Wild Bill

You know, I'm not saying that the Tories might not be guilty. I don't think it likely but after all, they're politicians, for Pete's sake! I just find it hilarious to hear Liberals accuse OTHERS of scandal!

It's a lot harder to generate scandal against the Tories than the Liberals. Liberal supporters will have to knock themselves out to make this one stick. It was much easier for the Tories when they were in opposition. Adscam, Shawinigate...these were REAL scandals!

Maybe. Although why they'd pay when they've already seen how Six Nations has internal leadership issues is beyond me. Why would you pay extortion when it's already been demonstrated that a different group with a leadership claim would denounce the one who took your money and then either want more money or more likely, the DEVELOPED land? No, that would not be good business. Anyway, time will tell if this is fact or propaganda. I live by Hamilton, ON, and I stll remember how protesters for an expressway project "salted" the site with a few arrowheads in hopes of getting it declared a historic native site to block the project. These people run on faith. If you have faith then any means is perfectly justified to achieve your "noble" end. It's called "situational ethics", which means you can't trust their word because if they feel it's important enough they will cheerfully break any deal to achieve their goal. If YOU ran a company that paid this extortion I wouldn't expect to sell much public stock afterwards. Any investor would drop you like a hot potato.

I'm sure this question must have been asked before but I've never heard the answer. What if that "opague bag" contained a severed head? Or something equally serious?

Ah, but the purpose served by an RCMP investigation would NOT be to uncover the truth! It would be to stage a circus, long and drawn out, to discredit the ruling Tories. The Liberals are desperate to involve the Tories in any and all scandals, to any degree. The strategy seems to be that if they heap enough manure on their enemy people will stop smelling the Adscam scandal on themselves. This is politics, not law, after all. Why do you think this whole incident was revealed immediately before a likely call to an election? There certainly would not have been an offer for an uncontested nomination. Chuck and the whole world knew he was dying and would never last long enough. It MAY have been possible that Chuck was out of pocket for campaign expenses dating back to the time of his nomination, before he was forced to run as an independent. There may have been an offer to resolve a dispute. This is done all the time by all parties, such as when a party leader needs a seat and they bump out an incumbent from a "safe" riding. There are real financial losses to such an act and compensation is a standard approach. No, more and more it looks to me like one of those stories that have just enough truth to generate a great deal of embarrassing political reaction for a long enough period of time to affect electoral fortunes. The Liberals are past masters at this game. In my own riding last election there was a great deal of lingering animosity from the Sheila Copps camp over Tony Valeri beating her for the Liberal nomination. She had promised to help his opponents. A story conveniently broke implying that he had committed some sort of illegality or bad faith in a house purchase, A WEEK BEFORE THE ELECTION! After the election, details came out that showed it was no big deal. Except to Tony, who had lost by a narrow margin.

The "cons" did not take him back! He was sitting as an independent at the time all this came down. What had happened was that Chuck was a member of the Reform/Alliance party from before it morphed into the new Conservative Party. He was very popular and had won his seat handily. I could be mistaken but I believe he had won in more than one election term. Anyhow, an ethnic group in his riding had decided to pull a traditional Liberal trick and swamp the riding nomination meeting to sweep in their candidate. This was easy to do under the old Reform/Alliance tradition of open nominations where the candidate had to get voted in by the local riding members. Liberals usually just appoint their candidates, perhaps to prevent this sort of thing, to give them the benefit of the doubt. Anyhow, all these new members filled up the hall and presto! Cadman the incumbent MP was out and the ethnic group's man won the nomination to run as a Tory for the riding. Unfortunately for this group, while they were feeling all smug with themselves for pulling off such a trick Chuck and the riding committee held their own meeting. They were pretty certain that Chuck's electoral support came as much or more from his own personal appeal as that of the party. So they all quit and helped Chuck run as an independent. The tricksters found themselves without any experienced campaigners. Chuck won handily and they went down in flames. Afterwards the Tories didn't really care about Chuck, other than a few expressions of sympathy for his shabby treatment. After all, he was an independent and in Canada that means you're a TOTAL nobody in Parliament! Then came a crucial confidence vote, where the Tories needed every single vote they could get, including those from independents! Both the Liberals and the Tories courted Chuck. The Tories reminded him he was once one of their own. For the most part Chuck had voted with them before. The Liberals no doubt made mention of the shabby way he was forced out of the party. All the reporters were all over the situation, with their pens poised over their notepads. Chuck kept quiet until the very last minute. Finally, Chuck announced that in true Reform tradition he was voting as per the wishes of the majority of his riding's constituents. That meant against the Tories! Personally, I was hoping he'd go the other way but I couldn't help but admire his integrity! He held true to one of the strongest planks of the Reform platform. As an MP his job was not to do what his party wanted but to do what his VOTERS wanted! He was a hero, plain and simple. Contrast his actions with those of all the trained seals in Parliament today. They'd all vote to serve tainted meat if their party whip told them to!

