Argus Posted October 7, 2005 Report Posted October 7, 2005 Not all islamics are terrorists but they are all potential terrorists. Just like all Hindus, Jews, Catholics, Protestants, etc. etc. are potential terrorists. Perhaps we should ask them to leave too? I don't think you can logically use this argument. There is no great revolutionary zeal today among other major world religions. This is particularly true of Christianity, which is largely westernised and has acquired the the civility of modern western culture. Now if the Catholic seminaries start turning out thousands of wild-eyed ranting, raving religious loonies every year preaching the death and downfall of western governments in favour of God's holy order you'd have a case. But we simply have nothing remotely similar to the plague of madrassas schools infecting the Muslim world. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
err Posted October 15, 2005 Report Posted October 15, 2005 Because a few hundred of them, lurking in shadows here and there, declare war on "the west", do you think that means that "all Muslims" want to attack "the West"?? Should they all be punished for the actions of a few ??? A few hundred? Osama bin Laden attracted recruits from all across the middle east, to the extent he had something like 10,000 men in his camps in Afghanistan, which made him a major supporter of the Taliban. Now think of how hard it is for someone in say, Egypt or Libya or even Yemen or Iran, who is dirt poor, to get to Afghanistan. Think of how many more followers he would have had if he'd been easier to reach. If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.... If you did the math, or were capable of doing it, you'd see that 10,000 is not that many when you compare it to the total population. You said "a few hundred". And you left out the differential between those who could pick up and travel across the continent to Afghanistan and those who only WISHED they could. If ten thousand Muslim men found their way to Afghanistan there were at least a million who wanted to go, but couldn't, either due to family obligations or lack of drive or money. The 10,000 who Osama had camped our in Afghanistan..... How many of them were from Afghanistan, and how many rode their camels there.... And the ones that don't have any drive... we don't have to worry about them, do we ??? you might find that statistics will show that more than 1 in 100 thousand men is a rapist... So therefore, it is more likely that you are a rapist than the Muslim down the street is a "radical Muslim"... Not quite the same thing. If a woman is raped do hundreds of thousands of men across the country jump up and thrust their fists in the air in delight on hearing about it? Do they then drop to their knees and praise God for the success of their fellow rapist? %%%%% Earth to Argus... are you with us.... %%%%%%% I was trying to point out the statistics (that's a kind of math that compares how likely the chances of something happening is...) about the likelihood of "radical Muslims" living in Canada. As I've already explained, if there's a billion Muslims, and ten thousand of them are "radical Muslims", then the chances are, if there are 100 thousand Muslims in your neighbourhood, probably only one of them is a "radical Muslim". Rape is, by and large, an impulse crime largely driven by alcohol or drugs, and is largely physically harmless to the victim (in terms of other physically violent crime). I wasn't saying that you are a rapist Argus.... don't get defensive on me... And I wouldn't go telling what you just wrote to too many people... especially women... Quote
Argus Posted October 16, 2005 Report Posted October 16, 2005 If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.... And what would you be if you had balls? you might find that statistics will show that more than 1 in 100 thousand men is a rapist... So therefore, it is more likely that you are a rapist than the Muslim down the street is a "radical Muslim"... Not quite the same thing. If a woman is raped do hundreds of thousands of men across the country jump up and thrust their fists in the air in delight on hearing about it? Do they then drop to their knees and praise God for the success of their fellow rapist? %%%%% Earth to Argus... are you with us.... %%%%%%% I was trying to point out the statistics (that's a kind of math that compares how likely the chances of something happening is...) about the likelihood of "radical Muslims" living in Canada. Yes, despite your lack of communications skills I did get that. However, when dealing with statistics it behooves you to have something approaching the proper numbers. The numbers you used were "hundreds" of radical muslims. I pointed out that ten thousand were in Bin Laden's camp in Afghanistan alone. The numbers of fanatical muslims are not hundreds but hundreds of thousands, if not millions, with millions more in sympathy with them. As I've already explained, if there's a billion Muslims, and ten thousand of them are "radical Muslims", then the chances are, if there are 100 thousand Muslims in your neighbourhood, probably only one of them is a "radical Muslim".On the other hand, if there are a million radical muslims, then there are a hundred of them in your neighborhood. That's a lot of potential suicide bombers. Rape is, by and large, an impulse crime largely driven by alcohol or drugs, and is largely physically harmless to the victim (in terms of other physically violent crime). I wasn't saying that you are a rapist Argus.... don't get defensive on me... And I wouldn't go telling what you just wrote to too many people... especially women... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Most rape is not very physically damaging. Sorry if that offends your sense of propriety but it happens to be true. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
