Nuclear

Thanks for the news flash, Captain America. Of course Iraq wasn't behind 9-11. It WAS a support of al-queda and Saddam gave money to families of thsoe who died in suicide attacks....I'd call that supporting terrorism. Rumsfeld said Iraq wasn't directly behind the 9-11 attacks....but that doesn't mean they were not involved in others.... When reading news articles, don't read the first paragraph and take it as gospel. Read all the words, top to bottom. View the page on other websites also....then you will understand the meaning. Ask the French about walking softly...it took the Nazis 4 days, count em, 4 days to be conquered. I like the big stick idea. That way when one of these little countries like Iraq get a big ego, we can whop them on the head with it!

And here is the opinion of our local UN and NATO representative who was there when this all happened. Either you're telepathic or full of crap. Hmm....lemme guess. For fleabag or whatever your name is.... The US has no responsibility to anyone else. Our military is paid for by Americans....so hence, their job is to protect Americans. Our second priority is to protect our allies. England is one of them. Together, we watch each others' backs. In WW1 and WW2, England needed help and we did help. Hours after 9-11, England pledged their support for helping the US.

Interesting concept, but the idea of competition(hence the idea of more $$) is often a stronger motivator. There are to many slackers and dead beats who want to live as free riders for society to survive as communisism. If everyone was willing to work hard for the benefit of all of society, then we could ALL live in mansions and life would be perfect....so blame the deadbeats.

Claiming that any action again terrorists such as bin laden or arafat, other than sitting around a table talking, will result in another 9-11 is making a complex topic far too simple. First off, we can talk to arafat all we want and we're not going to get anywhere.... They finally had peace over there and were in negotiations for a perminent peace when the Palestinians practicing their 'religion of peace' starting the fighting again. Worst case scenario, the palestinians get mad and commit more suicide bombings. As tragic as that is for the poor Jews who have to live with them, if all the palestinians blow themselves up(hopefully killing as few Jews as possible, if any at all) then we won't have any terrorist problems.... Here is how it is: The palestinians stop fighting, the conflict ends. The Israelis stop fighting, and there will no longer be an Israel. That's all there is to it.

You know nothing of my education. The person behind this screen could be a 12 year old 6th grader or a Professor at MIT with a double doctorate so don't go accusing my education. Just like most liberals and democrats, you attack the person because you don't like their views. Nice tactics. By eliminating the government in Iraq that supported terrorism, there is not way they can obtain WMD from Saddam or his sons(who are dead). Yeah, a few people may decide to become extremists but they too will meet their fate. Of the various news sources out there, I found this story in a New England newspaper. Funny how others haven't posted it. I wonder why. http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/Main.asp?Se...ArticleID=88954

Why not? Granted it isn' exactly a peacemaker, but a country has the right to defend itself. Noa, you need to come out from under the rock you're hiding under if you think we're in Iraq for oil. If that were the case, why are we still there? hmm, ponder. Once we establish a stable base of operations in Iraq, that'll put us....wow, in the MIDDLE OF THE MIDDLE EAST. Convenient for looking at any nation who many give us a hard time. Let's play "Who wants to get their butts whipped in three weeks!"

Amen!

If only we had the ability to see the what ifs.....what if we hadn't gone into Iraq...what if WMD were sold to terrorists.....what if DC, NYC, LA, or London were under a mushroom cloud..... And you think the stock markets hurt on 9-12? Imagine if Wall Street was a pile of ash.... Then again, nothing might have happened. But we'll never know. To be honest, I'm willing to take the risk of eliminating a potential threat before millions upon millions are dying here. We have the technology to defend ourselves, they don't. Not my problem. We did the best we could to prevent civillian casualties and many Americans were killed and injured because of it, so don't complain to me or my country. I'm a patriot and a nationalist. Anyone who challenges my country deserves death.

I saw the movie The Pianist yesterday. I HIGHLY recommend this for anyone. It graphically showed how unbelievably horrible the Holocaust was. Made me sick to my stomach. Now ask again how we determine which morals are correct? Many Nazis could not even be considered human......calling them animals would be a compliment.

Well it WOULD work....Israel was enjoying the peace(as were the innocent Palestinians who jsut wna t live peacefully) but Hamas, headed by Arafat, had to start it up again....yeah, he'd be a martyr, but a dead martyr is better than a terrorist leader....

