The New Improved Cannabis Poll

[buffycat]

I have been challenged by Shavluk to create a better poll and thread wrt Cannabis and Canadian Law.

Here it is.. my first poll.

[Amazing Atheist]

deleted

Edited November 3, 2007 by Charles Anthony
foul and obnoxious content

[M.Dancer]

True this poll is more lucid than the hop head's, but it is still worthless.

Why does decriminalization imply supplying the black market?

[Amazing Atheist]

True this poll is more lucid than the hop head's, but it is still worthless.

Why does decriminalization imply supplying the black market?

Decriminalization means that it no longer is a crime to use or possess small amounts. The loop hole here is that it is still illegal for legit private enterprise to grow or distribute. This results in the same people controlling the market as they do no while it is completely illegal.

In simple terms decriminalization of the plant only becomes not criminal for the users but remains illegal to produce and sell. Users of course who get caught would be getting fines instead of criminal records.

Cannabis is a 7 billion dollar a year industry currently controlled mostly by criminal organizations. If it were decriminalized today the industry would not change at all and in return supplying the black market with profits.

[old_bold&cold]

Why not add an option of Decriminalize 30 grams or less for personal possesion. But from government grown product only, and taxed at 50%.

If you add this I will then vote, as that is more in keeping with what the public would see being reasonable. I would also then like to see that the corts have direction that anyone on a third offence for selling or growing, must have the maximum sentence allowed by law.

[shavluk]

I have been challenged by Shavluk to create a better poll and thread wrt Cannabis and Canadian Law.

Here it is.. my first poll.

Whats wrt? with regards to? You talk about my writing?

I never challenged you about a poll and mine is about how you can really solve the problem.

Your poll has been done a thousand times in Canada and I myself was part of the Canadian Senate Hearings on drugs that resulted in their calling for cannabis legalization.

Have fun Buff I will be in the GREEN thread as polls are irelevent until you get the political power and the GREENS are the only real choice outside of Quebec because they are the only ones with ACTUAL POLICY and the GUTS to SPEAK about that policy!!!!.

I am curious as to what dana said to be deleted above? that atheist fellow hahhaha

Edited November 3, 2007 by shavluk

[Moxie]

If someone is caught with a small amount of pot I would be comfortable with them receiving a fine. I considered it to be equal to driving without a seatbelt, stupid and dangerous but hay we can't criminilized stupidity. YET. However if someone is in possession of more than what is deemed "Personal Use" then charge them with dealing drugs.

I use to believe it was harmless, then I became aquainted with a long time user. Shakes head, the guy was one brain cell smarter than a house plant. There is no doubt, in my opinion, long term pot usage causes brain cell damage, I doubt the habitual users would notice the change in their cognitive ability because of their pot use.

There is so much in Canada that needs to be addressed, the rapid deteriation of our health care system is an issue that is important to me. The homeless, the mentally ill, etc. Legalizing pot is right up their with Mercury Light Bulbs. Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.

[shavluk]

Definitely made me much smarter , much more aware , a much better human being.

It also made me a millionaire and helped me establish a real estate sales record 23 months long and never beaten to this day.

Your opinion is just going to cause more pain and violence but as you only seem to be about you it wouldn't matter.

[Moxie]

Definitely made me much smarter , much more aware , a much better human being.

It also made me a millionaire and helped me establish a real estate sales record 23 months long and never beaten to this day.

Your opinion is just going to cause more pain and violence but as you only seem to be about you it wouldn't matter.

Pain and suffering to whom? The victims in car accidents from people on pot? Families who watch their children go down the road to skid row after moving on to hard drugs? Violence, video tape yourself the next time your high. At the very least you shall see what a fool you appear to those who aren't high.

Those who usually brag about being rich and successful on the net usually turn out to be short bald men who still live with their mamma. They do shift work as a dishwasher. Nothing wrong with that lifestyle, just admit it.

[buffycat]

name='shavluk'

Whats wrt? with regards to? You talk about my writing?

wrt = with respect to/with regards to It's pretty common. I do find your method of expression to be quite hard to follow sometimes. Though your message wrt legalisation is a good one, I think you'd have greater success in your debates if you could perhaps be a little more succint and clear about what you are stating. Nothing personal, Shavluk.