err Posted October 16, 2005 Report Posted October 16, 2005 you might find that statistics will show that more than 1 in 100 thousand men is a rapist... So therefore, it is more likely that you are a rapist than the Muslim down the street is a "radical Muslim"... However, when dealing with statistics it behooves you to have something approaching the proper numbers. The numbers you used were "hundreds" of radical muslims. I pointed out that ten thousand were in Bin Laden's camp in Afghanistan alone. The numbers of fanatical muslims are not hundreds but hundreds of thousands, if not millions, with millions more in sympathy with them. The number used in the original calculation was 10,000... I used your numbers.... As I've already explained, if there's a billion Muslims, and ten thousand of them are "radical Muslims", then the chances are, if there are 100 thousand Muslims in your neighbourhood, probably only one of them is a "radical Muslim".On the other hand, if there are a million radical muslims, then there are a hundred of them in your neighborhood. That's a lot of potential suicide bombers. This seems a ridiculously high number now, doesn't it... If we were to get back onto what spurred this diversion, it was the suggestion that all Muslims should be kicked out of Canada... Now, supposing there are as many as 250 radical Muslims in Toronto, out of the probable 250,000 that reside there (5% of Toronto/GTA population), and using your statistic (of 1 million radical Muslims in a Billion). You think that the 249,750 "non-radical" Muslims in Toronto should be punished for the 250 "bad" ones...If you go back the the rapist statistic of 1 in 100 thousand... Should all men be curfewed because of the small percentage that you defend.... I mean, there's an awful lot of potential rapists in Toronto..... Most rape is not very physically damaging. Sorry if that offends your sense of propriety but it happens to be true. Quote
Argus Posted October 16, 2005 Report Posted October 16, 2005 However, when dealing with statistics it behooves you to have something approaching the proper numbers. The numbers you used were "hundreds" of radical muslims. I pointed out that ten thousand were in Bin Laden's camp in Afghanistan alone. The numbers of fanatical muslims are not hundreds but hundreds of thousands, if not millions, with millions more in sympathy with them. The number used in the original calculation was 10,000... I used your numbers.... No, you didn't. The original number was "hundreds" which you used. I pointed out Bin Laden had 10,000 in his camp alone, and furthermore than this hardly constituted the entirety of muslim wackos, that there were surely a hundred times that many. As I've already explained, if there's a billion Muslims, and ten thousand of them are "radical Muslims", then the chances are, if there are 100 thousand Muslims in your neighbourhood, probably only one of them is a "radical Muslim".On the other hand, if there are a million radical muslims, then there are a hundred of them in your neighborhood. That's a lot of potential suicide bombers. This seems a ridiculously high number now, doesn't it... Depends on whether you think it's spread out evenly across the globe. I doubt it is. However, there are probably more than 100 muslim fanatics in each of our major cities. Whether they eventually turn violent depends on circumstances. Just ask the Dutch or Spanish.If we were to get back onto what spurred this diversion, it was the suggestion that all Muslims should be kicked out of Canada... That is not what started this topic, nor has anyone said that. If you go back the the rapist statistic of 1 in 100 thousand... Should all men be curfewed because of the small percentage that you defend.... I mean, there's an awful lot of potential rapists in Toronto..... First of all, I haven't defended any rapists. I have pointed out a fact - which you are unable to argue with, but persist in being snotty about. Second, a curfew would serve little purpose since most rape takes place between people who know each other and indoors. In addition, as I pointed out, virtually no rapists are gathering, organizing, training, or propagandizing for the cause of mass rape. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Army Guy Posted October 17, 2005 Report Posted October 17, 2005 err: Are you happy with our present imigration policy then. And what do we do about those that have been proven to have links to terrorist groups, violent crimal records, etc etc. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