The events of the last 50 years regarding the middle east was mainly done by the CIA. Mostly for security reasons. If we get them to fight each other down, we won't risk them allying with the Soviet Union and becoming an enemy of ours. That was the thinking then. When we helped Osama(spit) we were helping someone who was fighting for his freedom. He bit the hand that feeds him so now we have to put him down. Nova, We are not there to create terrorists, we're there to eliminate them. Granted this creates a lot of those unsympathetic to us, but if they are not with us, then they are against us. We are not bullying. We are protecting ourselves from a world of piranhas that would love to see our success topple. They want us to live like them in clay huts and they want us to practice their religion. Ever hear the saying 'Nice guys finish last'? Well sadly it's true. The US isn't going to finish last so we're not going to allow ourselves to be pushed around. We're doing the right thing. US defense aside, we did the Iraqis a big favor in the process. They have thousands upon thousands dead in mass graves from that fruitcake. How can you justify not doing something. Especially when we can be looking after our own interests at the same time. We'll win this war and in the end things will be better. I tend to fear though that the anti-American liberals will kill us from the inside before any army could ever destroy this great country. Heck, the UN will probably give orders to our troops one day and other nations will have a say in our affairs. The world is going to fall apart.... It's sad. I hope it's after my lifetime.

Well, the west seems to be the ones with common sense. I mean there are people I don't like but I'm not gonna go kill them. In some countries, that would be ok though. These are like God given rights. This can be whatever God you choose to believe in or mother nature if you prefer. I believe many of those morals comes from the God that I believe in. Many of those morals have come into Western Culture from the days when EVERYONE was Catholic, whether they liked it or not. Since leaving Europe and settling in America, we've said that we want freedom to worship God how we see fit. This means what type of denomination we choose is all up to us as in Europe, at least until recently, many countries imposed religions views and practices. Now seeing how good we have it, we see people who don't even have the basic rights in the Middle East for example. I heard women in the middle east can not show their bodies so the MEN are not sexually tempting.... So why do the women have to dress up? That doesn't sound fair. I'm not a feminist, but people deserve to be treated equal!

The only thing terrorists understand is violence. Yes it creates more of the enemy, but what are we supposed to do? Sit here and hope they don't attack again? Action is the only way to resolve it. For the last 23 months, it's worked pretty well. Sorry Nova, I support what America is doing to secure my rights and my freedoms. If in the process we can help a few countries in the Middle East set up a self-governing state that can exist peacefully, great. All I really care about is America and our allies. If we can help others, great, but it's not going to be a priority. Also, for those who complain about the 87 billion dollar price tag for this war, WW2 cost about 4.3 TRILLION dollars. Sometimes you have to fight. Never willing to fight for your beliefs and freedoms means that you can be easily conquered. Ask the French.

My point is this. If you're first officer on a navy vessel and you have a problem with what your Captain is doing, you NEVER state it in front of the rest of the crew. A good example of this is Crimson Tide.(good movie, I highly recommend it to anyone) We appear weak because we attack our leaders. Having different points of view is one thing. Attacking whatever they do is like playing the copycat game that we all did to our siblings when we were four. South Park did state a good point.(one of a very few) We have all these protestors so we can go to war and also feel reluctant and not appear to be war hungrey....

Nova, to clarify for you: Being patriotic doesn't mean having to fight. It DOES mean willing to fight for and die for the country you live in. I like my way of life. I like my friends, my family, and my countrymen ALIVE. I don't want this changed. Let any who challenge my country step forward. Since the beginning of this nation we've had those who've tried to take what we've worked hard for and we're not going to stop now. The only thing a terrorist understands is violence. Let me put it this way. PLEASE tell us what you think the Us should have done after 9-11 so as to prevent it from happening again.

Good point. Too bad we didn't turn back to the ideas of isolationism and considering WW2 to be the last war ever. Too bad we also can't all stick behind our commander and chief when he needs our support the most. How cool would Star Wars be if everyone of the Admirals in the Empire were making fun of Darth Vader?