I never challenged you about a poll and mine is about how you can really solve the problem.

In effect you challenged me to start my own thread (page 18 in the Green thread). The poll was my idea since the one in your thread makes no sense whatsoever.

I am curious as to what dana said to be deleted above? that atheist fellow hahhaha

It was a joke. It was kinda gross, but harmlessly funny.

[shavluk]

Pain and suffering to whom? The victims in car accidents from people on pot? Families who watch their children go down the road to skid row after moving on to hard drugs? Violence, video tape yourself the next time your high. At the very least you shall see what a fool you appear to those who aren't high.

Those who usually brag about being rich and successful on the net usually turn out to be short bald men who still live with their mamma. They do shift work as a dishwasher. Nothing wrong with that lifestyle, just admit it.

***EDIT TO ADD QUOTE

Sorry to burst your bubble little one ,but you can Google me.

Its pretty clear your mind set and seemingly poor quality of life and world.

No need for me to waste my time like others will here with you.

I am 6'2" , 250 pounds , trained to kill in ways that would astound you.

You can see me here in the 2005 election campaign from minute 5:30 to 11:30

http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-3687.html

I have nothing to hide especially to disabled types like some here.

In real life you would probably be a coward with and about my views , I would bet dollars to donuts!!!

You and your mind set based on my years of study will only produce further disappointments for some one like you thankfully.

Have fun ,,

but remember karma is a bitch

Edited November 4, 2007 by shavluk

[Amazing Atheist]

Why not add an option of Decriminalize 30 grams or less for personal possesion. But from government grown product only, and taxed at 50%.

Then it would be legalization....

The government tried to grow pot for it's medical marijuana program and ended up producing an unsafe product in an abandoned mine in Flin Flon.

In my opinion people should have the right to grow under 2 lights for personal and industrial growing should be done so by farmers and private enterprise. This would really expand the job market and create an entirely new cash crop. Economically it is a far more wise decision not to let the government control Cannabis growing 100%. Although I do agree that regulation is a key component of any type of legalization.

If you add this I will then vote, as that is more in keeping with what the public would see being reasonable. I would also then like to see that the corts have direction that anyone on a third offence for selling or growing, must have the maximum sentence allowed by law.

The same laws in regards to growing tobacco have been reasonably successful and should be used as a model for the regulation of Cannabis. You can grow w/o a license for personal use but must get a license for industrial growing and selling. Personal grows don't hurt the market just as personal tobacco grows don't hurt the tobacco industry.

I am curious as to what dana said to be deleted above? that atheist fellow hahhaha

If you must know I cracked a joke that the mods found inappropriate. Also I am not Dana in fact I don't even live in BC I live in Winnipeg.... Stop calling me Dana please.

I got a PM for the mod about making accusations etc and I'm sure at your request, yet here you are calling me Dana when I am in fact not Dana... A little hypocritical don't ya think.

Have fun Buff I will be in the GREEN thread as polls are irelevent until you get the political power and the GREENS are the only real choice outside of Quebec because they are the only ones with ACTUAL POLICY and the GUTS to SPEAK about that policy!!!!.

Seeing as how the Green Party will never win a federal election or at least not in your life time why should people support them. They can't apply any real pressure to the federal government. Legalizing pot is also not the only issue most voters will vote for either I know while it is an issue I do care about it's not the only issue I care about.

John your not a dumb guy and you could be a force to be reckoned with if you get your shit together. Politics should not be about slamming other parties and people who disagree with you. It should be about stating you policy and why it's better for the people. I have no personal disregard for you or the party in fact i voted green last election however not because of their pot policy but because of their environmental policy.

The green party policies are not my problem and neither are you really as your not even in my province. My problem with the green party is that they can't win an election.

Unlike most I will not vote on any single issue there are several issues I will be voting on this time from the war all the way to health care and global warming.

If someone is caught with a small amount of pot I would be comfortable with them receiving a fine. I considered it to be equal to driving without a seatbelt, stupid and dangerous but hay we can't criminilized stupidity. YET. However if someone is in possession of more than what is deemed "Personal Use" then charge them with dealing drugs.