I've been wondering if with a handle like Angus Thermopyle you're a scifi fan? If so, we probably both appreciate the philosophy of the book "Starship Troopers" and HATED the movie! Anyhow, I'm glad to be corrected that the weapons we give are troops are better than I had thought. Both of them! Now, if only we could stop sending them to Afghanistan along with Arctic cammo...

Geez JD, you're like a starving dog on a bone. You just won't give up! The whole story is obviously fishy yet you keep talking about the consequences of it being true! Occam's Razor! By any chance, you're not a habitue of http://www.rense.com ?

I find it interesting that you only quoted the first paragraph of my post! Time will tell if the rest of my argument bears merit. It seems to me that the present CPC is playing a similar game to that of Mulroney's crew years ago. Limiting voter choices. The Tories back then were not a strong conservative or populist party in action or philosophy but who else could you vote for? This is why when Manning came out of the wilderness in an amazingly short span of time Reform had whittled the Conservatives down to a tiny rump of their former strength and had made strong inroads into Ontario, getting up to over a million votes. Any marketing man understands that limiting customer choices is a dangerous game. It only works as long as the market situation stays stable. Customers know what's happening and even though they still buy your product they tend to resent it. The first time they are given an attractive alternative they are GONE! Reform and Alliance voters tended to vote out of genuine inspiration and agreement with party philosophy. This bunch seems to have abandoned their old core in their greed for the middle. They act as if they can do this with impunity. Perhaps they're right. Time will tell. Meanwhile, I've got a bottle of good scotch up for a bet with a friend that the present CPC someday might find itself learning the same lesson as the Mulroney party.

Hey, you may be right. I hope it never comes to it but if it all happens it's possible things would play out the way you paint it. I'm just saying that your argument is based on logic and principles. What has that got to do with our politicians? In a shoving match between the BQ/PQ and Ottawa Canada would need a government willing to stand up for the rest of us. It's a bit of a stretch but I could see Harper as sort of a Churchill - the best choice for a wartime PM. At least, better than anyone the Liberal party would ever offer! The thought of Dion standing between us and the lions gives me the willies...

