ScottSA Posted April 9, 2007 Report Posted April 9, 2007 B.C. should implement carbon taxes penalizing fossil fuel use in all guises to meet its targets for greenhouse gas reduction, say two retired senior provincial civil servants.[snip] The recommendations come as prices for regular gasoline hit $1.20 a litre in Greater Vancouver. http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/st...533f8c8&k=78513 I expect that the granola gang will immediately howl that we NEED to make sacrifices etc, in the usual kneejerk reaction we've all become accustomed to, but I'll hazard a guess that as soon as the economic impact of said sacrifices begins to hit home with them, the story will change from the need to make sacrifices to: bad fiscal management by [insert evil conservative politician of choice] has done this. I sometimes think the entire granola gang should be taken to the third world, at government expense, to spend 6 months living in a third world hovel to see for themselves just how tittilatingly romantic the peasant life they long for actually is in real life. I expect it would save a lot more than it would cost in the long run. Evil capitalism and its resultant leaps in technology are solely...not partly, but solely...responsible for the standard of living we enjoy today. As always, it will also be the way we end up reducing pollution; a trend that began in the 70s and is continuing today irrespective of anything the UN says or does. Quote
Catchme Posted April 9, 2007 Report Posted April 9, 2007 Why another environmental thread, are the other ones not going the way you want them to? Quote When the rich wage war, it's the poor who die. ~Jean-Paul Sartre
ScottSA Posted April 9, 2007 Author Report Posted April 9, 2007 Why another environmental thread, are the other ones not going the way you want them to? Um, because this is a separate issue? And btw, just because you are vociferously pushing the panic button in other threads hardly means they are going any way. Do you have anything to say about this or is this just a driveby snipe? Quote
Canadian Blue Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 Mother nature, the ultimate enemy of mankind, she must be destroyed at all costs. Quote "Keep your government hands off my medicare!" - GOP activist
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 cleaning the environment is not a cost but a money making opportunity --- the luddites who are trying to stop the march of progress have hounded and hurt mankinds progress from the beginning, it seems, only the talking points change no, men were not given wings by god; but, by god, we still fly what do they now claim? if god wanted us to live on earth he would have given us brains? Well, maybe he would have given brains to everybody and not just, "the granola gang" Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
ScottSA Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Posted April 10, 2007 cleaning the environment is not a cost but a money making opportunity --- the luddites who are trying to stop the march of progress have hounded and hurt mankinds progress from the beginning, it seems, only the talking points change no, men were not given wings by god; but, by god, we still fly what do they now claim? if god wanted us to live on earth he would have given us brains? Well, maybe he would have given brains to everybody and not just, "the granola gang" Woody, you really ought to learn the meaning of the term Luddite. Luddites didn't likr machinery. You don't like machinery. I like machinery. You're a Luddite. I'm not. If you want to denigrate everyone who refuses to see the New TRVTH, find a different term to use, lest you continue to play the ass. Quote
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 You, apparently, don't know the meanings of, 'Luddite.' Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
ScottSA Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Posted April 10, 2007 You, apparently, don't know the meanings of, 'Luddite.' Then please educate me woody. Tell me where you think the term came from. Who were the Luddites and what did they do? I'm all ears. Quote
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 You, apparently, don't know the meanings of, 'Luddite.' Then please educate me woody. Tell me where you think the term came from. Who were the Luddites and what did they do? I'm all ears. No, your mostly ars**ole. Luddites are fools, like you, who attempt to stop technological progress for fear it will hurt them. Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
ScottSA Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Posted April 10, 2007 You, apparently, don't know the meanings of, 'Luddite.' Then please educate me woody. Tell me where you think the term came from. Who were the Luddites and what did they do? I'm all ears. No, your mostly ars**ole. Luddites are fools, like you, who attempt to stop technological progress for fear it will hurt them. Well, that's kind of true in an historical sort of way, but I don't see anyone trying to stop technological progress except the folks whop want to shut down factories in favor of hemp sandals and communal living. I don't see me or anyone else on this side of the debate saying we should halt technological progress, do you? Oh, and be careful or figleaf will report you for pottymouth. Quote
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 You, apparently, don't know the meanings of, 'Luddite.' Then please educate me woody. Tell me where you think the term came from. Who were the Luddites and what did they do? I'm all ears. No, your mostly ars**ole. Luddites are fools, like you, who attempt to stop technological progress for fear it will hurt them. Well, that's kind of true in an historical sort of way, but I don't see anyone trying to stop technological progress except the folks whop want to shut down factories in favor of hemp sandals and communal living. I don't see me or anyone else on this side of the debate saying we should halt technological progress, do you? Oh, and be careful or figleaf will report you for pottymouth. you don't see because you're blind --- the future technology will be, by necessity, found in sustainable energy, delaying the onset of the new paradigm currently presents a horrendous cost and luddite fools, like you, are doing everything you can to prevent the technological progress that comes to our aid Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
ScottSA Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Posted April 10, 2007 you don't see because you're blind --- the future technology will be, by necessity, found in sustainable energy, delaying the onset of the new paradigm currently presents a horrendous cost and luddite fools, like you, are doing everything you can to prevent the technological progress that comes to our aid But that's just not true. You just made it up. I'm all for technological progress; it's just that I realize that technological progress isn't going to come along by shutting done industry and wearing hemp sandals. Can you point to one instance of me claiming I'm against technological progress? Here or on any other BB? Just one instance? If not, it would behoove you to stfu and go back to arguing that there are more american and british nazis than german nazis. Quote