err Posted October 17, 2005 Report Posted October 17, 2005 If we were to get back onto what spurred this diversion, it was the suggestion that all Muslims should be kicked out of Canada... That is not what started this topic, nor has anyone said that. Not exactly true... It is the comments below that have driven my argument... That we should be "doing something" about Muslims in Canada.... This country has been harboring terrorists and has let so many islamics into the country that martin is afraid to be seen doing much of anything in the war against the islamic terrorists. Infact they've already warned him on at least one occasion, and are now threatening to sue over a proposed no fly list of islamics. If they are proposing a list that they are saying will have a thousand names on it who they think are a risk to let on a plane, what in gods names are they doing here in the first place. This country is stuck on stupid and has been for years. Not all islamics are terrorists but they are all potential terrorists. Earlier this year when they were making threats they should have been asked to leave then. If you go back the the rapist statistic of 1 in 100 thousand... Should all men be curfewed because of the small percentage that you defend.... I mean, there's an awful lot of potential rapists in Toronto..... First of all, I haven't defended any rapists. blah, blah, blah... In addition, as I pointed out, virtually no rapists are gathering, organizing, training, or propagandizing for the cause of mass rape. They are individuals, yes... Just like Muslims who believe Osama Bin Laden's vision are individuals.... one of these groups organizes (the radical Muslims), and the other doesn't (the rapists).... what they share in common is criminal intent.... My position is contrary to their intent, but at the same time, I don't think we should tar all Muslims with the same brush, or promote any kind of racial hatred here at home... It would only aggravate the situation and promote recruiting for the radical fundamentalist "army"... Quote
err Posted October 17, 2005 Report Posted October 17, 2005 err: Are you happy with our present imigration policy then. And what do we do about those that have been proven to have links to terrorist groups, violent crimal records, etc etc. If the people with the criminal links and violent records are not Canadian citizens, then ship them off.... However, the situation is much more complicated if they are Canadian citizens... I don't have all the answers, and would never pretend to. However, I don't think we should be promoting racial hatred, profiling, etc... It will only fuel the radicals' cause and recruiting efforts.... Quote
Argus Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 If we were to get back onto what spurred this diversion, it was the suggestion that all Muslims should be kicked out of Canada... That is not what started this topic, nor has anyone said that. Not exactly true... It is the comments below that have driven my argument... That we should be "doing something" about Muslims in Canada.... I will let him clarify his statements if he chooses. I took "islamists" to mean fundamentalits, not Muslims, and "they should have been asked to leave" to refer to those making threats. First of all, I haven't defended any rapists. blah, blah, blah... In addition, as I pointed out, virtually no rapists are gathering, organizing, training, or propagandizing for the cause of mass rape. They are individuals, yes... Just like Muslims who believe Osama Bin Laden's vision are individuals.... one of these groups organizes (the radical Muslims), and the other doesn't (the rapists).... what they share in common is criminal intent.... And I have already explained to you that aside from the very, very rare serial rapist there is no criminal intent or planning involved. It is merely booze and drugs and spur of the moment stupidity. No one sane can say the same about people who make no secret of their hatred of the West and its ways and their support for Osama bin laden and other terrorists. Do you find many men praising Paul Bernardo? You can't equate a fanatical group filled with hate and religious zealtry with a criminal statistic. My position is contrary to their intent, but at the same time, I don't think we should tar all Muslims with the same brush, or promote any kind of racial hatred here at home... There are many tens of thousands of Muslims willing to commit violence. There are millions of Muslims who fully support them and share their views. There are tens of millions of Muslims who at least share much of their ideals and beliefs, if not their belief in violence. And there is little criticism of Muslim fundamentalism and zealtry coming from the Muslim community and too much denial of the problem. An example would be the New York Fire Department appointing a Muslim chaplain as a nod towards Muslims, and having him quoted in the news the next day as saying he didn't believe Muslims blew up the World Trade Centre, that he thought it was Jews or the US government. Bleh. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
PocketRocket Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 err:Canada not prepared for Mars attack either !!!! Sounds like something Michael Moore would say. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Does that make it untrue?? Quote I need another coffee
PocketRocket Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 Not all islamics are terrorists but they are all potential terrorists. Just like all Hindus, Jews, Catholics, Protestants, etc. etc. are potential terrorists. Perhaps we should ask them to leave too? I don't think you can logically use this argument. There is no great revolutionary zeal today among other major world religions. This is particularly true of Christianity, which is largely westernised and has acquired the the civility of modern western culture. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well, things in Ireland have quieted down in the past few years, but as little as 20 years ago I would not have wanted to vacation in Belfast. Catholics and Protestants bombing each other, including bombs set off in London. Christians are not so civilised as we like to make out, and Christianity's history is positively appalling, just like so many other religions. Quote I need another coffee