You know if pot was legal there would be no such charge for selling pot because most of the people selling pot now would be out of business just like Al Capone and other went out of business at the end of alcohol prohibition.

I use to believe it was harmless, then I became aquainted with a long time user. Shakes head, the guy was one brain cell smarter than a house plant. There is no doubt, in my opinion, long term pot usage causes brain cell damage, I doubt the habitual users would notice the change in their cognitive ability because of their pot use.

You can't say that was caused by pot... It has been proven that pot has no lasting effects on the brain and it also does not harm the brain either.

Like I've said before most people would never even think I smoke pot on a regular basis. To use one unintelligent guy as a basis for criminalization and then lump us all in with him is just wrong.

There is so much in Canada that needs to be addressed, the rapid deteriation of our health care system is an issue that is important to me. The homeless, the mentally ill, etc. Legalizing pot is right up their with Mercury Light Bulbs.

Well the taxes collected from pot could go into the health care system, help the homeless and help the mentally ill.

[Guest trex]

There is so much in Canada that needs to be addressed, the rapid deteriation of our health care system is an issue that is important to me. The homeless, the mentally ill, etc. Legalizing pot is right up their with Mercury Light Bulbs. Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.

Not really because of the number of people in jail. No comparison there. Some of them are young people who carry the stigma of criminality with them forever, sort of like an extra-curricular form of punishment. Simply put, it don't end with jail. If they did two years less a day, they are still ex-cons with a record for life.

I also know someone who smoked pot for over 30 years, and still does. He started when he was 13 years old. But this individual is not at all like the person you know, he is a successful manager with a nice family. He is well known and respected in his community and workplace. Come to think of it he does charity work too, but he smokes pot. So we can conclude that, the effect of this drug is not certain to cause harm on all people. Yet my inmpression of an alcohol abuser on the same scale as this guy would be more harmful indeed, to the liver and possibly to the brain. So you see there's no golden rule when it comes to human diversity, but moderation of substance is always wise.

I still say, for substance abuse the punishment does not fit the crime, if there should be a punishment at all for just putting a chemical in your body. I vote for full legalization.

Edited November 3, 2007 by trex

[buffycat]

If someone is caught with a small amount of pot I would be comfortable with them receiving a fine. I considered it to be equal to driving without a seatbelt, stupid and dangerous but hay we can't criminilized stupidity. YET. However if someone is in possession of more than what is deemed "Personal Use" then charge them with dealing drugs.

How would this amount of 'personal' use be defined? What of those who use it for medical purposes?

I use to believe it was harmless, then I became aquainted with a long time user. Shakes head, the guy was one brain cell smarter than a house plant. There is no doubt, in my opinion, long term pot usage causes brain cell damage, I doubt the habitual users would notice the change in their cognitive ability because of their pot use.

Anecdotal and proves nothing as you don't state what else this individual may have done, which could be a contributing factor. Perhaps he was just as stupid to start off with. Perhaps he drank like a fish, or fried his brain with chemicals. IOW proves nothing.

There is so much in Canada that needs to be addressed, the rapid deteriation of our health care system is an issue that is important to me. The homeless, the mentally ill, etc. Legalizing pot is right up their with Mercury Light Bulbs. Yawnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn.

Well, I look at it this way: Since illegal drugs are fueling the black markets and all the crime and corruption that goes along with it, such as gang wars, theft and extortion, pollution of the courts and police, the easiest way to cut off the 'funds' would be outright legalisation, top notch education and enforced regulation for distribution.

I guess the problem then would be what to do with all the unemployed criminals. Oh well - they can become politicians I suppose

The so-called Drug War is a mirror for other things too. It exposes the lies which are flagrantly lobbed about by our elected talking heads - no different than the lies in the War on Terror. I think when one sees the lies and propoganda about the first - it's far easier to spot it wrt other things.

Strange all these Wars on Nouns.. which always end up with the problem getting worse.

[shavluk]

To dana, or who ever ,, hahha

You have twin here in BC.

I will only go into this one more time because every vote does now count , thanks Chretien!!