If I'm correct, the US didn't really become very industrialized until AFTER Slavery. That was also a century ago. We've come quite a ways sense then and it can all be contributed to hard working Americans. Black, White, Native-Americans, and every other nationality that makes up this great country. As for the help of the French in the Revolutionary War. It was nice of them to help us, but the French then were under a different governement....King Louis was in power then. That'd be like always hating Iraq for what Saddam did or always hating America for what Clinton did. The French then had a revolution which we initially supported(they helped us, we were about to return the favor) until I believe it was Thomas Jefferson went over to France as the Secretary of State to see nothing but a head rolling party. Then, over 100,000 Americans died in WW1 helping the French. Then in total over 400,000 Americans died in WW2 helping the French.(That number is both theatres but it was, after all, one war that needed to be won on all fronts) Ya know Vietnam? Yeah...we went there to help fight the VC cause the French failed. I'm not going anti-France here. I'm just trying to express that our debt is paid. I'm STILL waiting for Japan and Germany to pay the rest of the world back for their little temper tantrums last century. HUGO: Your great uncle and grandfather sound like great men patriots. You don't have to be an American to be patriotic of your country or patriotic for freedom. No offense, Nova, but you're 17. Everything you know is based on one of four things: 1)What your parents told you. 2)What your teachers tell you. 3)What your textbooks tell you. 4)What the media tells you. No offense to any of those sources, but none of them are necessarily 100% correct. When I was little my father told me if I ate chicken wings I'd be able to fly. My teachers told me in school guns were evil.(We can debate that in another room if you'd like) I read a textbook for school that has misquoted famous sayings such as what Neil Armstrong said when he landed on the moon. The Media puts out storys how the directors want them to be seen. As you soon step into the real world, you'll be able to use those original sources as a refference to what you encounter there and then(hopefully) be able to make well informed opinions and decisions. Don't ignore all the people in these forums as wackos just because their views differ. Don't mindlessly listen to ANYONE. Listen to everyone and everything. The best example I can think of of a patriot is what one of my grandfathers, along with about another million American young men went through in the Summer of 1945. He had just been through Leyte and Luzon and the Phillipines were clear of Japanese soldiers. Now plans for the Invasion of Japan (X-Day) were being drafted. My grandfather served in the 33rd Infantry Division and was going to land at Miyasaki in the first wave. They estimated in the first part of the invasion, 100,000-150,000 Americans would be killed. He spent that summer being 20 years old preparing to go to face his death. He knew he wouldn't be coming home. Yet he still prepared. A coward would have turned away and quit. Taken a court-martial. Given themself a self inflicted wound. He prepared and trained. Although the invasion wasn't needed, my grandfather along with several thousand more Americans were prepared to give their lives at about 18-25 years old of age. For what? For America. For the country they love. For their families. For freedom. For the right to live and go to work and not have to worry if a plane is going to crash into your office building. Since the beginning of this country, over 2.5 MILLION Americans have died for our freedom. Freedom was attacked and we will defend it. Many countries also share our dream of the entire world being free one day. Canada, England, Spain, and several more have committed themselves to helping us in our common goal. Many of these countries spilled the blood of their youths together in WW1 and WW2. And now, as the triology of horror completes itself, hopefully when it's all done, there will be freedom around the world and tyranny and oppression will be no more. So long as there is evil in the world we must fight it. It's like the fight against crime and drugs. It's a long hard battle and we must be prepared to weather it. We will be victorious because there are men and women out there like my grandfather and like Hugo's great uncle and grandfather out there. There were heros and patriots 60 years ago when the world needed them and there are heros and patriots today. We have them all to thank. Being a patriot doesn't mean you have to pick up a gun to and fight. It's not the only way. Love of one's country can be expressed in many ways.

It seems that all Democrats do is attack whatever the Republicans and President Bush do. They are not very good at coming up with original ideas or having their own plans for making this country safer. President Bush is doing the best job he can and all they do is attack him and his policys for nothing but political gain. If you have ideas for how to defend America better, by all means, say so. But to do nothing but attack the President and his believes, shut up because all you're doing is showly a lack of support for our administration which, regardless of your political views(I'm not saying love the man, just respect him), shows the rest of the world how strong or weak we are. Bill O'REilly said something today very interesting. He referred to the War on Terror as World War Three. Kinda scary, enh? It bothers me to see people attacking what the President is trying to do for our own good just to gain some political ground for their own needs. It's very selfish and I believe it hurts the country. I'm not saying love Bush or mindlessly follow him. For the most part I like him. I agree with most of what he's done. I think he's handling the war on terror as well as a politician can. It seems like the Democrats in Congress have one purpose. Not to make the laws or support the government or make this country better and/or safer but to attack the President constantly just in hopes of getting one of their own in office. For me, that seems very selfish. Campaign. By all means. Put out your views. Tell us how you'd do it. Telling us how bad the current President is doesn't make me want to vote for you, it just makes you look like a middleschooler.