It's interesting though how such stuff can stick so easily to Harper's present party. When Cadman was being courted for his vote the party was still Reformer/Alliance guys running the show. These people were more like Cadman himself in their character. The idea of Reformers being so sleazy was really a stretch. With so much grassroots power in that party anyone who tried would have been hooted out of the meeting hall. Cadman himself was the living personification of such standards. Even if someone had been stupid enough to try to bribe him it would have shown that first, they had no idea of his values and second, they had no idea of how easily their actions would have come out within such a party and how strong the counter-reaction would have been. Today however, Harper's crew seems to have totally thrown all Reform/Alliance party history down the memory hole. We never even hear those names mentioned anymore. Nothing of their party principles, those Blue Book party platform planks, the ideas of grassroots input and recall - it's all never to be mentioned again! The party today seems a carbon copy of Mulroney's party. Mulroney is venerated as an "elder statesman". Preston Manning is "The One Whose Name Must Not Be Spoken!". When the parties merged who would have thought the tiny, fantastically broke and in debt rump of the old Tory party would wind up running the show. The price proved higher than first thought. The new party has only itself to blame for courting Mulroney and then being struck by some of his mud in the Schrieber scandal. Or even this feeble attempt to build something sleazy on Chuck Cadman's memory. By erasing the disconnect of all those years of Reform there's no public sense that today's Tories are NOT the same party as Mulroney's! Considering that Mulroney might arguably be the most reviled PM in generations in the court of public opinion perhaps Harper now realizes his mistake in accepting all those old Conservative advisers into his couterie...

Why? This is a political situation and not a legal one. What if Quebec just unilaterally refused to pay its true or fair share of its debts? Or used its own biased calculations? Send in the army? Our guys are great but I doubt if we have enough of them. Besides, you can buy better guns in Crappy Tire than we tend to give to our troops. Certainly newer! What makes you think our government would actually do it? We won't send in troops to Caledonia. We're gonna send them into Quebec? And how many troops, officers and guns are from Quebec? Where would their allegiance lie? The real problems would come later. I agree that Quebec would suffer a huge economic hit. People don't understand that much of the BQ/PQ came from the NDP. These guys were just wannabes until the independence issue arose. They got in front of the parade and ended up in real power but they're still NDP at heart. They are emotional thinkers, not logical. The last science class they took was when their bean sprouts died in that jar full of toilet paper. They had already dropped math the year before. So you're wasting your time with appeals to their head. Separation comes solely from the heart. That being said, if Quebec achieved separation they would rapidly find out that you can't dodge reality. As Parizeau once said: "lobsters in the pot"! They would immediately have to deal with cheezy, mundane details like money. At first they would try to run on however much they managed to get from Canada. That wouldn't last forever, of course. It's not likely these folks would know how to make Quebec's economy strong and self-sustaining. So they would have only one choice. Try to extort more from Canada! Tolls or even blockades on the TransCanada Highway. Excessive fees for use of the St. Laurence waterway. Breaking long term contracts with other provinces for power and energy to impose immediate new prices. Am I exaggerating? Perhaps. Remember however, one can immediately recognize the word "politician" in either English or French spelling.

It really is beginning to look like the Indian Act was written and administered for years by the worst sort of socialist "white-assed liberals"! The negative consequences of their impractical, idealistic methods of social engineering are plain for anyone to see today. If one is surprised at a bad outcome to their argument they should check their initial premises. The Indian Act seems to be one giant, super size bad premise.

Someone found an insurance company willing to give a million dollar policy to a dying man? Sound, prudent financial whizzes running that company! Probably refugees from Enron or Northern Telecom. Good gravy! This is indeed amazing! Perhaps they also have found the plans to that 200 mile per gallon carburetor we've been searching for all these years...

I had heard once that one of the innumerable problems with the Indian Act is that natives cannot hold clear title to property on the reserve. This means that getting a mortgage or a major loan for property on or stored on the reserve is a problem, since a loaner would have no claim to any collateral. Perhaps one of our lawyer posters could chime in. (Having said that last bit, why am I thinking of Phil Hartman on Saturday Night Live?)

Are they? Consider what the native lawyer spokesman actually said. 10 developers have paid fees. He didn't name any of them. They could be native developers, for all we know. Or "virtual developers" made up of militant native protestors who have never actually driven a bulldozer or hammered in a nail. Wait a month or two for spring. If these are real developers when the ground thaws and dries we'll see construction begin. There should be signs posted with company names and contact information. Me, frankly I don't buy it. I just can't see how any true business would commit large sums of investment money into such a dodgy situation, particularly if they were a public corporation. Would YOU invest by buying shares in a company that intended to develop on disputed lands? Would YOU have confidence in a return on your investment 20 years down the road? Perhaps you're more trusting. I wouldn't! I wouldn't trust any company that had principals who were involved with Enron and I wouldn't trust any institution like HDI that grew from a militant protest movement. Might as well invest on the Gaza Strip. It would just be irresponsible. I CAN see why it is important to the natives that the world BELIEVE that developers are willing to trust and deal with them! If they get us to believe there are 10 then perhaps they also think that 10 more will come forth and actually give them not just their money but some credibility. Remember the old folk story about "Stone Soup"?

