What do aboriginals want?

[Fain]

That is why we need a new constitution ; not and old colonial act pretending it's our constitution. Time to forget the past and plan for the future .

I would agree with this, it's too old a thing to encompass alot of the problems we're talking about.

[margrace]

4,000 native people were in the first world war and another 3000 were in the second world war. In 1922 The ministry for native affairs revoked any benefit to Native people in the war saying they were in the same position as before they enlisted.

Due to racist recruiters who demanded only those of pure European Descent aboriginals were once again denied any rights to the possibilities of commissions. After the war they were denied the rights given to non native soldiers.

One of the decorated Native Heroes said in Europe I was a Canadian when I came home I was just another dirty Indian. Not much wonder we have some problems is it.

[Borg]

4,000 native people were in the first world war and another 3000 were in the second world war. In 1922 The ministry for native affairs revoked any benefit to Native people in the war saying they were in the same position as before they enlisted.

Due to racist recruiters who demanded only those of pure European Descent aboriginals were once again denied any rights to the possibilities of commissions. After the war they were denied the rights given to non native soldiers.

One of the decorated Native Heroes said in Europe I was a Canadian when I came home I was just another dirty Indian. Not much wonder we have some problems is it.

Margrace

I refuse to apologize for my grandparents and what they did.

Those who serve are treated quite differently today.

If they want to go back to the reservation when they quit - up to them. But ..... do not give me the old "no respect" argument.

You either earn it or it goes elsewhere.

Lots of very, very successful indian military and biz types today. Strangely enough even they seem to avoid the reserve and the residents. I wonder if it has anything to do with the "poor me" mentality that is rampant and certainly encouraged on the reserve?

Or perhaps the drugs, cigs and liquor trades?

Or the rampant nepotism?

Or the "warrior class" lining their pockets?

Or the unequal distribution of benfits on the reserve?

Or the crooked elections?

Or the "on reservation" policing system and all of the inherent failures?

Or the criminally inept indian leaders that live in wealth while their bretheren live in poverty?

Or ..........

And the beat goes on.

We have problems because the indian is happy to create them and live in isolation rather than become a part of this country.

It is easier to blame someone else than it is to look in the mirror and state - "Time for me to get on with life and improve the lifestyle and health and benefits of my family.

Ok - everyone pile on now - time to beat up Borg for telling it like it is.

Borg

[no queenslave]

Margrace

I refuse to apologize for my grandparents and what they did.

Those who serve are treated quite differently today.

If they want to go back to the reservation when they quit - up to them. But ..... do not give me the old "no respect" argument.

You either earn it or it goes elsewhere.

Lots of very, very successful indian military and biz types today. Strangely enough even they seem to avoid the reserve and the residents. I wonder if it has anything to do with the "poor me" mentality that is rampant and certainly encouraged on the reserve?

Or perhaps the drugs, cigs and liquor trades?

Or the rampant nepotism?

Or the "warrior class" lining their pockets?

Or the unequal distribution of benfits on the reserve?

Or the crooked elections?

Or the "on reservation" policing system and all of the inherent failures?

Or the criminally inept indian leaders that live in wealth while their bretheren live in poverty?

Or ..........

And the beat goes on.

We have problems because the indian is happy to create them and live in isolation rather than become a part of this country.

It is easier to blame someone else than it is to look in the mirror and state - "Time for me to get on with life and improve the lifestyle and health and benefits of my family.

Ok - everyone pile on now - time to beat up Borg for telling it like it is.

Borg

It is all politics ; and the government wants it that way , we need your vote at election time so we will make promises to help you; and more promises next time. Are you happy?

All you got to do is compare the Huderight colonies attitude to most reserves; one is willing to work and the other is willing to believe everyone else owes them a living.

[Wild Bill]

I would agree with this, it's too old a thing to encompass alot of the problems we're talking about.

Not me! Canada had this discussion when Trudeau first started talking about constitutions and charters of rights.

The problem for some of us is that this is more of a "republic" thing than what we had as the descendants of a British constitutional monarchy. When you have as little as possible in document form the British tradition is that we are born with all rights inalienable, that the state can limit only in cases of clear and obvious necessity.

What Trudeau did was more of a (forgive me, some will take this the wrong way) French thing, in that you have such documents that spell out your rights but anything not specifically written down is NOT allowed until and unless the government says so!

The simple example used at the time was a "keep off the grass" analogy. Under the tradition of British common law, walk on any grass you like UNLESS there's a sign! The sign lets you know that it's private property and/or that particular patch of grass is protected for some reason.

Under the tradition of French and many other european countries, stay off ALL grass unless there's a sign that says it's ok!

This is a VERY significantly different approach to government and rights of citizenship! Myself, I've never been totally happy about what Trudeau did, especially for leaving out the right to property. Most important, the amending formulae to alter our Constitution and Charter as times change or as errors crop up is such that amendments are all but impossible to ever happen. To change anything requires such an impossible combination of provincial approval and legislation that in day to day reality it likely will never, ever happen! In effect, ours are carved in stone. The way they were written is the way they will always be, and we'll be liking it!