I spent 30 years with the ndp 4 years formally in and on both their provincial and federal executives , spoke to layton 20 times , raised the first cannabis resolution and all of the stuff already mentioned in the Green thread,,,its all true ,all real and I HONESTLY tell you that if you vote ndp instead of Green you are a traitor to yourself as well as us!!!

It takes policy , layton is a liar even the liberals are doing more than him.

The GREENS will win seats , I will bet all of you on it!

Until the election your discrimination based on not being as involved as some one like me with the ndp is only your opinion like mine is.

I think that any that are involved politically are rather disgustingly rude because they CAN!! confirm for themselves every thing I have said with in their own parties and they are not obviously !!

and until they do ,,they should realize I think them dunces as when they do discover I am right and it has everything to do with fear and old school politics , they will arrive like I did at the total hypocrisy of all the old parties,,its bullshit ,,if you guys would have been at the ndp convention you would have been utterly disgusted as well just what a lying hypocrite layton really is.

No I wish I had better grammar then I would do better at explaining or sharing , as to me I am not doing this for any other reasons than what I have stated(My framing by police using a harmless substance and my education of this issue because of it)

In the end you will only help me by yes may be getting on your own parties to correct their lies.

You talk about our not having seats and I say again the biggest issue in this country is being dealt with now because of us!! (environment and the mass sale of green ties to all politicians)and the last major issue was solved by us as well !!(same sex marriage) and we STILL DONT EVEN HAVE A SEAT YET !! ,see the forest for the trees,,,WATCH AFTER THIS NEXT ELECTION WHEN WE ACTUALLY DO HAVE A SEAT OR 2 !!!!!!!

Now based even on your view and without winning seats it still works people !!,stating our issues (like Afghanistan ,cannabis , mulroney inquiry , etc)and pulling big vote numbers from the other parties ,, well even if it looks like just a protest vote , it still results in our issues being the big choice issues the rest all then make (squeaky wheel gets the grease)

I know what we are doing will work ,,for all of us , I don't fail at my strategies and have accomplished some things most would because of their weak self esteem never believe.

[Moxie]

Pain and suffering to whom? The victims in car accidents from people on pot? Families who watch their children go down the road to skid row after moving on to hard drugs? Violence, video tape yourself the next time your high. At the very least you shall see what a fool you appear to those who aren't high.

Those who usually brag about being rich and successful on the net usually turn out to be short bald men who still live with their mamma. They do shift work as a dishwasher. Nothing wrong with that lifestyle, just admit it.

***EDIT TO ADD QUOTE

Sorry to burst your bubble little girl ,but you can Google me.

Sorry to burst you drug induced bubble son but It's the internet. I am the queen of England. Google that.

Its pretty clear your mind set and seemingly poor quality of life and world.

No need for me to waste my time like others will here with you.

LOL get real attacking my education is a smoke screen, most of us who went to University did so for the degree not POT. Yet you wasted your time by putting out your dobbie and responding. Hypocrite sandwich anyone.

I am 6'2" , 250 pounds , trained to kill in ways that would astound you.

You can see me in movies or TV shows from the 90's like Xfiles , commish ,sliders,ms bear etc

or here in election campaigns from minute 5:30 to 11:30

Really that's nice I'm five two and well a hundred pounds soaking wet, what has that to with the issue of legalized pot and the victims it leaves in it's wake.

http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-3687.html

I have nothing to hide especially to disabled types like some here.

Jesus wept that sentence denotes the very reason pot should remain illegal, how many fingers am I holding up?

In real life you would be a coward with and about my views , I would bet dollars to donuts!!!

You and your mind based on my years of study will only produce further disappointments for you thankfully.

Have fun ,,

but remember karma is a bitch

In real life your sentence would make sense, but it doesn't. What's with the mention of donuts got the munchies? AGAIN, you are already fifthy pounds overweight drop the donut lad.

My mindset has seen what drugs do the people who ingest them, I've seen the tattered pieces of the soul of a junkie. I've seen the lives that drugs distroy, you can glorify the hell that families of drug addicts suffer but the mere fact that your days are spent sprending your drug induced propaganda speaks for it's self. You are a addict, you need help.