To say to me, a Christian, that I am wrong, is no different than me to tell someone else that they are wrong. I have my beliefs and you have yours. In about a 100 years one of two things will happen: 1) You're right and we disappear into nothingness or whatever you believe in for an afterlife or 2) I'm right and I'm in Heaven while your lack of belief may land you somewhere else. Where I don't know as it's not my place to judge you. We'll tell the tale then. As for the Alabama issue: I don't see what harm the monument did. If someone believed in it, it was important to them and they felt it's presense was important. If they did not believe in it, then it was nothing but a piece of rock. I am not French for example. If I go to Paris, and I see the Eiffel Tower, it will mean nothing to me other than 'wow, look at that funky thing.' But for a Parisian or a Frenchperson, it is a symbol of their country. All of us encounter things daily we don't believe in and therefore take little notice of. One good example is political ads. You may think the person who they promote is a wacko so you ignore it where someone else may like what that wacko has to say. As for separation of church and state, that was created to prevent Rome from ruling the country or for the country to impose religion on someone. I do not feel this monument imposed it. It displayed it. If someone chose to believe in it or if someone only considered it a piece of rock, it's the same thing. The gov't didn't force anyone to believe in it. Also, Judeo-Christian morals are for the most part the foundation of the US's morality(at least until recently) and law system. I think it was sad they had to remove it because some people didn't like it. It did no harm to those who disliked it but now with it gone, those who did believe in it no longer have it.

Nova, I repeat Hugo's comments on what America owes the rest of the world? We've helped out in several places where it was not necessary. The US military is paid for by US tax dollars and with American lives(few exceptions as I understand even foreigners living here can join also). I am not paying taxes nor watching friends and family go off to fight for other countries that would give us squat in return. When a natural disaster like a tornado or a flood happens, America takes care of their own. When something happens in another country, Red Cross shows up with blood etc. etc. etc. We owe nothing to anyone. We're the most generous nation on earth, what do u want us to do, live in clay huts and send all our money and success to others? Once you graduate from high school and go out into the real world, you'll realize how much it stinks to work hard and get a large protion of your paycheck sent to taxes. It'll then enrage you more to see that the US is giving Egypt 4 billion dollars for this and North Korea a billion dollars for that. I don't know why cause I'm not a politician. Wait till you're in the real world before you take too many attacks on how the government works. We're not trying to insult your school. I'm certain it's a good institution....but judging by the fact you attend private school, it's probably paid for by your parents. There is no shame in this as it's nice when your parents can help you get on your feet for the real world. America can not be expected to give all it has for someone else. It's stinky things happen overseas like that, but we need to take care of our own first, then help others. For the US military, a US life IS more important than anothers as is for a Canadian, a Canadian Life is more important to their military. I don't expect Canada to sacrifice the good of their own for me as I don't live there, why should other countries expect it of America.(I'm not saying Canada does that as I do not recall any instance where they did.) As for American Patriotism: We're not going to sit back while we are attacked. We've gone two years without another serious attack against US soil....this is very good and we hope to continue our winning streak. What we have to do is make the entire world safe, not just for America but for everyone from Singapore to New York City to London to Baghdad. Hugo: Was your great-uncle at D-Day? Most of my family was in the pacific theatre but I had an uncle who flew out of England on a B-24 over France and Germany.

Hugo, you are too cool. That was very well said and I completely agree with you.

This is like suing the maker of the car for a car accident that was the fault of the driver. The planes had nothing to do with it. It was the people who hyjacked them. It's like the gun issue. Guns don't kill people, people do. Although almost as crazy, it would make more sense to go after the Saudi Government or the families of the hyjackers in SAudi Arabia financially. I found out a week after 9-11 that bin laden's nephew was on the same college campus as me when it happened. He was gone before the sun set.