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 you don't see because you're blind --- the future technology will be, by necessity, found in sustainable energy, delaying the onset of the new paradigm currently presents a horrendous cost and luddite fools, like you, are doing everything you can to prevent the technological progress that comes to our aid But that's just not true. You just made it up. I'm all for technological progress; it's just that I realize that technological progress isn't going to come along by shutting done industry and wearing hemp sandals. Can you point to one instance of me claiming I'm against technological progress? Here or on any other BB? Just one instance? If not, it would behoove you to stfu and go back to arguing that there are more american and british nazis than german nazis. No, I made up nothing. Fools who can't see the future are not the ones who will prosper from cleaning up the environment but that's their loss. Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
M.Dancer Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 No, I made up nothing. Fools who can't see the future are not the ones who will prosper from cleaning up the environment but that's their loss. Which brings me to me thesis statement that the exteme wingnut left know perfectly how to redistribute other peoples capital but bugger all about how to create it. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
M.Dancer Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 Want to be an ecological edison? Come up with a car that cost less to run on X fuel than gasoline ...then the world will beat a path to your doorstep....otherwise the only way you will creat a market is to have it legislated Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 Want to be an ecological edison? Come up with a car that cost less to run on X fuel than gasoline ...then the world will beat a path to your doorstep....otherwise the only way you will creat a market is to have it legislated We have it right now. We just need to adjust the government corporate welfare and we can pick among fuels - electric car can be cheaper to own and run than gas powered. So can biodiesel or propane. Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
ScottSA Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Posted April 10, 2007 you don't see because you're blind --- the future technology will be, by necessity, found in sustainable energy, delaying the onset of the new paradigm currently presents a horrendous cost and luddite fools, like you, are doing everything you can to prevent the technological progress that comes to our aid But that's just not true. You just made it up. I'm all for technological progress; it's just that I realize that technological progress isn't going to come along by shutting done industry and wearing hemp sandals. Can you point to one instance of me claiming I'm against technological progress? Here or on any other BB? Just one instance? If not, it would behoove you to stfu and go back to arguing that there are more american and british nazis than german nazis. No, I made up nothing. Fools who can't see the future are not the ones who will prosper from cleaning up the environment but that's their loss. But that's not what you said. You said I and everyone like me is against technological innovation. That's not true Woody. It's slander. Watch out for Figleaf. Technology is not some kind of Lukacsian dream, wherein you simply imagine it and it will become reality at a speed determined by how much money you throw at it, it is something that progresses slowly and builds upon itself. To simply announce that we're going to pull the plug on oil and build lots of windmills is not "pro-technology"; it's stupid and it's Luddite. Quote
Martin Chriton Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 cleaning the environment is not a cost but a money making opportunity --- the luddites who are trying to stop the march of progress have hounded and hurt mankinds progress from the beginning, it seems, only the talking points change It all depends how you do it. You need to plan long term. Technological advances take time. Decreasing the standard of living in the short term to meet some arbitrary target won't speed up the process. Quote
geoffrey Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 ... electric car can be cheaper to own and run than gas powered. Outside of Quebec, most electricity is coal generated. Do you want everyone powering their cars with coal? Do you realise what your saying? The transmission and generation infrastructure isn't there for everyone to plug in their cars at night. And the GHG emissions would likely be higher than in a gasoline engine due to line loss and a myraid of other factors. Poor concept. These 'green' ideas tend to be short sighted ecological disasters. Quote RealRisk.ca - (Latest Post: Prosecutors have no "Skin in the Game") --
M.Dancer Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 We have it right now. We just need to adjust the government corporate welfare and we can pick among fuels - electric car can be cheaper to own and run than gas powered. So can biodiesel or propane. Ifg that was anywhere near true, it would be happening right now....you know the adage, build a better mouse trap and the world will....... So I think what we have here is another one of your ridiculous off the cuffs statements that have no bearing on reality. ...Unless of course you are up to the task of finding a dealer of electric cars who right now, as you say, has a product that is cheaper to own, if not run. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
B. Max Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 We have it right now. We just need to adjust the government corporate welfare and we can pick among fuels - electric car can be cheaper to own and run than gas powered. So can biodiesel or propane. Electric cars are really nothing more than glorified golf carts. That's the only reason they might be cheaper. From a practical stand point they're not worth a damn. Quote
Guthrie Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 We have it right now. We just need to adjust the government corporate welfare and we can pick among fuels - electric car can be cheaper to own and run than gas powered. So can biodiesel or propane. Electric cars are really nothing more than glorified golf carts. That's the only reason they might be cheaper. From a practical stand point they're not worth a damn. http://www.teslamotors.com/index.php?js_enabled=1 time for you to wake up to reality Quote “Most middle-class whites have no idea what it feels like to be subjected to police who are routinely suspicious, rude, belligerent, and brutal” - Benjamin Spock MD
M.Dancer Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 http://www.teslamotors.com/index.php?js_enabled=1time for you to wake up to reality At $93,000 USD they won't be going ...ahem....fast Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
M.Dancer Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 Electric cars are really nothing more than glorified golf carts. That's the only reason they might be cheaper. From a practical stand point they're not worth a damn. Electric cars are not cheaper. If they were, you would see more of them. Even Hybrids which arfe selling well, are a premium. The ecological footprint seems attractive until you deal with disposing of them...... Woody's example will set you back over $105,000 CND before tax...... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
B. Max Posted April 10, 2007 Report Posted April 10, 2007 time for you to wake up to reality I'll add expensive snake oil to my original comment. Two hundred and fifty miles to the charge. I'm going to assume that's not driving it at night or with the heater or air conditioning running. How far does it go then. Even if it those items weren't running it would take 8 hours of charging on the way, just to drive it one way to Vancouver. Quote
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