iamcanadian2

Well you are quite off the mark on this topic. Disolving redundant and unecessary government levels involves removing the bureacracries that we can do without and that serve no purpose other than to line people's pockets with unecessary profesional public employment. What you are talking about instead is fracturing an aready broken system even further by eliminating elected possition which have the integrity and reinforcing the non-elected and appointment possitions where all the corruption is created and where integrity receives lip service but is non-existent. Nothing that is appointed can ever be better than something elected. Elected is the only means of ensuring integrity. It's not perfect but it is the best way to manage the evils of mankind that arrises in all holders of power.

We seem to have gotten off track in this thread. The two sides of opinions on legal professionals, nemely the one held by lawyers about themselves which your here seem to profess and the contrary view held by all those who have ever experienced Canada's version of what is call's a Legal System (unique in the world I may add), which would not be allowed to survive in any honest country and only survives in Canada due to our Police State status (that Stalin would envy). This thread is about disolving unecessary governments and banning and disbarring the men with the mentality of gangsters that rule over them from further holding of possitions of public trust and public resposibilities. The best candidate we have identified of organizations that should be disolved and disbanded are the Nine Regional (Second Tier/Layer of Municipal) Governments of Ontario. Any other candidates?

Every lawyer with a prestigious law firm is sleazy. They would not be good lawyers (and the firm not considered prestigious) if they are not sleazy. Hence why no one in their right mind will ever vote for a lawyer to be a judge. This is also why we don't have elected judges in Canada. One of the few places on earth that are not communist or fascists that deliver justice by dictum of unelected "elites". Lord Acton: I cannot accept... that we are to judge pope and king (or judges) unlike other men, with a favorable presumption that they do no wrong. If there is any presumption, it is the other way against holders of power ... Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Yea but a guy looking to be a RCMP officer has the desire to be a cop, trains to be a cop and then applies for the job. In the case of judges, they first desire to be crooked sleezy lawyers, they train to be liers and cheaters in a legal forum, and when they can't make enough money at it or when they are too lazy to work 16 hours a day in private pratice they accept a civil servant jobs of being a Judge and let themselves be taken by crooked sleezy lawyers they always dreamed of becomming. The system here is all screwed up as a result. Big difference in mentality. This is why Judges should always be elected possition and in fact I would never vote for a lawyer to be a judge.

The way it works today only lawyers who are not good enough to make a living as lawyers accept appoitments as judges. Good Lawyers make too much money in private practice to ever become public employees. Judges should be elected and reflect the public interest rather than the interest of the legal profession. Judges should be educated as judges which should require a much higher educational and ethical standards than a lawyer.

Only a lawyer would say something like that... When were you called to the bar?

The government must be placed on one side of the equation. The People and their elected representatives placed on the other side. It must become an adversarial process where the people by the force of the elected representatives take back from the government all that they take illegitimatly by their intentional wastes and intentional missmanagement. Another important element to the equation is that the Justice system must be populated by elected justice that also represent the people's interest rather than the government and the legal profession. Fixing these minor flaws which are critical to proper governance is the key to creating a legitimate government system in Canada for all levels.

We have too much non-elected government and too litte elected government. The bureacracy of government should reduced by at least 30% if not 50%. Most of government serves no purpose other than maintain its own existence. The public gets about 2 Cents on every dollar paid back as services. The rest is overhead and pilfering by non-elected government officials who are doing all the stealing. We call it waste and mismanagement to be nice. Nice Canadian's don't call corruption by its proper name. Any government elmininated is good and the best way to eliminate government is to increase the number of elected representatives who can act in the public interest to remove unecessary non-elected government and unecessary government functions.

I though this is what we have now with all the different layers to feed from. The Senate should be elected and have power to represent the people. Canada has too few people elected to represent the people. Canada trusts too much in the integrity of people that are in power for generations and are never elected and who care not who is elected since they treat them like their puppets regardless and in fact have little honour and even less integrity. We have no effective elected representatives of the people as a result.

...sounds like an Oxymoron. Downsizing government causes the government to bloat? Duhhh

You know what I am saying.... Playing with my grammar again I see. What is said is that the Court will kill claims that people bring against government and government officials using numerous tactics where the lawyers and the Justice System get in bed together to bury litigation against public officials and government. If they can't sucseed in killing the claims that way, they will burn the victims out by creating impossible legal costs to prevent the case from getting to court, with judges and lawyers working together to perpetuate a sham over the victim and the case. If that does not work a Corrupt Judge will be assigned to hear the case and render the decisions by corrupt judicial administrators. Either way the victim will be killed by the system to prevent them from obtaining justice against public officials and government organizations. Its above the law because the administration of government is corrupt and populated by men with the mentality of gangsters including their peers in the justice system.

This would be the most effective / efficient system. Democracy, at a fundamental level, only replaces the ABSOLUTE RULE OF A KING with person that is elected by the people subject to the RULE and makes them easy to remove after a short finite period of time (4 or 5 years). This is required because.... I cannot accept, your canon that we are to judge pope and king unlike other men, with a favorable presumption that they do no wrong. If there is any presumption, it is the other way against holders of power ... Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. ....and for this reason people with power need to be very easy to disbar from holding power to prevent it from corrupting them after a period of time.