[shavluk]

Hahahhahahahahhahha

Some else can try to educate you as you are tooooo small minded for me to bother.

We are all addicts by the way , to something or other.

I am at least honest enough to admit what I do and I can tell you I am addicted to cigarettes before I would ever say I am with cannabis and I am trying to state real reasons with real data and you just seem to be a negative person stuck in a harmful mindset.

Thankfully my group is the majority so far

Edited November 4, 2007 by shavluk

[Amazing Atheist]

In real life your sentence would make sense, but it doesn't. What's with the mention of donuts got the munchies? AGAIN, you are already fifthy pounds overweight drop the donut lad.

My mindset has seen what drugs do the people who ingest them, I've seen the tattered pieces of the soul of a junkie. I've seen the lives that drugs distroy, you can glorify the hell that families of drug addicts suffer but the mere fact that your days are spent sprending your drug induced propaganda speaks for it's self. You are a addict, you need help.

A little harsh don't ya think?

I could argue that everyone here not only uses drugs for medicinal purposes but for recreation and in many cases don't even know they are taking a drug.

All a drug really is, is a foreign chemical or chemicals that alter the bodies functions. This being said not all drugs are the same. For example no one denies that Alcohol, Heroin and Cocaine all have and do destroy lives and even kill people.

Pot however has not destroyed my life nor am I an addict as I quit from time to time to keep my bodies resistance down. Most pot smokers are casual smokers using on weekends and at parties etc.

There are many legal drugs that destroy lives as well as illegal ones but not all drugs destroy lives and this is really the issue.

[Moxie]

Amazing I wasn't refer to the week-end reefers or recreational users, I was directly rebuttaling his pot induced illusions of grander. I've stated before I don't think it should be a criminal offense but a finable offense if you are caught with amounts that equate personal use.

I have a nephew who uses pot daily please don't partonize me with it "Isn't harmful", this kid use to be a genius and he's now a babbling idiot. He's only 26 and he lives for his next puff, pot like alcohol if abused is harmful.

[Amazing Atheist]

Amazing I wasn't refer to the week-end reefers or recreational users, I was directly rebuttaling his pot induced illusions of grander. I've stated before I don't think it should be a criminal offense but a finable offense if you are caught with amounts that equate personal use.

I have a nephew who uses pot daily please don't partonize me with it "Isn't harmful", this kid use to be a genius and he's now a babbling idiot. He's only 26 and he lives for his next puff, pot like alcohol if abused is harmful.

Pot does not kill brain cells or harm the brain this has been proven through irrefutable scientific study. If your nephew isn't a genius now he never was, tons of smart people smoke weed on a daily basis.

Your nephews problem isn't that he smokes pot but his addictive personality. Pot itself is not physically addictive he suffers from his own psychological addiction to the drug.

[shavluk]

Sounds to me like you have more problems then your nephew and at least he is on the right track with his choice of help or certainly of no harm.

You sound just like an alcohol abuser full of guilt and an unearned sanctimonious attitude

[old_bold&cold]

Pot does not kill brain cells or harm the brain this has been proven through irrefutable scientific study. If your nephew isn't a genius now he never was, tons of smart people smoke weed on a daily basis.

Ypu are completely wrong and you quote things that you know nothing about. The studies that the pot heads seem to always to quoting are ones where scientists were searching for Medicinal use of the drug. They never have looked at the long term affects of abuse. They will also state that there are obvious problems with the build up over time with daily use, that cause mental and co-ordination problems. But they never did their studies for the purpose that you and others quote them, and you only quote them in part, because the whole studies which have hundreds of pages and conclusions, do not sit well with your arguments. If you have never seen a pot head burn out before then you are just kidding yourself.

Your nephews problem isn't that he smokes pot but his addictive personality. Pot itself is not physically addictive he suffers from his own psychological addiction to the drug.

See what pot does to people even with mild use, it makes them think they are not affected by it, and anyone who is must have some other mental deffect. Well you only need to look around and see what can happen after these people go to rehab and after years get some life back. They may even drink some, but in moderation. That just blows the shit out of your addictive personality now does it not. When I was young I smoked pot and all it ever did was put me to sleep. It was not very great and I never saw the need for. The same can be said for my drinking as I pretty much gave that up after university. I now have a drink maybe 5-6 times a year, and maybe more when travelling in the carribean. But that is it. I used to smoke but also gave that up. So am I an unaddicting personality?