PocketRocket Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 A beefed-up military would be utterly useless in countering a threat to a domestic target in Canada. I mean how much more beefed-up can a military get than that of the USA??? What did it stop on 9/11??? Not one, but two targets successfully hit. Another near-miss, allegedly averted by the passengers in the plane headed for the White House. All this within a matter of several minutes. Meanwhile, the highly-vaunted US Air Force was doing what??? Nothing useful, because they were unaware that anything was happening until far too late. A beefed-up intelligence is what is needed to counter a domestic threat, and even that would be hit-or-miss depending on how close-mouthed the plotters are. But if the attack took the form of the recent attacks in London, ie; individuals packing explosives in a busy, pedestrian-filled area, then the possibility of prevention drops to near-zero. When you consider the fact that anyone with access to the internet can find recipes for high-impact explosives which can be made from items you can buy at Canadian Tire, then the probability of stopping a determined bomber is very low, and a strong military will play little or no part in preventing such an attack. All that being said, I am still in favor up dramatically increasing our military spending, but not for any of the reasons so far given in this thread. Quote I need another coffee
Army Guy Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 err: If the people with the criminal links and violent records are not Canadian citizens, then ship them off.... However, the situation is much more complicated if they are Canadian citizens... Our current imigration system is so backlogged that it in some cases it takes years to process applications, all the while these persons are roaming our streets. and then trying to deport them after the application is denied is a problem. Once they are made Canadian citizens should not entitle them to a free ride. and if it can be proven that they are linked to terrorists or criminal activity why should they not be deported. It only becomes a problem when they are 2 and generation Canadians. Then they should be punished within our justice system that has tougher laws on this activity. I don't have all the answers, and would never pretend to. However, I don't think we should be promoting racial hatred, profiling, etc... It will only fuel the radicals' cause and recruiting efforts.... I agree, but Racial hatred,profiling is a double edge sword, And it is being used by alot of groups that operate freely within Canada to promote thier cause or causes in thier countries of orgin. One would have to ask them just why they became Canadian citizens in the first place. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
err Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 err:If the people with the criminal links and violent records are not Canadian citizens, then ship them off.... However, the situation is much more complicated if they are Canadian citizens... Our current imigration system is so backlogged that it in some cases it takes years to process applications, all the while these persons are roaming our streets. and then trying to deport them after the application is denied is a problem. Then maybe they should fix the system so that this won't be a problem.Once they are made Canadian citizens should not entitle them to a free ride.and if it can be proven that they are linked to terrorists or criminal activity why should they not be deported. If they have a dual citizenship, sure, but if not, where do you send them ????It only becomes a problem when they are 2 and generation Canadians. Then they should be punished within our justice system that has tougher laws on this activity. Certainly, if they are caught in conspiracy to commit serious crimes, etc.. they should be punished. I have no problems with that at all... Quote
Army Guy Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 err: If they have a dual citizenship, sure, but if not, where do you send them ???? Sorry for not being clear, I was talking about immigrants that have become Canadian citizens, They should be stripped of thier Canadian citizenship and deported back to thier country of orgin. I think the problem here lies in our current laws being to soft in regards to these matters. There are a few cases that i can think of now such as the muslim family in ont who is fighting a court case to have her youngest son released from gitmo, charged with the killing of an american medic. This family has know ties with bin ladin, her husband and oldest son were killed in afgan fighting coalition forces. And yet they remain in Canada . Another case is a muslim Cleric ( out west i think) how has been preaching hatred and has been under investagation for collecting monies for terrorist organizations. He to is still operating in Canada. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Army Guy Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 PocketRocket: A beefed-up military would be utterly useless in countering a threat to a domestic target in Canada. Your right, if there was no advance Intell or warning then yes no amount of conventional western style military forces are going to be able to counter effectivily most terror attacks. How ever Canada is expanding it's JTF unit to assist in Intell gathering, counter measures, etc.etc. I mean how much more beefed-up can a military get than that of the USA???What did it stop on 9/11??? Not one, but two targets successfully hit. Another near-miss, allegedly averted by the passengers in the plane headed for the White House. All this within a matter of several minutes. Meanwhile, the highly-vaunted US Air Force was doing what??? Nothing useful, because they were unaware that anything was happening until far too late. I think your blaming the wrong people for thier inaction, CIA, and FBI are responsable for collecting intell on any attacks. one has to remember that ours and the US's whole workings is based on freedom of movement, goods and services need to be constantily in motion. All that being said, I am still in favor up dramatically increasing our military spending, but not for any of the reasons so far given in this thread Other than wiping out a known terrorist cell that had been discovered. you are right in prevention of terrorist attacks the Conventional military forces are not very effective. But that is not our main mandate to prevent terrorist attacks, that is not why the military needs a drastic cash influx. It's part of it but a small part. Canada's Military main mandate is the defense of Canada and her interests, both home and abroad. Laugh if you will but our current military forces would have a major problem resolving the Hanns Island issue if it came to a military response. And that is within our own borders. It has nothing to do with our quality of soldiers,airmen, or sailors because we have the best, it has everything to do with not having the right equipment or not having enough of it. The military is under going a major overhaul and re-distributing most of it's equipment to save money. most if not all combat units will be stripped of close to 2/3 of it's fighting equipment. So that thier is enough for deployments, to set up training centers and so we can deploy at a moments notice. Does this not send up warning flags to anyone. To assist with search and rescue duties in Canada. This is not a military function, but a coast gaurd one, they two have been cut to the bone, and the military has the equipment so they got the job. However it is one of the reasons we get new equipment. To assist with disaster reponse here in Canada and if possiable abroad. If katrina had landed in Canada vice the states we'd all have been still waiting for rescue. It would have taken every member of our military to cover this disater, however we would lack the equipment to do the job. Don't get me wrong Every person serving this nation is proud to do so, and would not trade it for any other job on the planet, (OK one but Hugh is still in the mansion.) All we want is the tools to do the job, safely,so we can return to our loved ones in tact. To do that we need Canadians to voice thier opinions to thier MP's. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
Argus Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 Just like all Hindus, Jews, Catholics, Protestants, etc. etc. are potential terrorists. Perhaps we should ask them to leave too? I don't think you can logically use this argument. There is no great revolutionary zeal today among other major world religions. This is particularly true of Christianity, which is largely westernised and has acquired the the civility of modern western culture. Well, things in Ireland have quieted down in the past few years, but as little as 20 years ago I would not have wanted to vacation in Belfast. Catholics and Protestants bombing each other, including bombs set off in London. Christians are not so civilised as we like to make out, and Christianity's history is positively appalling, just like so many other religions. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That had nothing to do with religion. It's not like they were killing each other over different interpretations of the bible or anything. They were two different tribes fighting over land and power. And they never got anywhere near as nasty and murderous as the Muslims. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Black Dog Posted October 18, 2005 Report Posted October 18, 2005 Here's a question: in the years since 9-11, of all the hundreds, if not thousands of individuals detained in a heightened climate of fear and suspicion, how many people in the United States have been convicted on terrorism related charges? I'll answer that: according to the Justice Department's own data, 39 people have been convicted of crimes related to terrorism or national security since 2001 (out of several hundred domestic detainees). I point this out only to show that hysteria is a powerful force. We're being buffeted by claims that there are hordes of closet Muslim terrorists just waiting to blow us and themselves to smithereens at the drop of a hat. But if that was the case, surely the numbers would reflect that. They do not. I use American data here for obvious reasons: if the country most likely to be targetted by terrorism, and most active in attempting to prevent it has been unable to find significant evidence of widespread terrorist activity, then the same would likely apply to Canada. I haven't seen anyone make a convincing case that there is a genuine threat to Canada from its citizens of Arab or Muslim descent. Comments like: ... there are probably more than 100 muslim fanatics in each of our major cities. Whether they eventually turn violent depends on circumstances. Just ask the Dutch or Spanish. are merely recipes for a witchhunt. I think the problem here lies in our current laws being to soft in regards to these matters. There are a few cases that i can think of now such as the muslim family in ont who is fighting a court case to have her youngest son released from gitmo, charged with the killing of an american medic. This family has know ties with bin ladin, her husband and oldest son were killed in afgan fighting coalition forces. And yet they remain in Canada . Another case is a muslim Cleric ( out west i think) how has been preaching hatred and has been under investagation for collecting monies for terrorist organizations. He to is still operating in Canada. Has anyone of the above been convicted of a crime that would warrant deportation? If the feds can come up with the evidence to try and convict anyone or other sufficient grounds for deportation, fine. But there's no way we should be shipping people out based solely on their personal beliefs, no matter how repellant they are. Quote