The layer most inaccessable to the people is Regional. No one is directly and soly ellected to that level and they govern by proxy without any leader or party to blame for anything. Everyone can pass the buck on blame at that level with no one being responsible for anything no one can be blamed. At this level we have rule by the bureacracy only since there is no one to blame for what they do with the public trust and responsibility and are completly outside of controls or public scrutiny. “Bureaucracy, the rule of no one, has become the modern form of despotism.” Mary McCarthy

We can do with just two governments. A small local munucipal government that the people can attend on in Town Hall like arangements and a Federal government for the larger issues and services. The Regions are completely redundant and serve no good purpose and are there only to intetionally waste public money outside of scrutiny. The Provinces have made themselves completly redundant by downloading spending and responsibility to the municipal level and wash their hands like Pontious Pilot on what the municipalities do. Provincial Government serves pomp and circumstance to an bicker with municipal and federal levels in front of the public to take blame and distract away from the attrocities done in the name of public interest, which is basically all a sham.

Much of Canada has too many redundant layers of government: 1) Local Municipal 2) Regional Municipal 3) Provincial 4) Federal This was required decades ago before the advent of Computers. ALL ORGANIZATIONS have down-sized since and computerizes to the max to eliminate reduntant spending on bureaucracy, except Government. It has SUPERSIZED instead into a collective maassive waste of most of the peoples money and resources making Canada the most wastefull government structure on the PLANET. We are lucky to get 2Cents on the Dollar spent in actual delivered services we see, feel and need. The rest 98% is intentionally wasted.

So Mr(s) Doubting Thomas, if the system is not as broken as everyone believes, what's so good about and why should anyone believe it to be any different than the way most people experience it to be?

No read the rest of the post.... The problem is self-evident and self-explanatory. Does not need much of a brain to understand... Just needs people blowing the whistle of Canada's crappy excuse for a Justice System that is worthless to the public and a gold mine for men with the mentality of gangsters.

The quote above is just a fancy way to say..... Stonewall it! Verb 1. stonewall - obstruct or hinder any discussion; "Nixon stonewalled the Watergate investigation"; "When she doesn't like to face a problem, she simply stonewalls" blockade, obstruct, stymie, stymy, embarrass, hinder, block - hinder or prevent the progress or accomplishment of; "His brother blocked him at every turn" 2. stonewall - engage in delaying tactics or refuse to cooperate; "The President stonewalled when he realized the plot was being uncovered by a journalist" delay, detain, hold up - cause to be slowed down or delayed; "Traffic was delayed by the bad weather"; "she delayed the work that she didn't want to perform" stone·wall (stnwôl) v. stone·walled, stone·wall·ing, stone·walls v.intr. 1. Informal a. To engage in delaying tactics; stall: "stonewalling for time in order to close the missile gap" James Reston. b. To refuse to answer or cooperate. To refuse to answer or cooperate with; resist or rebuff: "I want you to stonewall it, let them plead the Fifth Amendment" Richard M. Nixon.

"They have worked hard to muster a citizens' agenda, but much like a balloon, without the continuous application of heat, the chance of this great cause rising is not great. If the heat source for {insert name of your public cause here} falters, so does the cause"

As everyone knows Judges in Canada are not elected and cannot be removed from their employed public offices based on the political will of anyone ever elected. With this type of absolute immunity from personal consequences for their actions in public employment they are capable of al types of gross unethical activities that they cannot be taken to task on. The legal system here is corrupted by the fact that too many judges will get into bed with top law firms and peers in employed government possitions of trust and responsiblity which is often reflected in bizzar judicial decisions that get reported from time to time (most do not get reported) and in most of the cases when government or government officials are brought before justice (when they make it to a trial which seldom is the case since they tend to get killed well before then). As such, outside of private sector legal struggles where both sides of any fight get fleeced with equal zeal by the legal profession working together, where there is a generic objective to always enriching legal professionals at the expense of the general public, there is the bigger problem of the underlying corruption of our legal system when the public sector comes under the judicial knife. The tools used to opperate judicially on the public sector activities are too blunt and unable to cut the mustard.

Guyser.... Did I get the gramar right? ....common help me out here...

Now ladies and gentlemen , that is a classic run on sentence. Ignore the content as there is none, but it is a beautiful example of a run on sentence. Thanks for the grammar lesson.... I tend to concentrate on substance rather than form. So let's see how this should have been written... The elected are not idiots. They only look this way to cover up for the intentional waste and intentional missmanagement by the bureaucrats in power for generations. [People who the elected] have no power over, [who] force them to look stupid, [to avoid having to] admit that our senior public servants are all men with the mentality of gangsters. [The senior public servants] lie and cheat [not only] the public, but also the elected representatives of the public, with impunity. I hope this is more elequent.. but I am the kind of person who cares more about communicating facts and truth rather than the embelishments of form which you find more important than the substance of what people have to say about the realities of Canada hidden behind all the rosy bullshit pomp and circumstance.

Hi Poly... They shut down the polcan forum... hey. Only in the puppet state of Canada. Biggest problem I see is that Judges in Canada are lawyer (usually the ones that arn't good enough to earn a big buck in legal practice to boot).... Who came up with this bright idea? In most countries Judges are learned in beinig Judges and they do not have to be lawyers. They are smart people and highly trained in the art of judging. Lawyers are only highly trained in the art of lying, cheating and screwing people to make a living.

Professional quality screwing is all that you can expect out of senior public professionals who tend to have less integrity than crack addicted gutter whores due to the accumulation of genetic turds in higher public offices. The higher you go the less honesty and the worse ethics you will find they need to have to compensate for their gross lazyness, inability and lack of competence. The elected are not idiots, they only look this way to cover up for the intentional waste and intentional missmangement by the bureaucrats in power for life who they have no power over, and force them to look stupid rather than admit that our senior public servants are all men with the mentality of gangsters who lie and cheat the public and also the elected representatives of the public with impunity.

Canada's politics are a joke. We have no democractic government here. It is all a sham. Politicians have no power over anything. They simply struggle to keep their job that they must fight for every four years and are easily taken out if the non-elected officials put their mind to them.