As I said earlier that this pole does not ask any of the questions other then what a pot head wants to hear, and is geared that way. Legalise for 30 grams to be bought from goverment grown pot, and taxed 50%. Anyone caugght with black market pot, should be charged and fined $500 for first offence and go up from there. If above 30 grams then criminal record and all the law will allow should be taken into play as the judge sees fit. Why is that type of option not in the header for the vote?

[shavluk]

Because its stupid.

Same as the others times you have said it.

Another sanctimonious type?

Why is all this crap coming from you with AGAIN no back up links , and spread like this?

It's so important to you just because you know we know you obviously didn't get cannabis when you tried it?

I am flattered your kind maybe just doesn't get it.

It takes a certain level of human to maybe get the effects of cannabis as it doesn't work on rocks for example hahha

And then you go around saying its some bad thing ,,

then after all that ,,you just and finally admit all it did was put you to sleep.

I rest my case with you.

Edited November 4, 2007 by shavluk

[old_bold&cold]

You are just jealous because people know you are really an idiot, and have the mental ability of a tomatoe. You are tolerated here, just so we can all show we do not discriminate against the insane.

Have you ever tried to follow your posts, when you are sober. You rant and rave about how you are 6' 2' etc., when you really are just a flabby useless tool. No one would be afriad of you, and because of the way you act insane all the time, some one shooting you, is a real possibility. You can have the green party for your area, but even you know that you will not fget much when a vote happens, and that no one here would ever vote for you, unless they wanted to pull a joke about it. Those reading here will see your posts and just not vote green anywhere. So that must be something that the Green Party is aware of.

You have made yourself to be all the things people hate, in politics and the green will loose more vote by their association with you, then you could ever bring to them. Maybe if you learned even a small amount of diplomacy, then you would not be as much of a weight for the Greens to bear. Until then you are nothing but a waste of bandwidth.

[shavluk]

You are just jealous because people know you are really an idiot, and have the mental ability of a tomatoe. You are tolerated here, just so we can all show we do not discriminate against the insane.

Have you ever tried to follow your posts, when you are sober. You rant and rave about how you are 6' 2' etc., when you really are just a flabby useless tool. No one would be afriad of you, and because of the way you act insane all the time, some one shooting you, is a real possibility. You can have the green party for your area, but even you know that you will not fget much when a vote happens, and that no one here would ever vote for you, unless they wanted to pull a joke about it. Those reading here will see your posts and just not vote green anywhere. So that must be something that the Green Party is aware of.

You have made yourself to be all the things people hate, in politics and the green will loose more vote by their association with you, then you could ever bring to them. Maybe if you learned even a small amount of diplomacy, then you would not be as much of a weight for the Greens to bear. Until then you are nothing but a waste of bandwidth.

***** QUOTE

some one shooting you, is a real possibility*****

Wanted to make sure I had this quote copied!!

Thank you , thank you very much ,,Elvis has left the building.

That ladies and gentle men was a demonstration of the fine art of the slow burn,,,,,,, the specimen is beside himself with uncontrollable rage as the effects of well placed words exploded in the subjects cranium without his blessing,,,,for my next trick ,,,,hahhahhaha

What we have here folks is a certifiable threat by a certifiable lunatic who has been badly bested by a so called pot head ! hahhahahhahaha

You Sir are as I said quickly becoming one of my favorites!

Fill your boots Mr "no self esteem has to revert to violent threats ass"!

Take your best shot!

You really are a wretched human being.

I will think of you as I continue to sign up new GREEN Party members most who used to be conservatives , fortunately not the kind of conservative your extinct line comes from.

I am a tad flabby as anyone can calculate(i cook for my wife) but that's only a facade and I am actually quite solid under my padding and I promise I am strong enough and will be strong enough to still rip the heart out of the one stupid enough to take a shot at me or mine.

They can die with me.

You certainly have me convinced I am on the right track just by your delusional rants.

Next!