Denial? I'm in no denial! And I certainly don't consider myself part of a clan, except in the loosest historical sense. Yet I'm pink. You claim to know what ALL of us think! I guess that makes as much sense as me claiming I know what ALL red folks think! I certainly haven't met them all. After Caledonia I'm in no hurry. What have the Six Nations tribes done since 1756 or so? Borrowed a lot of technology from the pink guys, it would seem. So what? What matters is what have YOU done! Thinking of yourself as part of a tribe first is what holds you back. You have little or no control over what your tribe does or does not do. You have far more control over what YOU do! Graham Greene started off as a roady for some BIG time Canadian bands! Then he became an actor. A damn good one, it would seem! Don't recall ever hearing about any acting school on a reserve. He obviously didn't rely on his tribe. He relied on himself. If Derek Miller was still waiting for a native to invent the electric guitar and amp he'd never have become the fabulous bluesman he is today. Tribalism is dead, man. It only worked when all we had to deal with was the bears in the woods. It's still a good way for some clown to weasel his way into power and con all his neighbours into beating up the folks on the other side of the hill. Or at least giving him the nicest house. Your tribe's history has no claim on you if you don't let it. Or just pick and choose what you want! Only take the good stuff and just ignore the rest! When my ancestors went into battle they stripped down and painted their asses blue! Talk about embarrassing! What has a bunch of old dead pink guys got to do with who I am? Stand or fall on your own merits. If someone puts you down for something your tribe did years ago just ignore them! They're probably all Slim Whitman fans, anyway!

After what we saw recently with the evacuation of Lebanese-"Canadians" does anyone still respect the concept of dual citizenship anymore? Two thirds of them promptly went back to Lebanon when the shooting stopped! Citizenship should be more than a flag of convenience.

Geez, MD! cannon - a big gun canon - a religious official He's asking if your pun was intentional! Guess not.

You're right, of course. Still, one can't help but have some sympathy for Kengs feelings. My heritage is British. My folks came over to Pictou Nova Scotia on the good ship Hector, in the very late 1600's or so. That's a lot of generations of Canadians. Putting down Irish or Scottish on a census form seems kinda silly. Over the years I've known many new, first and even second generation "immigrant" Canadians who always referred to their background with a hyphen, putting "Canadian" second and not first. I've known many from the Balkans and virtually all of them were worse than the Irish for carrying centuries-old grudges. Here in Hamilton it's common knowledge that Serb, Croat and other Balkan groups have informally staked their turf to various Horton's locations. I have friends whose parents came from those countries who dare not buy their morning cuppa from the "wrong" store! I realize this is anecdotal and only an old guy's personal experience. When I think about it logically my head tells me you're right and that is the price we pay for a free society, the amount of immigration we've allowed and its mix of parent nationalities. Still, when all is said and done I can't help but feel a little sad when I see countless little flags and flag decals of OTHER countries on people's cars every day, huge showings of fan support for OTHER countries' soccer teams and most sad of all: constant nagging cries to dump our Queen and become some kind of republic! It's as if every newcomer's heritage is considered more valuable than what used to be the traditional one. British/French Canadian heritage seems LESS equal than others and in any conflict of issues must yield second place. It seems to be the path my country has taken and it's too late now to change. Again, my head says I must accept it. My heart, however, can't help but FEEL differently!