[no queenslave]

Not me! Canada had this discussion when Trudeau first started talking about constitutions and charters of rights.

The problem for some of us is that this is more of a "republic" thing than what we had as the descendants of a British constitutional monarchy. When you have as little as possible in document form the British tradition is that we are born with all rights inalienable, that the state can limit only in cases of clear and obvious necessity.

What Trudeau did was more of a (forgive me, some will take this the wrong way) French thing, in that you have such documents that spell out your rights but anything not specifically written down is NOT allowed until and unless the government says so!

The simple example used at the time was a "keep off the grass" analogy. Under the tradition of British common law, walk on any grass you like UNLESS there's a sign! The sign lets you know that it's private property and/or that particular patch of grass is protected for some reason.

Under the tradition of French and many other european countries, stay off ALL grass unless there's a sign that says it's ok!

This is a VERY significantly different approach to government and rights of citizenship! Myself, I've never been totally happy about what Trudeau did, especially for leaving out the right to property. Most important, the amending formulae to alter our Constitution and Charter as times change or as errors crop up is such that amendments are all but impossible to ever happen. To change anything requires such an impossible combination of provincial approval and legislation that in day to day reality it likely will never, ever happen! In effect, ours are carved in stone. The way they were written is the way they will always be, and we'll be liking it!

Http://www.detaxcanada.org/kuhl.htm

Their is nothing carved in stone by the sovereign canadian people; just a government who swear to obey and protect the Queen and her laws. Canada does not have a democracy., or a constitution.; but you think it does.

When did the people of Canada do what is required to have a democracy; as demonstrated by what was required to have a democracy in IRAQ , a constitution written by the people and ratified by the people by a referendum? NEVER.

WHY do you believe otherwise? Have you any documentation to support your belief ?

IF you tell a lie long enough the people will believe it and that is what happened in Canada., the government has told the lie you have a democracy and constitution for so long you believe it.

QUOTE "The Queen pays me to post...... I am not going to take any position contrary to the one I'm paid to take " by jbg

[capricorn]

, the government has told the lie you have a democracy and constitution for so long you believe it.

That's exactly what happened to me.

[no queenslave]

Http://www.detaxcanada.org/kuhl.htm

Their is nothing carved in stone by the sovereign canadian people; just a government who swear to obey and protect the Queen and her laws. Canada does not have a democracy., or a constitution.; but you think it does.

When did the people of Canada do what is required to have a democracy; as demonstrated by what was required to have a democracy in IRAQ , a constitution written by the people and ratified by the people by a referendum? NEVER.

WHY do you believe otherwise? Have you any documentation to support your belief ?

IF you tell a lie long enough the people will believe it and that is what happened in Canada., the government has told the lie you have a democracy and constitution for so long you believe it.

QUOTE "The Queen pays me to post...... I am not going to take any position contrary to the one I'm paid to take " by jbg

And the government uses paid posters to indoctrinate you to believe their dogmas.

[g_bambino]

I would agree with this, it's too old a thing to encompass alot of the problems we're talking about.

Replace it all-together? Jeez, talk about throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water.

[no queenslave]

Replace it all-together? Jeez, talk about throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water.

just like they did in IRAQ.

http://www.detaxcanada.org/kuhl.htm

Only it is an old brod not a baby.

[Fain]

Replace it all-together? Jeez, talk about throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water.

Haha i can understand how radical it came across. Replace all-together??? maybe not, perhap just add or remove some parts.

[kengs333]

4,000 native people were in the first world war and another 3000 were in the second world war. In 1922 The ministry for native affairs revoked any benefit to Native people in the war saying they were in the same position as before they enlisted.

Due to racist recruiters who demanded only those of pure European Descent aboriginals were once again denied any rights to the possibilities of commissions. After the war they were denied the rights given to non native soldiers.

One of the decorated Native Heroes said in Europe I was a Canadian when I came home I was just another dirty Indian. Not much wonder we have some problems is it.

I've always disagreed with this treatment; the most decorated Canadian in WWI was Francis Pegahmagabow, and Tommy Prince I believe was among the most decorated in WWII. Both were Ojibway. Both were treated disrespectfully despite all they did by the Canadian government, and recognition of they accomplished did not come until too late. I understand how this mistreatment has probably influenced in some way the continued resentment that some Natives have towards the government; but at the same time it needs to be recognized that this injustice is not something that many Canadians are now proud of. So what exactly does holding it against us and future generations of Canadians accomplish?

Incidently, it should be noted that Natives were not generally regarded in the same light as Blacks; Natives did usually serve in front line units, while Blacks did not. Not to lessen the discrimination that was inherant in the military, but still, there was a distinction.

[no queenslave]

Haha i can understand how radical it came across. Replace all-together??? maybe not, perhap just add or remove some parts.

remove the part that the country has a democracy.

Add a constitution written by the people and ratified by a vote of all the eligible voters.; instead of having the government doing whatever it thinks it can get away with..

read the supreme court case - refered to as the lord nelson hotel case- which ruled the constitution belonged to the people not the governments and only the people can chang it not the politicians.

as you see the government changed the constitution; disobeying the supreme court; but that is consistent with the operation of a dictatorship.