Army Guy Posted October 19, 2005 Report Posted October 19, 2005 Black dog: Here's a question: in the years since 9-11, of all the hundreds, if not thousands of individuals detained in a heightened climate of fear and suspicion, how many people in the United States have been convicted on terrorism related charges?I'll answer that: according to the Justice Department's own data, 39 people have been convicted of crimes related to terrorism or national security since 2001 (out of several hundred domestic detainees). Those are US figures, However i could not find any figures published for Canada. Although your figures match your theory, do they take into account that perhaps the other laws required for conviction are weak, or poor investagation, or that the anti terrorism laws need to more specific. Below is link for terrorism acts here in Canada. terror in Canada I point this out only to show that hysteria is a powerful force. We're being buffeted by claims that there are hordes of closet Muslim terrorists just waiting to blow us and themselves to smithereens at the drop of a hat. But if that was the case, surely the numbers would reflect that. They do not Again i can not explain the low numbers of convictions. but terrorism is alive and well in Canada and there needs to be tougher controls on all terrorism not just terror that is muslim related. I think it is frustrating when there are know cases and the goverment can not do anything or has ongoing investagations such as below. Kadhars Terrorism is alive and well in Canada below is a book that was written on it. book A look at out imigration process immigration Below are numbers that were actually issued permits, read some of the classifations IE : Persons who have been convicted in Canada of a serious offence or for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they have been convicted of a serious offence outside Canada ,606 According to immigration serious offenses are one that a person would serve 10 or more years in jail for. Do we have a problem, i think so. And these are ones we know about. My Webpage See table number 7 at very bottom. Table 7: Permits Issued from January 1 to December 31, 2001, [note 9] to Persons Seeking to Enter Canada, by the Inadmissible Classes of Which Those Persons Were Members [note 10] Section in the Act Explanation Number 19(1)(a) Persons who are medically inadmissible 208 19(1)( Persons who are unable or unwilling to support themselves and their dependants 6 19(1)© Persons who have been convicted in Canada of a serious offence or for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they have been convicted of a serious offence outside Canada 606 19(1)(d) Persons for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they will commit illegal activity 0 19(1)(e) Persons for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they may engage in terrorism, espionage or subversion by force 1 19(1)(f) Persons for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they have engaged in terrorism, espionage or subversion by force 11 19(1)(g) Persons for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they will engage in acts of violence 0 19(1)(h) Persons who are not genuine immigrants or visitors 9 19(1)(i) Persons who need the Minister's consent to enter Canada but who are seeking to enter Canada without such consent 40 19(1)(j) Persons for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they have committed war crimes or crimes against humanity outside Canada 2 19(1)(k) Persons who pose a danger to the security of Canada 0 19(1)(l) Senior officials of a government that engaged in terrorism, human rights violations, war crimes or crimes against humanity 10 19(2)(a) Persons who have been convicted in Canada of a less serious offence or for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they have been convicted outside Canada 1,178 19(2)( Persons who have been convicted anywhere of two or more summary offences or for whom there are reasonable grounds to believe they have been involved in criminal activities 7 19(2)© Accompanying family members of an inadmissible person 21 19(2)(d) Persons who do not fulfil or comply with the conditions or requirements of this Act 1,671 Total 3,770 Has anyone of the above been convicted of a crime that would warrant deportation? If the feds can come up with the evidence to try and convict anyone or other sufficient grounds for deportation, fine. But there's no way we should be shipping people out based solely on their personal beliefs, no matter how repellant they are In the Kadhar case thier is more than just believes that are repellant but they have taken action. openily fighting coalition forces in Afgan, of which Canadian forces are a part of. then coming home to Canada and applying for medi care for injuries recieved in a war zone while fighting for the bad guys. There is something not right here. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
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