Nova, do you really think that 9-11 was the 'world's' idea of a slap in the face to America because we were 'naughty'? It was the first attack of a war. Just like WW2, they started it, and we will end it. If you think 3,000 lives are insignificant, then what is? Isn't one single life important? You wouldn't be saying that if you had family or friends there. You are OBVIOUSLY not American and correct me if you did have family there. From what you say, I doubt you did. You did lose anyone. You didn't say good by to a spouse or husband when they went to their normal jobs and then heard they were not coming home. This isn't a car accident or anything, this is a premeditated murder. The people killed did NOTHING wrong. Iraq had Saddam and he was very bad and did a lot of bad things. Should we kill every single Iraqi because of what a select few did? With 9-11, that's what the terrorists tried to do. They blamed the entire country(most people here haven't even been to the middle east) for what a few did and tried to kill as many as they could. It was a senseless act and never needed to happen. If anything, it's made life for the middle east even worse. You'd be surprised how well versed I am at history btw. Also, Americans were not supposed to learn anything from 9-11 other than we need to watch our backs better. I gotta ask you this, Nova: How old are you? You sound like a 12 year old who believes whatever his teachers in school say...

If you claim that 9-11 was America's fault, was the Holocaust the fault of the Jews? Was the Klu Klux Klan the fault of African-Americans? If you want to blame 9-11 on America, find me the American responsible for enraging the terrorists. Maybe it was an Ex-President, or some former Senator or Congressperson. Now tell me if any of the 3,000+ people who were killed had ANYTHING whatsoever to do with enraging the terrorists.(Not that being really mad about something gives you the right to kill people) These people didn't like things how they were. They didn't like how well we lived and how we didn't have to worry about horrible events happening daily. They did it out of jealousy. They did it because they wanted 72 virgins in Heaven.(I'd have loved to have seen their faces when they realized they were in Hell) They did it because they wanted their religion to reign supreme. They did it like the Crusades. Now remember, when Christians did go it Israel, this was in the ballpark of 900 years ago I believe.(I never studied Western Civilizations so my numbers could be off, feel free to correct me) At that same time our idea of a restroom was the corner of our one room house and most houses were made out of mud. We have gone from swords and bows and arrows to nuclear ICBMs. We are in a different age. A CIVILIZED age. In a civilized age, you don't go after people based on what they believe in, or what they look like. The last man to go gung ho on genocide based on religion is currently sitting in the fire next to the hijackers waiting his turn to get a pineapple shoved up his rear.(Can't remember what movie I saw that it, it was a slapstick, wanna say Little Nicky:Which other than that was a very dumb movie.) Because I love my country does not give them the right to kill me because they love theirs. Now they have forced us to go over there and in trying to kill them before they can kill us, innocent people are dying. As for there are people starving all over the world, it's a shame this happens. 60% of the food aid in the world comes from the US.(no offense to our Canadian pals, I dunno how much you give, I only know the US stats, sorry) What do you expect, the US to put Africa and the Middle East on welfare? My taxes pay for enough deadbeats in America, let alone OTHER countries. There. I feel better now.

Patriotism and pride existed long before 9-11, but most Americans alive today never had it challenged. Although the loss can seem insignificant, the Americans got ticked off about it because it's AMERICA and that does not happen here. People shouldn't have to worry about going to work. People shouldn't have to say good bye in the morning and worry that they may not come home. It's not right to happen anywhere, but in America we were successful in keeping that status. It was challenged. These people were not killed in a military attack or an accident. It was a bunch of fruitcakes trying to campaign their political views. I am a Republican myself and don't like a lot of Democratic leaders, but there is NOTHING they could do to make me kill a bunch of innocent people to get my point across. I would love to meet a member of Al Queda, because I would kill them with my own bare hands, regardless of the consequences. Patriotism is well defined as the love of your country. It's like love of anything. How far are you willing to go? Those soldiers who sacrifice their lives for their country have the greatest amount of respect from me. In my eyes, there is no greater honor than to give your life for another. I would consider it a privilege to fight for my country and would lay down my life in a moment for it. That is how I am Patriotic.