]

If you were truly in favour of solving a "larger problem of violence against women" - you'd be willing to, without prejudice or a blind eye, look directly at a very clear and direct relationship between certain harder aspects of the muslim religion and the opression and violence against women.

Oppression of women is not exclusive to Muslims. Check out your local women's shelter to get a better understanding.

[cybercoma]

That's actually a really good suggestion.

Edited November 26, 2008 by cybercoma

[Oleg Bach]

Oppression of women is not exclusive to Muslims. Check out your local women's shelter to get a better understanding.

My local woman shelter is quite quaint and quiet stupid. They should be teaching how to get along courses for the woman - and the men wandering outside in a crazed state should finally figure out that - The Family Service Act does not serve the family. To bad that these shelters were not staffed by non-bias individuals rather than by the shifty versions of Mother Teresa...It sure looks like the smart bosses in these shelters sure like having human females as pets and a hobby - the intelligence devide is huge between client and worker...OHH and I love the feel good drop off clothing that is on the door step everymorning - rags from rich people who "want to do their part" - It all reminds me of poor people battling it out over money and in doing so employ strangers funded by their own tax dollars.................................sure would like to see a cozy man's shelter for a change..staffed by good looking woman........My kids still laugh at the memory of me hiding in my bedroom chanting "I am abused" and I was...no shelter for me!

[JerrySeinfeld]

Oppression of women is not exclusive to Muslims. Check out your local women's shelter to get a better understanding.

Well, first of all, if a muslim man kills his daughter or wife, it's a pretty good chance she won't be showing up at a women's shelter any time soon.

Second, if you're truly in favor of reducing violence against women, you'd be open to exploring one of the root causes of violence against women. That includes the mysoginistic and oppressive tendancies of the more devout forms of Islam.

Walking down the street with placards chanting "stop violence against women" is an all too leftist concept citing problems without investigation causes or solutions.

Actually getting down into the reality of the various causes of that violence - including the acceptance of wife beating and honour killings in the fundamentalist wing of the Islamic faith, would be more genuine.

The issue here is that the left is so poised and ready with it's knee jerk "you don't like them" attitudes, that it is perversely completely willing to ignore the very real reality of muslim violence against women.

Edited November 26, 2008 by JerrySeinfeld

[M.Dancer]

Second, if you're truly in favor of reducing violence against women, you'd be open to exploring one of the root causes of violence against women. That includes the mysoginistic and oppressive tendancies of the more devout forms of Islam.

And if one was to tabulate the violence in Canada I'm sure muslim victims would be in the extreme minority. If you want to reduce the violence, concentrating all your efforts on one small community would be a tragic waste of time and energy.

[Oleg Bach]

No one can be oppressed unless they allow it. This goes for males and females. There are instances when a woman who could correct her oppressive and abusive husband does not because - to leave him in such an un-corrected stupid state gives her the balance of power...and she dominates the male though HIS stupid oppression. Also - to clarify - any man that attempts to oppress and abuse a woman is more than willing to oppress and dominate other males. This should be about human rights - not that dated and useless female rights dogma that has outlived it's usefulness. There was an anglo Christian in Toronto that killed his wife and both of his adult children - then himself.. This had nothing to do with Christianity or Islam - when it happens it happens - evil knows no cultural or religious boarders.