Looks to me like the Red Tories are still in charge in Ontario! The Bill Davis camp is still in control. This is good news for the Liberals. They are already perceived as "in the centre". It's harder for the Tories to knock them out and grab the centre for themselves. Once again we have no clear voting alternative. Mike Harris got power after Frank Miller basically because the party was so far down and broke that no one really wanted it. He was the first blue Tory in generations and the fact that he won two huge majorities proved that people today like the Tories best when they act like Tories! If they want a Red Tory they can vote Liberal, or keep voting liberal if that's now their habit. Those same Tory advisers who spectacularly blew the last provincial election with the religious schools issue can talk about how nobody really wants to vote for a Harris type again but the fact remains, Mike won big time, twice! So far, they've LOST! If they keep trying to be Liberals they're only going to lose again.

Often when something doesn't make sense it helps to take a second look to decide what's the REAL goal of a program! What if the RIDE program is not primarily designed to catch drunks but rather to APPEAR to catch drunks? They seem to catch very few impaired drivers. It's not hard to avoid the RIDE program. They tend to be rather conspicuous and always set up in the same places. The powers that be can get their photo-ops and the usual shallow-thinking citizens think another problem has been solved. These are usually the same folks who think that another gun registry will cure the danger of ILLEGAL guns, or more basketball courts will eliminate youth crime, or putting anti-pollution costs on our domestic industries will save the planet while allowing cheap imports from countries that have no such costs, or that our expertise of "soft diplomacy" will guarantee other nations will respect our claims to the Arctic....the list is endless. It's the old Liberal joke once again: "It doesn't have to work as long as we can say we've got one!"

When an OPP dispatcher tells a terrified housewife living beside (but not ON!) the disputed lands "Don't call us anymore! You're on your own!" then that housewife has been denied the protection of law. Sadly, this only leaves them the option of protecting themselves. People in fear tend to overreact. That's how tragedies like Mr. George's death occur. This situation makes me more afraid everyday. Your twisting everything to fit your assumptions just makes me feel worse. Propaganda will not change reality. If things are not addressed then blood is the only logical outcome. It doesn't matter to me on which side - it's still tragic, especially when boneheads leading both sides are too blind and self-centred to see the inevitable effects of their actions. On one side we have a baby, too unlettered to understand all the ramifications of his actions. On the other we have Dalton, an idiot who handed the baby a razor blade. I expect to be flamed by the usual bunch. Doesn't matter. I sincerely hope they prove right! I just don't see a blessed logical reason or shred of evidence to buy their argument. One and one is two. If you keep drawing to an inside straight you'll lose your shirt. If you believe Jenny and her gang then you'll be sorry. The world doesn't change to fit your own bias. No point in arguing. We can only wait. If a few years goes by and we reach a bloodless agreement then I'll breathe easier. Until then, calling me names or spouting feeble attempts at propaganda won't convince me to start "smiling".

I'm curious if anyone can provide an example of any mother with her baby on her back braving shark-infested waters to get TO Cuba? Or are all the refugees in leaky, sinking boats trying to get to Florida simply greedy bastards after "wetback" jobs and a chance to be a "capitalist running dog"? Or are they just not as enlightened as we folks here in this thread?

I'm missing something here. Are you implying that Riel was RIGHT to execute those mounties? That he was either perfectly justified or left with no other choice? Couldn't he have cobbled up a jail? Maybe used them as hostages for a prisoner swap or something? I mean, execution is not a casual act that should be dismissed in a cavalier fashion. I'm from Ontario and yet I would be equally outraged at any unnecessary killing anywhere in Canada. Or is it just that Manitoba had a beef with Ottawa so Riel becomes a hero and anything he did including executions is just fine as long as he killed only Ottawa representatives? Maybe I'm just too much of an old hippy. I can shoot my own dog if he goes rabid and I can accept capital punishment as an option in clear cases but I just get uncomfortable with casual killing being dismissed lightly for "patriotic" reasons.